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Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 25, 2017 1:30 pm
by jerryprague
Hi,

Looking to upgrade five year old 36V silver fish battery on my first ebike.

I was wondering if anyone had any reliable vendors they know of on aliexpress that they could recommend? I saw one vendor that has a 36V 20AH silver fish pack, with Panasonic batteries, for about 430 bucks, free shipping and free customs to Europe where I live now.

Looking at this one, not sure if too good to be true - 488 bucks for 25AH 36V no customs fees free fedex shipping Sanyo 3500 A grade battery they claim

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Europe- ... 6c1e8262c8

I am a bit wary that what they advertise in reality is what they deliver, especially since a return is from a practical point of view very risky on many levels.
I've had alot of good transactions on aliexpress, but am afraid of a crap shoot here, and appreciate any advice. I searched all over for an answer on our forums and on the internet but nothing I can really sink my teeth into. I can't order from the states as the cost would be really prohibitive with shipping and duties.

Thanks much mates! :)

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 25, 2017 5:02 pm
by 999zip999
I saw red wrap cells. I didn't see any writing on this cells saying sanyo ga 3500. Plus 7x 3,500= 24.5 a little short of 25ah. With bms 23ah.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 25, 2017 5:50 pm
by rojitor
I always check votes when I use aliexpress. The customs free is a great plus. I never got a battery from aliexpress because of the extremely high custom duties in my country. Just see different options and look carefully the votes and you will be fine.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 25, 2017 8:22 pm
by 999zip999
Just saying what cells inside.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 25, 2017 8:30 pm
by Hillhater
A vendor cannot tell if it will be customs free, only the local customs authority can do that when they asses the shipment.
Some vendors may make false documentation to decieve the customs, but if that is detected, you loose the shipment.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 12:04 am
by Steu851
If they say "custom free in EU" usually is because battery is already in EU

Sent usingTapatalk

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 12:34 am
by TheBeastie
Ask dogman, hes an expert on reliable aliexpress battery packs, the whole point of selling via aliexpress is to deny responsibility of something goes wrong.
Not even the mightiest western insurance group is going to gouge any money out of these aliexpress sellers even if they had evidence as solid as a team of NASA battery pack experts looking at it.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 5:36 am
by dogman dan
Well, my bargain battery from an ali express vendor was a great deal. Only 400 bucks delivered, and it worked great for a year and a half.

Then it burned my house,
P2110075.JPG
The insurance company was bummed they had nobody they could sue. K-Battery vanished after selling for 6 months.

Ok, that's unusual, even for the cheap packs. Usually they just die on you early. Mine did, but in a spectacular way.

hold out for quality cells inside, which unless you pay a lot from a reputable vendor, could just be counterfeits anyway.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 2:11 pm
by jerryprague
dogman dan wrote:Well, my bargain battery from an ali express vendor was a great deal. Only 400 bucks delivered, and it worked great for a year and a half.

Then it burned my house,
P2110075.JPG
The insurance company was bummed they had nobody they could sue. K-Battery vanished after selling for 6 months.

Ok, that's unusual, even for the cheap packs. Usually they just die on you early. Mine did, but in a spectacular way.

hold out for quality cells inside, which unless you pay a lot from a reputable vendor, could just be counterfeits anyway.
OH MY GOD!!!

Dogman, I can't believe it, you could not either I imagine.

The battery that came with my bike (used, Guewer brand, from Taiwan) is a Chinese brand, I mean mostly all ebike batteries sold here in Europe come from China, and honestly how many can manufacturers can there be, just a handful and likely Ali vendors are white labelling batteries that are used in most bikes here. I mean, does that make logical sense?

I looked at a few of the highly recommended sites in the USA and could not find silver fish models like my bike uses. The ones that were not silver fish were really expensive and with shipping prohibitive. Maybe I picked the wrong sport and should stick to safer motorcycling. I don't know any that burnt a house down....

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 2:18 pm
by jerryprague
This is the one I am most seriously considering at the moment

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Europe- ... 80317.html

There was one buyer that said it was good, and uploaded a picture of it on a fancy battery meter (you guys know it's name, I am new to the battery build community), and he said it was genuine. User was not from China but from the USA, that kind of tipped it for me positively.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 3:09 pm
by 999zip999
Sorry Dogman I to had a battery fire from used returned makita packs. That caught fire. Very bad as after the fire you have looters. I'm looking at batteries now. But wouldn't be limited to a silverfish just my large triangle.
By the price of that kit they couldbe using real cells. Thats with shipping ? How about a local bike shop that sells your style bike ? If that guy is E.S. maybe he could open up to see the cells label ? That's a good clue.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 26, 2017 4:46 pm
by jerryprague
999zip999 wrote:Sorry Dogman I to had a battery fire from used returned makita packs. That caught fire. Very bad as after the fire you have looters. I'm looking at batteries now. But wouldn't be limited to a silverfish just my large triangle.
By the price of that kit they couldbe using real cells. Thats with shipping ? How about a local bike shop that sells your style bike ? If that guy is E.S. maybe he could open up to see the cells label ? That's a good clue.
Yeah, it's with shipping-the kicker was that one fellow American hooked it up the what I recognize to be the official battery checker and posted a picture of it. Also he bought it, and a few other bike related items at the same time, end of March, beginning of spring. Aliexpress is notorious for pumping in fake feedbacks, but if this one is fake, this vendor should be working for the Russian hacking division.... :lol:

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 27, 2017 7:25 am
by dogman dan
Shipping is the bitch when buying batteries. FWIW, that cheap battery I got was supposed to be certified to ship, then when it arrived, it was labeled "power supply' not lithium battery, hazmat, etc. They lied, shipped illegally, and then vanished. Not that I'd care about that much if my battery had not caught fire.

How many battery companies in China? many thousands, plus the six months vendors that crows ali and ebay.

just saying, 400 bucks shipped means they used the really cheap cells.

But fact is,, I just got to be the "lucky " one. Very seldom does the cheap pack burn. A few others here on the sphere have had it happen, but its far less common than the pack simply performs like a cheap piece of shit.

Next battery I buy though, it will be from a legit vendor. and I'll pay at least $800 for the same size.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 27, 2017 12:50 pm
by 999zip999
I'm looking for a new battery and having a hard time. As now I have A123 and 1,011 cycles it works great at 85amps and looking for something as good as that what I compare to. So this makes it very hard. Hard to match my sweetheart even though she's a little big and overweight. But always has been.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 27, 2017 11:31 pm
by tomjasz
There are legitimate suppliers. Just poke around and ask. Because someone bought a cheap pack anf it ended in tragedy doesn't make all vendors bad. As to law suits, none of the builders will be held responsible. Every reseller buys from someone on Alexpress. The trick is finding out who.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 28, 2017 6:52 am
by dogman dan
Yes there are legit suppliers. But not at those ali express prices.

The problem is coughing up the cash for a legit pack, not finding them. Grin Technology for example. Or the guys I work for. (This is for the US or Canada markets) Part of that extra cost is they carry product liability insurance. The ali express extra cheap guy just hides in china. New name every six months or so.

FWIW,, the legit pack may have an infinitesimal difference in the chances of burning your house down vs the cheap pack. The cheap pack usually just performs lame, and stops working early. Really pretty damn rare that a bms protected 18650 pack actually catches fire.

The real reason to buy a legit pack, is to get legit, better cells inside, which again, won't be at bargain price. The best cells in your pack from EM3ev in china for example, won't be at ali express no name cell prices. Get the good stuff, and it won't sag as much, and should last 3-4 years, vs sags from day one and lasts 2 years or less.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 28, 2017 11:20 am
by DVDRW
I only trust e-bike battery packs that i made myself.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 29, 2017 1:31 pm
by tomjasz
dogman dan wrote:Yes there are legit suppliers. But not at those ali express prices.
Since we're not talking about what those prices are, it's difficult to engage. BUT there are good Aliexpress sellers. There's a good chance several are the same source your employer buys from. THAT is the tough one to sort out. Look I'm not defending the thieves on Aliexpress. I am saying, there are decent fellows selling there, and you are painting with a pretty broad brush. I recently learned that one such maker sells to several other China resellers. The hard part is sorting who those good guys are. I'm not going to shill for them but some basic searching here and on ES Facebook will sort a couple.

Those who live in fear of "China cells" are off track as well. Some "brand name" cells are produced there and one China brand is so reliable and in demand that their price point is higher than the brands extolled on ES. So while our fears are generally with merit, I think they're to broad.

The prices can be 10% to 20% below the USA discounters. The biggest problem is warranty. I have the folks I use sell me a replacement BMS WITH the pack I buy. Usually around $12-$16. Several USA suppliers will also send a new BMS. The biggest warranty problem is shipping. But the number of fails is really quite low when we consider the actual numbers sold. Unfortunately the loudest noises here come from the relatively rare failures. Which leads me to why I despise vendor complaints. Shit happens. It happens to the best resellers.

I hope to see folks like EM3ev expand their choices. I have my original battery from them that has been well cared for and is almost as new after 3 years.

The market seems to be catering to the high power crowd. Apparently those of us happy at 36V are dinosaurs.

Thanks for the exchange. My opinions and experience pale in comparison to yours and I mean no disrespect.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 29, 2017 2:17 pm
by tomjasz
Rather than edit...

You can definitely get a battery, especially a 36V at the price the OP quoted. $478.

"Triangle Battery 36V 26AH Electric Bike lithium battery pack 36V 500W Ebike battery with NCR18650 cells and 42v 3A fast charger"

These are NCR18650PF

US EU No Tax Top discharge Silver Fish battery 36V 20Ah Electric Bike battery 500W Li ion battery with 42V 2A charger 20A BMS
Price:
US $414.06 / piece
Cell:Panasonic PF 2900mah cells

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 30, 2017 1:18 pm
by jerryprague
Gentlemen, Thank you so much!

Reason by the way for the 36V is I got the bike used, I really did not research ebikes much, prices for new and ones that are really great quality are well beyond my budget. I'd go above 36V but with a European standard 250j motor, I don't want to tempt fate....

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 30, 2017 3:17 pm
by tomjasz
jerryprague wrote:Gentlemen, Thank you so much!

Reason by the way for the 36V is I got the bike used, I really did not research ebikes much, prices for new and ones that are really great quality are well beyond my budget. I'd go above 36V but with a European standard 250j motor, I don't want to tempt fate....
I have several 36V bikes. I like them and the prices of their batteries!

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: May 30, 2017 6:47 pm
by 999zip999
And two 36v make 72v.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: Jun 01, 2017 8:27 am
by miro13car
reliable and Alixepress in one sentence?
I dont believe.

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: Jun 01, 2017 1:24 pm
by jerryprague
Off topic but I will mention this about Ali Express. They have a very bad process if you want to add a credit card on the fly.

I tried to buy one battery pack last week, cost was over 500 dollars, I made the charge on a card I had not used before, with my name and address which they have on record. They accepted the payment but then they immediately closed the order and did not allow it to go through until I sent verification of identity, address, etc. That was OK with them, however they still did not reopen the order, and I am in limbo now with them and the bank until hopefully it comes back to the bank. :oops:

Re: Reliable aliexpress battery pack?

Posted: Jun 01, 2017 2:03 pm
by rojitor
I did some expensive purchases at aliexpress. Don't worry you will solve the card problem.