Tesla Model 3

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Arlo1   100 GW

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 05 2018 4:33pm

markz wrote:
Oct 05 2018 4:08am
Chalo wrote:
Oct 03 2018 4:58pm
billvon wrote:
Oct 03 2018 3:38pm
I even still have a chart printed in 2001 that shows all the estimates of when we'd hit peak oil (somewhere between 2005 and 2025.) Then tight oil (a technological solution) came along, and suddenly we had more recoverable oil. Technology often solves problems that everyone assumes are insoluble.
That wasn't a solution; it was a stopgap measure that made the problem worse and harder to solve.
Bill Nye the Engineer and Science Guy teams up with Neil D. Tyson and claims we will never run out of oil. Star Talk radio.
The much harder to solve problem is the co2 in the atmosphere and oceans.
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by markz » Oct 05 2018 6:59pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 05 2018 4:33pm
The much harder to solve problem is the co2 in the atmosphere and oceans.
Well the scenario went like this.

BN - There is in infinite supply of oil on Earth.
NDT - No there is not, there is a finite amount.
BN - Agrees but says, something like we are good for a long long long time. "In our lifetime"

Of course they are like in their late 50's early 60's.

Another point to mention is that NDT talks a lot of how much easier it is to solve Terra's problem then colonizing Mārs.
Basically if you binge watch NDT, he repeats himself over and over and over again.

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 06 2018 12:30am

markz wrote:
Oct 05 2018 6:59pm
Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 05 2018 4:33pm
The much harder to solve problem is the co2 in the atmosphere and oceans.
Well the scenario went like this.

BN - There is in infinite supply of oil on Earth.
NDT - No there is not, there is a finite amount.
BN - Agrees but says, something like we are good for a long long long time. "In our lifetime"

Of course they are like in their late 50's early 60's.

Another point to mention is that NDT talks a lot of how much easier it is to solve Terra's problem then colonizing Mārs.
Basically if you binge watch NDT, he repeats himself over and over and over again.
Yeah I think I agree with all of that. But that's not the only reason to make humans a multi planet species. What happens when a big meteorite or something else wipes out all the humans on earth? Also what about traveling to the edge and beyond our solar system... If we are ever going to think about real space travel we need to get working on it and get some data from shorter trips first. I think a moon base and a mars colony are both a must! But the topic I was pointing out is yes we have lots of oil its LOTs and LOTs and we would never run out because we will die from the poisen and climate change that comes from burning it before we can burn it all!
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RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by markz » Oct 06 2018 11:59am

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 06 2018 12:30am
Yeah I think I agree with all of that. But that's not the only reason to make humans a multi planet species. What happens when a big meteorite or something else wipes out all the humans on earth?

Also what about traveling to the edge and beyond our solar system... If we are ever going to think about real space travel we need to get working on it and get some data from shorter trips first.

I think a moon base and a mars colony are both a must!

But the topic I was pointing out is yes we have lots of oil its LOTs and LOTs and we would never run out because we will die from the poisen and climate change that comes from burning it before we can burn it all!
Totally off topic, I'd assume. But Neil has an answer to all of that. Asteroid, easier to deflect. Multi-planet, perhaps, but Neil says the only reason usa went to the moon was because of russia's sputnik, a warhead used to get to "space". Cost prohibitive, who do you select, travel time. edge of system, maybe 1000yrs or 500yrs. I say moon too, perhaps a telescope, mining. Neil says the next trillionaire will be the one who can mine space. Last point, climate change. Easier to heal the planet then Mars.

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 06 2018 2:50pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 06 2018 12:30am
Yeah I think I agree with all of that. But that's not the only reason to make humans a multi planet species. What happens when a big meteorite or something else wipes out all the humans on earth?
I am all for exploring and colonizing other planets. BUT - when you talk about survival of the human race, it is much much much easier to survive on Earth after a big meteor impact than on any other planet.

Global winter that destroys all our crops and causes an ice age? Earth is still warmer, has less radiation and has far more resources than Mars.

Runaway climate change? Again, Earth will be more hospitable than any other planet in our solar system.
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 06 2018 11:23pm

Guys its easy to say we can solve for the things we see coming.

But what happens when something comes that we don't see coming. Its the all your eggs in 1 basket attitude. If some of them are on another planet then the human race has a better chance.

Oh and as for solving for things like Climate change how are we doing with that? Oh yeah we can't even agree its real as its already killing us off.
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Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by TheBeastie » Oct 14 2018 11:41pm

I see a constant flow of this kind of stuff as I guess social media finds them entertaining.
Twitter and Facebook are just riddled with videos of people showing scary flaws in their Tesla's
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 14 2018 11:48pm

TheBeastie wrote:
Oct 14 2018 11:41pm
I see a constant flow of this kind of stuff as I guess social media finds them entertaining.
Twitter and Facebook are just riddled with videos of people showing scary flaws in their Tesla's
Yep. And flaws in their Toyotas, and Fords, and Hondas.
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 14 2018 11:51pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 06 2018 11:23pm
But what happens when something comes that we don't see coming. Its the all your eggs in 1 basket attitude. If some of them are on another planet then the human race has a better chance.
I don't really buy that. About the only thing that being on another planet would help us with would be a collision between the Earth and something that pulverizes it completely. And since we've been here about 4 billion years without that happening, odds of it happening in another 4000 are pretty low.

If your goal is to give humanity a better chance, investing in things like population control, mitigation of climate change and research into disease is a much better use of that money.

(Not to say that space exploration isn't good in many other ways.)
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 15 2018 10:25am

billvon wrote:
Oct 14 2018 11:51pm
Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 06 2018 11:23pm
But what happens when something comes that we don't see coming. Its the all your eggs in 1 basket attitude. If some of them are on another planet then the human race has a better chance.
I don't really buy that. About the only thing that being on another planet would help us with would be a collision between the Earth and something that pulverizes it completely. And since we've been here about 4 billion years without that happening, odds of it happening in another 4000 are pretty low.

If your goal is to give humanity a better chance, investing in things like population control, mitigation of climate change and research into disease is a much better use of that money.

(Not to say that space exploration isn't good in many other ways.)
Humans have not been here for 4 billion years.

There would be a lot of things to wipe us out. You are thinking small potatoes....
What about something that kills 90% of us on impact and makes it impossible to grow food so the other 10% die from starvation?

There is an infinite number of possibility than CAN happen. To many people think like you and can't accept they don't know what will happen then when it comes it totally blind sides you guys.
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RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
Support me on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/user/posts?u=6842045
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 15 2018 10:56am

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 15 2018 10:25am
Humans have not been here for 4 billion years.
Right. But the planet has been.
There would be a lot of things to wipe us out. You are thinking small potatoes....
What about something that kills 90% of us on impact and makes it impossible to grow food so the other 10% die from starvation?
If that happens, then any place on Earth will still be far, far, far more habitable than Mars.

Ask yourself this. If a meteor hits your home and destroys it - but you escape in time - would you rather be on Mars or Earth?
There is an infinite number of possibility than CAN happen. To many people think like you and can't accept they don't know what will happen then when it comes it totally blind sides you guys.
Uh huh.

Fast forward 50 years. We have bases on the Moon and Mars. Then a passing black hole tweaks the sun and increases its output by a factor of 25 for a decade or so. In the few minutes before you fry on Mars, you think "gee, and to think I thought I knew how to save humanity . . ."

We should plan for (and work to prevent) the likely disasters, not the unlikely ones.
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 15 2018 10:37pm

billvon wrote:
Oct 15 2018 10:56am
Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 15 2018 10:25am
Humans have not been here for 4 billion years.
Right. But the planet has been. Yes but all the major living creatures have been wiped out a few times.... I'm not worried about the earth it's survival of the human race that will be the challenge.
There would be a lot of things to wipe us out. You are thinking small potatoes....
What about something that kills 90% of us on impact and makes it impossible to grow food so the other 10% die from starvation?
If that happens, then any place on Earth will still be far, far, far more habitable than Mars.

Ask yourself this. If a meteor hits your home and destroys it - but you escape in time - would you rather be on Mars or Earth?
There is an infinite number of possibility than CAN happen. To many people think like you and can't accept they don't know what will happen then when it comes it totally blind sides you guys.
If it's a big enough meteor then mars for sure.
My Leaf motor controller build. http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 27#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
Support me on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/user/posts?u=6842045
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by jonescg » Oct 15 2018 10:42pm

Awesome, it was about time someone properly derailed this thread :lol:

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 15 2018 11:09pm

jonescg wrote:
Oct 15 2018 10:42pm
Awesome, it was about time someone properly derailed this thread :lol:
Lol yup. Tesla has been busy knocking it out of the park so the Trolls don't have a lot to feed off of right now..
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RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
Support me on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/user/posts?u=6842045
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 15 2018 11:24pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 15 2018 10:37pm
If it's a big enough meteor then mars for sure.
Really? You'd rather die instantly?

Not much hope for humanity, then.
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 15 2018 11:25pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 15 2018 11:09pm
Lol yup. Tesla has been busy knocking it out of the park so the Trolls don't have a lot to feed off of right now..
Give em a week or so. Someone will get the wrong color Tesla and they'll be back - "oh, I guess Tesla can't even get the COLOR right! They are the worst car company ever."
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 16 2018 12:12am

billvon wrote:
Oct 15 2018 11:24pm
Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 15 2018 10:37pm
If it's a big enough meteor then mars for sure.
Really? You'd rather die instantly?

Not much hope for humanity, then.
Haha Trick question.

I was amusing I was living in a space camp on mars. And my home here on earth was destroyed.
What the goal is to have 2 or more planets with humans on them and if one gets wiped out the other will survive.
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My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
Support me on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/user/posts?u=6842045
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 16 2018 10:52am

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 16 2018 12:12am
I was amusing I was living in a space camp on mars. And my home here on earth was destroyed.
Right. If your home on Mars was destroyed, you are dead instantly. If your home on Earth is destroyed, you would have to move.

Let's take a realistic worst-case. A dinosaur killer scale meteor hits the Earth. Tsunamis destroy much of the coasts. Billions die from the impact, the shock wave and the tsunamis. A pall of dust is blasted into the atmosphere that cools the planet (and blocks the Sun) for decades. Oh no! Everyone is going to die! Quick, get to Mars! We can build some high tech habitats and live there!

Except those high tech habitats are a thousand times easier to build right here. No matter what happens to the Earth, there will still be water and air. There will still be dirt and oil and uranium to be found. A self-sufficient undersea habitat, 500 feet deep, is several times easier to build than a similar Martian habitat. As is a mountaintop habitat, or a habitat in a deep mine, or under a mountain.

So if your goal is for humanity to survive anything Nature can throw at us, your best bet is to build 1000 of those habitats for the cost of a single habitat on Mars.

All that being said, there is still tremendous value in exploring space, and that should be a high priority for us. Not for "species preservation" or anything, but for what we will discover, learn and create.
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 16 2018 11:31am

You keep bringing up single scenereos that you have confidence humans can overcome here.

While forgetting the goal is to have self sufficient humans on another planet. The chance what's left of the humans will be able to rebuild after something really bad happening is impossible to predict because you don't know the extent of the damage to the planet.
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RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 16 2018 11:32am

As well once we tackle mars then traveling out further will become more realistic.
My Leaf motor controller build. http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 27#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
Support me on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/user/posts?u=6842045
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 16 2018 11:39am

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 16 2018 11:32am
As well once we tackle mars then traveling out further will become more realistic.
Right. And once we tackle even the Moon, then the technology to transport people and material safely develops a lot more rapidly. There are all kinds of benefits for space exploration.
You keep bringing up single scenereos that you have confidence humans can overcome here.
Well, specifically I brought up the worst event in the past 100 million years, which seems like a good "worst case" scenario.
While forgetting the goal is to have self sufficient humans on another planet.
Right. And I am saying for the next 50 years or so, it will be much easier for humans to be self sufficient here than anywhere else - even in that worst case scenario.
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Arlo1 » Oct 16 2018 5:59pm

billvon wrote:
Oct 16 2018 11:39am
Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 16 2018 11:32am
As well once we tackle mars then traveling out further will become more realistic.
Right. And once we tackle even the Moon, then the technology to transport people and material safely develops a lot more rapidly. There are all kinds of benefits for space exploration.


Right. And I am saying for the next 50 years or so, it will be much easier for humans to be self sufficient here than anywhere else - even in that worst case scenario.
Are you one of "those people" who don't think we made it to the moon yet, or are you just saying a moon base would be wise?

It will take a few years to make mars work and I would say about 50 years until its at a point its got a population of above 100 people.
My Leaf motor controller build. http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 27#p963227
My YSR build http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRo8r5g4NBg
RC and most types of Lithium batteries you MUST know your individual cell voltages charging and discharging.
Don't keep them were you cant afford smoke or fire!
Never above 4.2v never below 2.7v EVER!!!
Support me on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/user/posts?u=6842045
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by billvon » Oct 16 2018 6:50pm

Arlo1 wrote:
Oct 16 2018 5:59pm
Are you one of "those people" who don't think we made it to the moon yet, or are you just saying a moon base would be wise?
Just saying a moon base would be a good idea - provided we have a mission objective for it. (i.e. a radiotelescope on the far side, or a mine for fuel for orbital operations.)
It will take a few years to make mars work and I would say about 50 years until its at a point its got a population of above 100 people.
Probably. And probably ~100 years before it is truly self sufficient.
--bill von

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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by Hillhater » Oct 17 2018 6:47pm

billvon wrote:
Oct 16 2018 6:50pm
......And probably ~100 years before it is truly self sufficient.
But likely much longer..
There are still large areas of this planet where it is not possible to have self sufficient communities,...even with a breathable atmosphere, human tolerant temperatures, radiation levels, etc etc.
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Re: Tesla Model 3

Post by geckocycles » Oct 19 2018 7:41am

Sadly we canceled our model 3 order. We waited for 2 years to get our $38000 car. Then our number finally came up and it was going to cost us close to $60000 if you really wanted to drive it.The tesla was going to cost us $760/mo with $10K down. We got our $1000 back in 2 days! Sad that we waited for 2 years and put up with all the delays for nothing.
We leased the I3 4 years ago but after we moved found that it didn't have the range needed anymore, so it sat for a year and was turned in with only 7000 miles on it.
They put in a charge station at my wifes work so now the I3 was being considered again. We bought a used BMW certified one with 11000 miles on it for $17300 with extended warranty.

For me the Tesla was more practical for lots of reasons but the final hidden costs were not.

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