Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

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cooljaysquat   10 mW

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Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by cooljaysquat » Jul 20 2012 8:45pm

I have an Electric Wheel 400 bike (EW-400) http://high5scooters.com/productinfo/ew400.htm. I am upgrading my electric bike and I removed the stock controller and connected my stock 36v lithium battery in series to another 51.8v lithium battery http://www.batteryspace.com/highpowerpo ... nrate.aspx with Lyen’s 18 FET 4115 MOSFET 84-132V Real Highway Speed Controller. In addition, I bought 100v diodes to place in series of the batteries. I also connected headlights, taillights, & horn running through a 12v converter in the series as well. In addition, have a Cycle Analyst running with the set up that reads 99v is in the series. I connected everything and it ran for about 30 ft and the power cut off. I sent back my aftermarket controller to Lyen and got it fixed. I’m afraid that I don’t have something connected correctly in series. I don’t want to connect the controller and have the same problem of not working again. I’m afraid the controller might burn out again since I didn’t change anything on my bike battery series. Would you please assist me in my electric bicycle battery and controller setup? Do I plug it in and hope it works and nothing else goes wrong? Please HELP!
Last edited by cooljaysquat on Jul 21 2012 6:40pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bluefang   10 kW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by Bluefang » Jul 21 2012 12:21am

Did lyen ever say something was actually wrong with the controller, any number of things could have caused the bike to stop. Could be the LVC was set too low and under acceleration with the batteries sagging it could have tripped out. You could also have a wire loose in a connector. Lyens controllers have a pretty good track record of been reliable and he also has a pretty good response time on questions normally. When it failed the first time did it start and stop few times before it completely stopped or did it just shut off? Check all your connectors to make sure that all the wires and pushed into the connectors completely.

FYI your motor is probably going to die very very fast if your using that controller....its way to small unless your limiting the current on the controller or you have changed the rear wheel to a 20" wheel
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Sacman   10 kW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by Sacman » Jul 21 2012 12:52am

My thoughts exactly with regards to the motor... it's way too small for that controller and it's only rated at 300watts. That controller can easily dump 4,000+ watts into that motor and burn it up pretty quickly. I strongly recommend you get a larger and more appropriate motor to handle that controller's output.

When you said your bike ran for 30ft and then quit, how do you know the problem was in the controller and to send it back to Lyen? Is your CA a Direct Plug-in or Stand Alone type? Because there are no lights telling you the controller is on other than the Cycle Analyst (if it's a Direct Plug-In type connected to the controller).

And how did you go about wiring up the new controller to your old motor? Did you just match wire colors?... or did you have a wiring diagram to follow?... or did you go thru the process of trying the various different combinations of phase wires and hall sensor wires? Did the motor spin smoothly, or roughly, or shudder? The more you can tell us the better we can help you.

BTW Edward Lyen is a pretty standup guy and a fairly respected vendor by many members of this forum. But he runs a small operation that keeps him busy and so it does take time to get a reply from him. Be patient and he should get back to you with some answers.

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Lyen   10 kW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by Lyen » Jul 21 2012 3:47am

Clarified. Thanks! :)
Last edited by Lyen on Jul 21 2012 6:43pm, edited 2 times in total.
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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by dogman dan » Jul 21 2012 7:42am

Well at least he's now here, where we can wast time trying to help him.

What I see so far, is the wrong battery for a hot controller, which, if it was to work, would quickly smoke his motor.

So save the controller for later, it's going to be a good one. But you need to spend a lot of money on better battery, and better motor, before you let er rip with that controller. Then you can crash that cheap piece of shit frame that was never designed for motorcycle like performance.

So back off a bit, gather your money, and then we'll help you build a bike that will actually get into the 40mph club. Starting with a frame that can do that kind of ride.

Edit. Just had a look at the second battery. Pretty inadequate for a racing controller.

Cheapest thing you could do right now though, would be to get a 9 fet from Lyens, have him set it for 15 amps at your target voltage. You will take some time to wind up to speed, but should be well above 30 mph. And it should match your existing batteries for now. The motor may still smoke, but not as quickly, and you can have fun on that frame at 30 mph safely.

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Sacman   10 kW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by Sacman » Jul 21 2012 2:19pm

I did a little research and found that the OP has an older Crystallyte 5304 motor. He mentioned it in his other thread that he posted about a month prior (and that he should have referenced).
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =1&t=40506
cooljaysquat wrote:Ya, I have the Phoenix Racer 5303 that is the 72v...
cooljaysquat wrote:I have nice electric bike the ew-400 http://high5scooters.com/productinfo/ew400.htm which is 36v. I bought 24 FET 4115 MOSFET 84-132V Freeway Speed Controller from Lyen. I bought a 51.8v lithium battery from http://www.batteryspace.com/highpowerpo ... nrate.aspx
My cycle analyst reads it is putting out 100v. I have the 36v in series with that 51.8 lithium battery, and I thought why don't I build a super bike on a 700c rim bike and enter the most powerful bike forum. I seen a posting on the most pwerful e-bike http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... est+e+bike
I thought since I have the the race hub motor I could go crazy and build a sick bike. I am building a 700c bike to be my super bike. Thanks for all the good tips and ideas.
So he's got a motor that's already wound for high RPM but with lower torque off the line. Yet he added another 51.8v in series to his original 36v battery which NEARLY TRIPLES HIS VOLTAGE. Furthermore, he talks about putting that already fast motor onto a taller 700c rim. That motor really belongs in a smaller 20-inch rim, but okay, let's see where he's going with this...

The new 51.8v battery he bought has a BMS capable of only 40A output and I'm pretty sure his older 36v battery is limited to much less current output. So when he puts the 2 battery packs in series he's going to be limited to the output current of the older 36v pack.

So with the high RPM motor and a taller 700c rim and 90+volts there's theoretical possibility he can reach speeds of over 60mph. However, with his battery current severely limited his torque is going to suffer and he'll have sluggish acceleration and poor hill climbing ability. Definitely not the performace of the superbike he said he wanted to make.

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wesnewell   100 GW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by wesnewell » Jul 21 2012 2:47pm

He doesn't have any hills. He lives in Florida. Lyen said the controller had a blown fet. My guess is he had the phase wires wrong and it blew. If he gets the phase wires hooked up right before he loads it with a rider, it should be ok. But I don't think he'll get 60 mph unless he's really small. If he's trying to use the original 300W motor, it'll smoke in no time taking out the motor and possibly the controller again. I can't believe someone would pay $600 for a 10ah 14s lipo pack. My 10ah 24s pack was under $300.
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Drunkskunk   100 GW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by Drunkskunk » Jul 21 2012 3:10pm

I think it's clear that the original poster's problem is the loose nut on the seat.
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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by dnmun » Jul 21 2012 6:04pm

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Last edited by dnmun on Jul 21 2012 11:40pm, edited 1 time in total.

cooljaysquat   10 mW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by cooljaysquat » Jul 21 2012 6:38pm

Wow, a lot a responses. I thought I would run it with this stock hub motor and get a hubzilla if it will work on Lyen's 4115 18FET controller. I do have a racer hub motor but Lyen said that his controller is not a good match. Should I just order a hubzilla now? http://greyborgusa.com/products/motors/hubzilla/

I thought I would use the stock 36v battery until it doesn't work, then get another 51.8v and run it in series with the 51.8v I have now with the hubzilla. Lyen will your controller work with the hubzilla hub motor?

Thanks, Lyen has educated and helped me along to this point. I’m almost there I can taste it! I had Lyen’s wrong email. That is why posted this discussion hoping I could get some help, which I did thanks!

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Lyen   10 kW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by Lyen » Jul 21 2012 6:59pm

Yes, please consult our buddy Zombiess (Jeremy) for the great Hubzilla/Cromotor. He's the Greyborg USA dealer. He has got the exact same controller you have as well which he used for his ebike races. :)

He's the one on the right from the picture below :wink: :
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cooljaysquat   10 mW

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Re: Upgrade ELECTRIC BICYCLE setup?

Post by cooljaysquat » Jul 31 2012 12:01pm

I am going to put 2.25" moped tires on 17" moped rims on the front and rear on my 26" bike. The Shinko tires weight 3½ lbs, and the unmounted diameter is approx. 21¼". I was thinking power-to-weight ratio is why I selected 2.25" tire. Should I get a bigger tire such as 2.50 or 2.75? What size cranks should I use to have the correct ground clearance?

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