Tires

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cero   10 mW

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Tires

Post by cero » Aug 22 2013 6:30pm

Hi I need some advice on buying best tires for my e-bike.
So I'm buying new tires for my e-bike and I'm looking for the fastest ones to ride on aphalt roads.
I'm thinking that they should be as smooth as possible, but i don't know what size should i choose.
If i take 26x2.5 the circumference is bigger, so I thint I'll have more speed based on same rpm of the motor.
But if i take 26x1.5 because it is thinner, there will be less rolling resistance, which also means higer speed.
I'm confused... what would you prefer?

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Re: Tires

Post by arkmundi » Aug 22 2013 6:50pm

Here''s a good thread: Advise on tires.... Maxxis, Continental, Kendra, Panaracer, Shwalbe, Michelin are all good tires.

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Re: Tires

Post by teklektik » Aug 22 2013 9:50pm

Although it may seem counter-intuitive, wider bicycle tires have less rolling resistance because the tire deforms less. Cushier ride as well... :D
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Re: Tires

Post by jkbrigman » Aug 22 2013 9:59pm

Hi Cero - I've tested exactly the question you are asking. i came up with my results and posted them in my build thread:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 00#p781279
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Re: Tires

Post by cero » Aug 23 2013 6:14am

I wil choose between this one 26 x 2,1:
http://www.conti-online.com/www/bicycle ... ct_en.html
or this one 26 x 1,60 or even 26 x 1,30:
http://www.conti-online.com/www/bicycle ... ct_en.html
Which do you prefer?

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Re: Tires

Post by The fingers » Aug 23 2013 8:48am

Unless your tires are severly under inflated, I wouldn't worry about the motor's ability to overcome rolling resistance. I like the widest tires that will fit and the largest circumference. Mostly flat where I live though, and I'm not trying to do burn outs, brodies, or wheelies. :lol:
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Re: Tires

Post by bowlofsalad » Aug 23 2013 9:16am

The fingers wrote:Unless your tires are severly under inflated, I wouldn't worry about the motor's ability to overcome rolling resistance. I like the widest tires that will fit and the largest circumference. Mostly flat where I live though, and I'm not trying to do burn outs, brodies, or wheelies. :lol:
That is a strange thing to say. I hope you don't take offense to this, but what you are saying sounds like you think rolling resistance and aerodynamics are irrelevant. I strongly disagree.

@cero If your frame can fit the tires I'd go for the 54-622 comfort contact without a doubt.

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All purpose Bargain Tires

Post by DrkAngel » Aug 23 2013 9:34am

Super budget tire!

Kevlar
40-65lb psi
reflective sidewall
26 x 1.9 (fits 1.5 - 1.75 wheel nicely)
good compromise tread (low rolling resistance - good all weather-terrain traction)

click on picture
Image
$16.13 each free ship w/$100 order
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Re: Tires

Post by deardancer3 » Aug 23 2013 10:03am

gave up (too late) on my old worn out slick 2.15 Big Apple that I crashed on due to NO tread left.

Replaced with 2.2 Halo twin rail

http://www.halowheels.com/products/part/TYHAT62

any one else tried this tire?

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Re: Tires

Post by jkbrigman » Aug 23 2013 10:24am

cero wrote:I wil choose between this one 26 x 2,1:
http://www.conti-online.com/www/bicycle ... ct_en.html
or this one 26 x 1,60 or even 26 x 1,30:
http://www.conti-online.com/www/bicycle ... ct_en.html
Which do you prefer?
Cero - If you were asking me, I'd vote for the 1,60 or maybe even the 1,30. I bet that 1,60 and 1,30 can handle higher pressure than the 2,1? Are you getting the tires from a bike shop or buying them online?

I am not impressed by the Continentals. Low inflation pressure and poor selection of sizes. I've switched from a 2" Hemisphere (that's the tire brand for Specialized bikes) down to a 1.5" Schwalbe. I'm doing a long-distance road test this weekend, I'll post numbers as soon as I can.

Please let me warn you about the large tires:
- check to make sure the tread of the tire will not scrape or rub the kickstand. I had a problem with that when I installed a two-legged kickstand. My original very-wide-profile tires scraped. After that, I went with higher-profile slightly narrower 2" tire and it didn't scrape. Also saw an improvement in speed and efficiency.
- I've had trouble with V-brake clearance on the VERY fat tires: the pads "want" to come into contact with the tire on the way to the rim sidewall. I adjusted the pads downward and it helped, but at the cost of contact surface area. It was very bad, as the pad started wearing faster in one section but leaving another section untouched
- I don't know which motor wheel you have, but the rim that comes with the 9c motor does not work well with a 2" tire: the 2" tire is just too fat for the little 23mm wide rim and a smaller tire will work better and ride more efficiently. I found that the 9c rim is "happiest" with a tire SMALLER than 2": either a 1.5" or a 1.75" tire was way better.
- NOTE that the Schalbe 26" x 1.5" tire, model # 40-559, has an inflation pressure range of 60-110psi. Whether you use the higher pressure or not, it's a good thing to have, as it demonstrates it's a high quality tire. I've just begun to tap the efficiency potential of this tire at 65psi!
- The Schwalbe has a reflective sidewall, which I want very much. (So does the CORPORAL tire mentioned earlier, which appears to be a pretty good copy of the big Schwalbe at a very low price.)


I don't mean to come off as a Schwalbe fanboy, but so far, I am. :lol: The Schwalbe is expensive, so I'm also looking at Kenda Kwest and Cyclops (http://www.amazon.com/CST-Cyclops-Tire- ... ef=sr_1_20).

JKB
Last edited by jkbrigman on Aug 23 2013 10:41am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tires

Post by cero » Aug 23 2013 10:36am

Ok, I took this one
https://www.bike24.net/1.php?content=8; ... 775ad28419

Now i have 26X1.95 tires on my e-bike so I'm assuming 26X20 will do just fine
Thankyou all for advices!
Last edited by cero on Aug 23 2013 10:38am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tires

Post by e-beach » Aug 23 2013 10:37am

I don't recommend products much, but I can say after 3500 miles on these tires I am very satisfied. Inflated to 80 psi the roll like crazy, inflated to 65psi the still roll and are very comfortable to ride on. I have riden all over the good and rotten streets in my large city and I have had only one flat. And, it took all night to go flat. (I rode my bike home and didn't even notice any change in the ride. The next morning I saw the rear tire was low.) These tire have great traction dry or wet, and I have never had them slide on the sandy bike paths that I ride on all the time. The down side is that they are $100 per set USA.


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Re: Tires

Post by jkbrigman » Aug 23 2013 10:40am

Looks like you went with a Schwalbe....you will not be disappointed.

Which one did you get?
42-559 (26 x 1.60)
50-559 (26 x 2.00)
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Re: Tires

Post by cero » Aug 23 2013 10:54am

50-559 (26 x 2.00)

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Re: Tires

Post by friendly1uk » Aug 23 2013 10:56am

isn't there a simple pressure relationship, where a 1.5" tyre needs twice the pressure of a 2.1" tyre because it is under half the size.

Skinny tyres are for lightweight unforgiving racers, while big balloon tyres are for city comfort.

It don't matter how much suspension you have, a hub motor only gets the tyre. Maybe it is unimportant, but I do like my motor to get a cushy ride, and the gears inside it surely like the tyre to offer some give to reduce shock loading.

My bike's a hard tail so I don't really consider skinny tyres as an option. The chinese rims supplied only had a 19mm bead width, so I tracked down some big mammoth fats with there very large 24mm bead width to hold 2.15" big apples nicely. They still exhibit issue's with tyres to wide for the rim, but there is nothing left to do about it. 24mm is big. Really big. Almost specialised. 23mm can't be a proper internal bead measurement.
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Re: Tires

Post by Drunkskunk » Aug 23 2013 12:15pm

Counter intuitively, Wider tires have less rolling resistance. Check this info: http://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_info/ ... resistance

But I think more important than the width is the tread. A good tire compound and tread pattern will make all the difference in the world. A semi-block pattern will roll better than a knobby, and a slick will roll better than a any semi-block pattern.

My personal choice is a Maxxis Hookworm. Nothing I have tried performs as well.
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Re: Tires

Post by cero » Aug 23 2013 2:04pm

nice article with lots of credibility

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Re: Tires

Post by Chalo » Aug 23 2013 4:38pm

deardancer3 wrote:gave up (too late) on my old worn out slick 2.15 Big Apple that I crashed on due to NO tread left.
Were you riding on sand or something? The slicker the tire, the better the grip on pavement. That's why most race vehicles use slick tires on paved surfaces.

Tread only helps your traction when the surface is softer or looser than the tire. Bicycles can't hydroplane, so that isn't a factor.
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Re: Tires

Post by Chalo » Aug 23 2013 5:25pm

The fastest e-bike tires for asphalt will be fat, smooth-threaded tires of moderate carcass thickness, with relatively fine thread casings. Schwalbe Big Apple and Maxxis Hookworm are fine choices in this category, but so are CST Cyclops, Panaracar Uff'Da, Tioga FS100, Origin8 Captiv-8er, and many others. Over-2.2 inch width is the best benefit of these tires, because it yields a combination of low rolling resistance, excellent traction, wheel protection, and ride quality that's easily tunable to suit conditions. At speeds over 20mph, fat tires cause a small penalty in aerodynamic drag compared to a narrow tire, but most of us are not sitting in a riding position that befits aerodynamic concerns anyway.

Other tires that are not quite as wide, but worth considering because of their speed and puncture protection are Schwalbe Marathon Supreme and Panaracer RiBMo.
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Re: Tires

Post by deardancer3 » Aug 23 2013 9:58pm

Chalo wrote:
deardancer3 wrote:gave up (too late) on my old worn out slick 2.15 Big Apple that I crashed on due to NO tread left.
Were you riding on sand or something? The slicker the tire, the better the grip on pavement. That's why most race vehicles use slick tires on paved surfaces.

Tread only helps your traction when the surface is softer or looser than the tire. Bicycles can't hydroplane, so that isn't a factor.
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Re: Tires

Post by -dg » Aug 23 2013 10:44pm

deardancer3 wrote:hit an unavoidable patch of mud, blind downhill corner, oncoming bike. dislocated tailbone. medical copays much higher than cost of replacing the tire on time.
Here are some tires that have good traction in mud on top of pavement:








Pick any of those. They all come with a complimentary subscription to "Unicorn Breeders Weekly" and the "Perpetual Motion Report".
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Re: Tires

Post by jkbrigman » Aug 24 2013 7:30pm

-dg wrote:
deardancer3 wrote:hit an unavoidable patch of mud, blind downhill corner, oncoming bike. dislocated tailbone. medical copays much higher than cost of replacing the tire on time.
Here are some tires that have good traction in mud on top of pavement:
...
Pick any of those. They all come with a complimentary subscription to "Unicorn Breeders Weekly" and the "Perpetual Motion Report".
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Re: Tires

Post by Chalo » Aug 24 2013 11:18pm

To be fair, I suspect that there is a small but significant "squeegee" effect that comes from having edges in a tread pattern. I suspect in the presence of silt, slime, gross parking lot runoff, or other thin films, tread pattern edges can help establish a little bit of grip through the lubricating layer. Obviously such effect is less than totally effective in thick mud, cake frosting, mango puree, shaving cream, etc., but it may be enough to stay upright through a corner in more average conditions.

As for me, I use slicks when it's expedient and economical to do so, and I use relatively smooth treads the rest of the time. I avoid knobbies entirely, along with other smoother-looking treads whose raised elements are narrow in proportion to their height. An extreme example of the latter is the Freedom Ryder tire, which appears superficially to be a reasonably smooth tire, but which in fact has lots of drag and poor handling:
Image
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Re: Tires

Post by -dg » Aug 25 2013 1:05am

Chalo wrote: Schwalbe Big Apple and Maxxis Hookworm are fine choices in this category, but so are CST Cyclops, Panaracar Uff'Da, Tioga FS100, Origin8 Captiv-8er, and many others.
...
Other tires that are not quite as wide, but worth considering because of their speed and puncture protection are Schwalbe Marathon Supreme and Panaracer RiBMo.
Pretty clearly the CST Cyclops is the value leader here, and I'm a big believer in value, but do any of the mentioned tires have significant advantages over the Cyclops? The application is an electrified hardtail MTB (early 90s Trek 950) with a heavy but easy on equipment rider on badly maintained city streets, usually with a load of groceries or books or case of beer or suchlike. Rims are Alex DM-24. Speed will be 18 to 25 mph. While puncture resistance is a plus, I rarely flat even on 32 mm 700c Paselas.
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Re: Tires

Post by Chalo » Aug 25 2013 1:54am

-dg wrote:
Chalo wrote: Schwalbe Big Apple and Maxxis Hookworm are fine choices in this category, but so are CST Cyclops, Panaracar Uff'Da, Tioga FS100, Origin8 Captiv-8er, and many others.
...
Other tires that are not quite as wide, but worth considering because of their speed and puncture protection are Schwalbe Marathon Supreme and Panaracer RiBMo.
Pretty clearly the CST Cyclops is the value leader here, and I'm a big believer in value, but do any of the mentioned tires have significant advantages over the Cyclops? The application is an electrified hardtail MTB (early 90s Trek 950) with a heavy but easy on equipment rider on badly maintained city streets, usually with a load of groceries or books or case of beer or suchlike. Rims are Alex DM-24.
The much more expensive Marathon Supreme and RiBMo tires have much better puncture protection compared to the Cyclops or single-ply Hookworm. But they are narrower, and while they might be a bit faster, they are neither faster nor slower enough to tell the difference. I'll never try to talk anybody out of using a CST Cyclops in any bike that will fit one. It's a great tire, and the price makes it all the more attractive.

Big Apple 2.35", Hookworm 2.5", and Cyclops 2.4" are all just about exactly the same size in the real world. Uff'Da and FS100 are a little bit smaller, which is only significant inasmuch as it could make the difference between a tire that rubs on the frame and one that doesn't.

With your bike and rims, I'd start with Cyclops at 30/35psi, and experiment with higher and lower pressures from there. There is a chance that Cyclops will not fit on one end or the other. Use 10-15% less pressure in the front than in the rear, and about 5psi more for every 1/8" reduction in width if you have to use a smaller tire.
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