Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Offroader » Sep 17, 2017 12:23 am

Volts wrote:I put a multi meter on the charge circle and it's closed should it be open? Meaning one of the components on the board is broken or can it be a software problem?
What charge circle? How is it closed? How did the power supply blow a mosfet exactly?

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by madin88 » Sep 17, 2017 6:52 am

ap0f1s wrote:I used adaptto on one of my e-bike for almost half a year. I tried tune my adaptto a dozen times, but when i compare with sabvoton is a disaster. Adaptto with qs 205 v3 getting hot fast, when sabvoton has no problem. Below you have a link with a comparison. My friend record this movie with me and couple friends. We use
thermal imaging camera. This film is no edit.
Why is so much difference? I build a few bike on adaptto, every time the same thing with overheating. I tried with my friends many tune options, But that does not help much.

Halfway adaptto is overheating 140 C sabvoton has 80 C. Adaptto and sabvoton has the same amp battery, phase amp.
In this clip 3 bikes has sabovotn(red, yellow, and white), green has adaptto midi-e.

Image
Good that you have done that comparison and share your results here.

For a meaningful comparison it would be good to know the real phase amps and real battery amps (peak).
A current clamp with true RMS DC+AC and crest, or min/max function should be good enough. It will store the peak values and you can take a look later after the ride.
Even a slight overshoot in the phase apms could result in much more heat, but it should also result in better acceleration.

Is there a difference in acceleration between the two, or have you done a side by side run?
Have you tried the setting "wire R phc" together with entering an accurate value for the phase to phase resistance (measured incl phase wires at the controller plugs)?

Yes Adaptto is not easy to set up. The problem is how can someone know that it is setup optimal and not only 95%.
this is the biggest problem -> the uncertainty.

A fact is that Adaptto doesn't work with Crystalyte TC motors, and even they do not know the reason why.
Recently i have hooked up a BionX D-Motor to a Max-E and the performance is quite disappointing.
It is nothing special in terms of ERPM and it has 120° hall sensors.
Playing with the settings - after an apparently sucessfull manual tuning - did not make it better, so i'm forced to use a differnt controller.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Volts » Sep 17, 2017 8:36 am

only problem is if you have a cromotor with 60 degree hall sensors sabvoton doesn't work with it, so you are stuck with not to many options, apparently the kelly controller is really good with the cromotor, any one know other controllers that work well with a 60 degree hub motor?

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by madin88 » Sep 17, 2017 9:31 am

Volts wrote:any one know other controllers that work well with a 60 degree hub motor?
Infineon (xie chang) or Powervelocity are programmable for 60°
back to the roots

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Volts » Sep 17, 2017 11:25 pm

So does the max e over heat as well compaired to the sabvoton and has anyone got or used a 36 fet sabvoton (new one) if so review please

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Lebowski » Sep 18, 2017 12:36 am

Volts wrote:only problem is if you have a cromotor with 60 degree hall sensors sabvoton doesn't work with it, so you are stuck with not to many options, apparently the kelly controller is really good with the cromotor, any one know other controllers that work well with a 60 degree hub motor?
well if you know how to solder...

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by brumbrum » Sep 18, 2017 1:50 am

Volts wrote:only problem is if you have a cromotor with 60 degree hall sensors sabvoton doesn't work with it, so you are stuck with not to many options, apparently the kelly controller is really good with the cromotor, any one know other controllers that work well with a 60 degree hub motor?
Since when did the cromotor have 60 degree hall sensors?

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Regen comes ON even if disabled!

Post by Altair » Sep 19, 2017 6:12 pm

Hi guys,
Lately I've been modifying my mid-drive fatbike and came upon a problem that I can't solve.
I had to send my Mini-E for repair, and during that time I put in a Kelly KBS as a temporary replacement.
I then decided to eliminate the freewheel in my rear hub to make it direct-drive. (I basically CNC-machined a part that plugs into the hub where the 6 pawls are usually located and my rear sprocket was bolted directly to this part. It works really well and eliminated the constant breakage of pawls, about one for every 3 outings.) My setup is now equivalent to a hubmotor, as the motor now always turns with the wheel.

When I got back my Mini-E, I put it back on the bike but now Regen comes in strongly at times, even though it is disabled in the menu. In fact I never used regen, I ride rough terrain only and need good control.
The problem occurs after I have accelerated and now I'm letting the bike slow down by itself. As long as the throttle is closed, there is no problem. But if I open the throttle during the slowing down, regen comes ON hard and quickly slows the bike until some lower speed is reached, where everything goes back to normal.

Regen is really OFF in the setup. I even tried lowering the Rated Current to 0.00A in the menu.
I did a few autodetects to see if it would help, without success.

So if you have any suggestions, I would love to hear them.
Thanks!

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 20, 2017 3:41 am

Hi guy's,

So I'm thinking about my next build which is an Alpha. I've already got the Midi-E for it so will be using that.
I was pretty set on getting a MXUS 3K for it, but now thinking about a QS 205 50H. Out of these 2 motors which has worked the best in terms of easiest to tune and doesn't get as hot?
Or, is there a better option in a similar 205, 45-50 wide magnet range?

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by ridethelightning » Sep 20, 2017 4:03 am

im in the same boat right now, trying to decide between mxus 3k or qs 205, 40H or 45H v3.
heres my take-
mxus has 45mm stator rated 3000KW(?), probably not much room for phase upgrade, weighs~10kg(depends who you ask :roll: )
qs 40H / 45H rated ~1500watts(very conservative), Weighs~11kg, prabably has more copper fill, and room for phase upgrade.
infact the extra kg is probably all copper :lol:

I have a 205 50H v3, runs very well with a max-e. i have hubsinks and ff and now rarely gets above warm, even on hill climbs.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by icherouveim » Sep 20, 2017 5:53 am

I think it's better to go for the QS 205 50H or for the new promising MXUS 5K 55H (it is really good from what they say, it's a monster).
The first positive tests came from Russia already.

I have a MXUS 3K with FF and double hub sinks and when I use peak power 9K Watts for sometime it overheats.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dm0j2KtjBLE

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 20, 2017 6:32 am

Thanks for the feedback guys.
I guess with the Midi-E I am somewhat power limited. I would not be able to exceed about 8-10KW peak, and therefore there isn't much point going with a heavier 55mm wide magnet motor if I can't really use the power.
I do still care a lot about weight so anything more than a QS 205 50H would probably not be on the cards.
I'm actually still liking the MXUS 3K, but just want to be reasonably sure I won't run into issue with overheating like I have with my Leaf and HS4080.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by icherouveim » Sep 20, 2017 7:00 am

Cowardlyduck wrote:Thanks for the feedback guys.
I guess with the Midi-E I am somewhat power limited. I would not be able to exceed about 8-10KW peak, and therefore there isn't much point going with a heavier 55mm wide magnet motor if I can't really use the power.
I do still care a lot about weight so anything more than a QS 205 50H would probably not be on the cards.
I'm actually still liking the MXUS 3K, but just want to be reasonably sure I won't run into issue with overheating like I have with my Leaf and HS4080.

Cheers
I have MXUS 3K 4T with FF and double hub sinks connected with a midi-e controller and the motor overheats after 20-25 minutes at 140C with peak power 9KW
I drive only on urban roads with maximum speed 75km/h.
2017-08-02 14.50.20.jpg
2017-08-02 14.50.20.jpg (22.34 KiB) Viewed 554 times

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 20, 2017 6:00 pm

icherouveim wrote:I have MXUS 3K 4T with FF and double hub sinks connected with a midi-e controller and the motor overheats after 20-25 minutes at 140C with peak power 9KW
I drive only on urban roads with maximum speed 75km/h.
2017-08-02 14.50.20.jpg
Thanks for this info!
I wonder if the 9KW has more to do with the overheating than the Adaptto tune. Although even with 9KW, urban roads at only 75Km/h should not overheat it.
I wonder if a 5T would be better. I plan on running on 18S (72V) LiPo, so top speed on a 5T would still be ok, and OVS is always an option for the occasional high speed run.

Anyone with a QS 205 50H care to chime in?

Cheers
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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by ridethelightning » Sep 20, 2017 8:47 pm

oh yes! :D
qs 205 50H v3 4t 9kv , max-e 14kw version, upgraded to 6awg phases, ff, single hubsinks 17"moto wheel.
does not overheat after running between 80-90kph for 30min on slightly undulating sealed road ~15c ambient:D
tops out at ~70C and cools fast when power slightly reduced
wasnt watching the watts, but i get 13kw peaks.
if confident that this combo would leave the mxus for dead.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 20, 2017 8:59 pm

ridethelightning wrote:oh yes! :D
qs 205 50H v3 4t 9kv , max-e 14kw version, upgraded to 6awg phases, ff, single hubsinks 17"moto wheel.
does not overheat after running between 80-90kph for 30min on slightly undulating sealed road ~15c ambient:D
tops out at ~70C and cools fast when power slightly reduced
wasnt watching the watts, but i get 13kw peaks.
if confident that this combo would leave the mxus for dead.
Thanks!
I guess the only question for me then is, can the Midi-E manage enough power to really satisfy that motor?
Unlocked I managed to push 8KW through my last Mini-E before it blew, extrapolating that out I should be able to get at least 12KW out of an unlocked Midi-E safely. So I guess I answered my own question then...if I'm prepared to unlock it, the Midi-E should be more than enough to satisfy a QS 205 50H.
The only other question is do I go with a 4T or a 5T. I'll be running 18S LiPo, so the 4T would be better, but just not sure if the Midi-E would really like it. My Mini-E struggles with heat at 5KW powering my 4T HS4080, but it's fine at 5KW on the 5T Leaf (apart from the motor overheating).

Cheers
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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by ridethelightning » Sep 20, 2017 9:26 pm

yes, if your pushing the controller limits id stay with 5t motor. the controller might benifit from good heatsinks too.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 20, 2017 10:29 pm

ridethelightning wrote:yes, if your pushing the controller limits id stay with 5t motor. the controller might benifit from good heatsinks too.
Yeah, I think your right, and yes heatsinks is definitely a good idea....so much so that I've already done it on my Mini-E, and already have all the heatsinks ready to go for my Midi-E. :mrgreen:
Image
This was what let me reach 8KW on my last Mini-E.

Cheers
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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by aschigrunder » Sep 21, 2017 2:12 am

hi all
hope someone of you can help, this is my first build with adaptto
max e with the latest firmware (open),with evel gt 4000 motor
everything went fine, autodetection, throttle calibration but i have no power on the throttle
only 1km/h
and i think it is because of this, on the display the temperatur gauge is going up and down
someone of you have had the same problems?
made a small video, thanks for your help

https://youtu.be/2gXPm_ABf08

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 21, 2017 2:18 am

You can disable the temp sensor in the advanced settings. Do that and see if it helps.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by aschigrunder » Sep 21, 2017 2:27 am

Cowardlyduck wrote:You can disable the temp sensor in the advanced settings. Do that and see if it helps.

Cheers
yes i did, the same thing, i checked all the different type of sensor in the the advanced settings
i guess that something is wrong with the controller, i hope not

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 21, 2017 2:48 am

Try sensor less mode, swap phase wire combo's, hall sensor combo's, and failing all that try a factory reset.

Cheers
High Power LiPo wiring harnesses - 4P - XT90, HXT4mm, 5.5mm. 200Amp+ capable. Global shipping.

Modified Stealth Fighter - Force air cooled Leaf motor @ 5KW, Heat-sinked Adaptto Mini-E. Battery = 20AH, 72V LiPo.
Cowardlyducks - Stealth Fighter Videos

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by ridethelightning » Sep 21, 2017 3:47 am

aschigrunder wrote:hi all
hope someone of you can help, this is my first build with adaptto
max e with the latest firmware (open),with evel gt 4000 motor
everything went fine, autodetection, throttle calibration but i have no power on the throttle
only 1km/h
and i think it is because of this, on the display the temperatur gauge is going up and down
someone of you have had the same problems?
made a small video, thanks for your help

https://youtu.be/2gXPm_ABf08
sounds like you may have the wrong temp sensor selected in advanced settings or calibration(there are 2, 1 in controller fets, 1 in motor)
that is exactly what happens if its wrong.

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by ridethelightning » Sep 21, 2017 3:49 am

Cowardlyduck wrote:
ridethelightning wrote:yes, if your pushing the controller limits id stay with 5t motor. the controller might benifit from good heatsinks too.
Yeah, I think your right, and yes heatsinks is definitely a good idea....so much so that I've already done it on my Mini-E, and already have all the heatsinks ready to go for my Midi-E. :mrgreen:
Image
This was what let me reach 8KW on my last Mini-E.

Cheers
cool!
did you buff off the paint before sticking the sinks?
i did that and i think it makes a big difference. you can feel just how much colder the aluminium is compared to the painted surface..

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Re: Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 21, 2017 4:01 am

ridethelightning wrote: cool!
did you buff off the paint before sticking the sinks?
i did that and i think it makes a big difference. you can feel just how much colder the aluminium is compared to the painted surface..
I didn't buff off the paint, but that's not a bad idea. I might do that for the Midi-E. Thanks for the suggestion!
I used Arctic Silver thermal epoxy to glue them on and they do shed quite a bit of heat even without the buffing. My new Mini-E doesn't have those exact heatsinks, but some lower profile ones that are not quite as effective, however they don't cut my hands when lifting the bike like the one's pictured above did.

Cheers
High Power LiPo wiring harnesses - 4P - XT90, HXT4mm, 5.5mm. 200Amp+ capable. Global shipping.

Modified Stealth Fighter - Force air cooled Leaf motor @ 5KW, Heat-sinked Adaptto Mini-E. Battery = 20AH, 72V LiPo.
Cowardlyducks - Stealth Fighter Videos

BikeE recumbent commuter - Golden motor, 6Fet Infineon, 20AH 12S LiPo, with on-board solar charging.

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