Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

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Kimovitzh   10 mW

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Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Kimovitzh » Jan 26 2018 11:55am

Ok ... where do I begin.

Iv'e got at QS 205 hun motor, Sabvoton 72150 and a cycle analyst v3.
When I first hooked up the Sabvoton to my PC and began the hall angle test, it went fine, saved the new angle number (245), and did the parameter store and shut it of.
Turned et on to discover that the motor went backwards, no problem just changed the motor direction in the software (from 0 to 1), changed the numbers of poles (16), and changed som other variables - even slide recharge worked. Again with the OK's and the parameter store.
Went outside, turned it on, and it worked!

So, after first test I went home shut I down and waited a day to begin fine tuning the rest in the software.
the next day only some of the new settings worked. Slide recharge didn't work any more, even though I didn't changed the setting.
And suddenly the hall angle number changed (5), so I did the hall angle test again, but now it found a new hall angle number (145) ... every time.
So did a "Restore factory settings", shut if off and tried again and now the hall angle number returned to the correct number (245).
But none of the other settings seemed to work quite right.

All of a sudden the motor rotation didn't needed correction (it is now 0) -as if the factory restore didn't restore, odd I thought, so turned on slide recharge at tried to see if that worked, but I seemed to work backwards, when I reach 100 RPM and let go of the throttle ig just ramps the speed UP, looking at the software screen the status was 22:Slide recharge ...what the f.
And when I turned the throttle to 100% it kinda stop/reverse the motor :shock: see what I mean here - [youtube]https://youtu.be/wQE4igyEyJE[/youtube]


SO!
I tried a new PC, fresh install of the software, did the factory reset and everything AGAIN.
AND it worked, so shut it down, went for a short test, shut it down - turned it on, and then the motor went backwards, and all the problems with the settings continued.

What the hell is up, either the software is not doing what it says it does, or the controller is completely bugged.
I read all the instructions, did the OK's and parameter store, had the controller powered on before plugging in the USB, pulled the USB out before I shut it down and so on.

I've got no clue what to do next. :(
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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by speedmd » Jan 26 2018 2:42pm

I was having the same issues until I used the key switch wire to shut it down (reset) vs the main power connection. It has been relatively reliable on saves since for me. Hall test still fails. Runs good regardless. I have some new hall sensors to install next time I pull the motor apart if I find the need.

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Kimovitzh   10 mW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Kimovitzh » Jan 26 2018 2:50pm

speedmd wrote:
Jan 26 2018 2:42pm
I was having the same issues until I used the key switch wire to shut it down (reset) vs the main power connection. It has been relatively reliable on saves since for me. Hall test still fails. Runs good regardless. I have some new hall sensors to install next time I pull the motor apart if I find the need.
I've got a key switch between the orange "ignition" and the battery(+) wire, if that's what you are referring to?
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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by speedmd » Jan 26 2018 4:52pm

Purple wire on mine. It is called different things on different data sheets. Looked at the sheet I was using in the shop and has it listed as ignition wire.

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Kimovitzh   10 mW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Kimovitzh » Jan 26 2018 5:41pm

It's called "orange ignition" here :roll:

Image
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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by speedmd » Jan 26 2018 9:18pm

I went out and looked closely at my setup. Your correct. Orange is the ignition and the one I got good results when restarting controller to set program changes. The purple I have hard wired in now and was also a issue and had my memory a bit confused. Sorry about that. I was disconnecting the battery to restart and set the program changes and getting the same issues your describing. Not sure if it matters, but when setting program changes, I switch off the ignition, disconnect the program cable and then disconnect the battery for a bit. I leave the battery unconnected if I am moving the bike out of the shop as just don't trust it just yet. When I disconnect- reconnect this way it has been successful so far.

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Kimovitzh   10 mW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Kimovitzh » Jan 27 2018 2:59am

So just to be sure.
What would you do if you make a change?

Would you then do it like this?
Edit the setting.
Press OK.
Press yes for parameter store.
Press OK.
Turn off ignition.
Remove USB cable.
Disconnect battery.
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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by speedmd » Jan 27 2018 11:11am

That is what worked for me.

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Kimovitzh   10 mW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Kimovitzh » Jan 27 2018 7:25pm

Dosen't work here.

So I've contacted QS motor as they are my supplier, and they are waiting for an answer from Sabvoton. Great service from QS, I must say!
In the meanwhile have tested numerous of combinations but still with no succes.

Update on findings.
My motors rotation from factory is backwards when "Motor direction" is "0".
After "Restore factory settings" has been done (press "Yes" -> "OK", turn key off, wait 5 sec, turn on) the software ask for "4:HALL angle test".
When the "4:HALL angle test" is done "Hall angle" is found (245), I then press "OK" -> "Parameter store" "Yes" "OK", according to document from QS -
If use QS V3 type ,the angle is about 250.
I then turn ignition off, remove USB from controller and the turn ignition on and insert USB again.
Now the "Hall angle" is (14) in the "DEBUG" page. :?

Did the entire thing again ...
Now the "Hall angle" is (19) in the "DEBUG" page. :?
I've also seen (129). But never (245) again.

So if I ignore this, and change "Motor direction" to (1) "Motor Pn" to (16), and press "OK" and "Parameter store" "Yes" "OK", the wheel turns the correct way, "Slide recharge" also works perfect.
If I change "Hall angle" to (245) "OK" and "Parameter store" "Yes" "OK", do the ignition off and ignition on, the wheel turns backwards :!: , EVEN if "Motor direction" still is (1) AND the "Slide recharge" does not work correct, it works opposite. Now it accelerate to max speed when "Slide recharge speed" is met.

This is just one of the ways I've tried, so If any one have some input as to what I might have missed, please tell me, and I can then tell if I've done it.
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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by speedmd » Jan 28 2018 9:39am

Mine did not set the changes reliably unless I disconnected the battery also. I never leave the battery in my bike overnight so it became evident it was getting different results when giving up with it and putting bike away for next day. This nightmare went on for near a few weeks :evil: .

Your direction change from zero to 1 will also flip- reverse the accell and decell time settings. I ended up swapping phase wires and hall wires to get the direction correct on default (zero) setting. Huge pain! I would think QS would know what is up with their motor -controller setup. Was thinking of going with one of their motors on a hub setup as I was thinking my issues were related to my gng motor. Does not sound like it.

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Kimovitzh   10 mW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Kimovitzh » Jan 28 2018 1:58pm

Changing the phase wires did not help, now the "Slide recharge" just accelerate backwards :roll:
I am now quite confident that i'm having a faulty controller :(

If you decide to buy from QS, I can highly recommend them, they provide great service!
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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by E-Zero » Feb 07 2018 3:56pm

Although mine is a 96150 I think you might help.
Was working fine, I had to disconnect the motor for maintenance and now error 25 is on. Tried everything, even reset to factory default but nothing. It shows 2v only but the battery is full...
Help will be welcome!

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Charles Gibbs   10 µW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Charles Gibbs » Jul 18 2018 2:50am

Hi all, I am new here and new to Sabvoton. I've been doing ebiking for sometime and I love it,....

My setup is a KT 26A controler and a 13AH 48V battery,
It's a fatbike and came with everything from the factory, I was able to get a good 30 - 40 KM on that setup doing 1000 -1150W max but a rated of around 600 - 800W constant, and I was getting speeds of 45-60KM/H.

Enter Sabvoton, the new ones with the TFT display, They are claimed to work from 36 - 90 volts with 95 being the upper limit voltage.
SO, it came with a bluetooth dongle and no cable to programe it with, therefor the dongle. Now, before anyone says "just go and buy a cable on ebay....... " Stop right there, Please. I am in Namibia we have a 13:1 US$ exchange rate and a 17:1 GBP exchange rate, this controller allready cost me 345.00 GBP converted to my currency and that is just short of 7000.00 NAM$ so one BUTT load of cash out the door for me......

I took the little plug that is supplied that has to be put in place of the tft screen when programming, and logged on in the android app from MQCon, the max battery amps I set to 10A as I don't think that the little BMS can cope with more draw than that then the rated and max Phase current I set to 60A as it must be 2-3 times higher being a 3 phase motor. I disabled Flux weakening as the battery/Bms won't be able to take that much draw, I also changed boost amps to 0. I did the hall angle test first and it tested ok and then did the motor direction change as it was backwards. Got on the bike and tried to take off...........................

There was a burp from the bike and the Controller display and controller both shut down, my BMS was also off. So, I let it reset and tried again and the same thing happened, I then opened the battery pack and bypasse the load from the BMS by soldreing directly to the battery negative on the battery pack, I still charge through the BMS just don't draw my load from it, I could get pulled away but the voltag sag is so heavy that I can't get 200m down the raod drawing almost 2000W and then the controller shuts down again and my voltage sag hits 44V.

So, I then set my rated phase current down to 20 amps and the max phase current to 40 amps and it does a bit better, piss poor acceleration, and the display shows a max of 1300W but then still cuts out as my voltage hits 44V my "LACK Volts" is set to 40 so this thing should not do what it is doing...... I can't even do a 3KM drive to work now without having this thing die anywhere from 4 to 10 times in this short distance and I have to keep on switching it on again and again.

ANY help will be appreciated, I just don't think that these controller can work on that low a voltage first off, and second off, I would expect to at least be able to get what I could from my KT setup, I can hardly hit 30KM/H without this thing dying and this is very irratating for me........

Regards
Charles
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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by amberwolf » Jul 18 2018 3:05am

From the symptoms, the problem is in the battery itself--it simply can't handle the current draw needed to run the bike with this controller, at least with whatever settings it has at present.

Do you have a way to measure the actual current flowing from the battery under load? A wattmeter is easiest, but you can use an ammeter, even a clamp-on would be better than nothing (the clamp goes around either the positive or negative battery wire, but not both).

This would tell you how much current your system took with the old controller, and then you can test with the new one, and see what it is actually drawing from the battery, vs what you've set it to draw.

That will give you two things:

--capability of the battery when it's working fine, iwth the old controller

--a ratio you can use to figure out the correct setting to use in the new controller, based on how much current you actually see vs what it is supposed to be drawing.



Bypassing the BMS to prevent shutdown just lets the cells be damaged by going too low in voltage--that's why the bms was shutting off, to protect the cells from overload and overdischarge.

So you either need a new battery pack, or you need a second one to put in parallel with the first one, before you destroy the one you already have.

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Charles Gibbs   10 µW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Charles Gibbs » Jul 18 2018 3:29am

@ amberwolf.

Thanks for replying, I know for a fact that the bms is protecting the battery this I understand, what I don't is the fact that I have set the current draw on the on the controller and it does not seem to work, they said it runs on 48 volts, but it does not, otherwise you will need a flippin 30ah 48 volt battery which is also BS, I only have a multimeter that I can use but it to can only get 20Amps, will see what I can do, Am at work now. So no go for now.

Thanks for your answer.
Regards
Charles
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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by amberwolf » Jul 19 2018 1:28am

Well, if the controller shuts down after the battery sags to 44v (most likely it's sagging a lot farther than that, but the system doesn't update the display rapidly enough to show you), then it *does* run on 48v.

A 13s 48v battery typically runs about 52v fully charged, and drops down to about 40v or so when empty, depending on how the BMS is set. That's around 3v/cell at empty, which is lower than I'd run them. 44v empty would be 3.4v/cell, which is pretty empty but not so far that it risks overdischarge (when cells are unbalanced, especially in an aged pack) of the lowest cells.

A 14s "48v" battery is more commonly called a 52v battery, and is around 58v+ fully charged, and around 48v empty (at 3.4v/cell), 42v empty if you go to 3v/cell.

So it sounds like the controller is working as expected, as far as low-voltage cutoff goes, regardless of whether you have a 13s or a 14s battery.


As for programming it, the tests I suggested previously are the best way I can think of with stuff you may have or have access to without spending a lot of money, to determine what you may have to program it to to get the results you want, without a lot of trial and error.

If you don't have a clamp-on current meter (or other type that can handle teh higher currents you're likely to need to measure), perhaps a local automotive service place might have one you could borrow, or have them use as you run the tests?


Basically the root problem is that your battery simply isn't capable of supplying what the higher power controller needs to do it's job.

If you have to limit that controller down to the point it performs the same as or worse than your original one, then you might as well just run the original one, unless the reason for changing was to get features teh new one has that the old one doesn't.

If the reason for having the new controller was to increase power, speed, or whatever, then you'll also need a battery capable of supplying the power that new controller requires to do that job.

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Charles Gibbs   10 µW

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Re: Sabvoton 72150 Programming Problems

Post by Charles Gibbs » Jul 19 2018 1:32am

@ amberwolf

Yip, I to have come to the conclusion that it is the battery which is just totally inadequite for the controller. so I am going to lipo's that is not realy money I wanted to spend now but hey, I stuck my foot into the water......

Thanks again.
Regards
Charles
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