OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by wturber » Aug 07 2018 10:11pm

With my Dahon I was just looking for good commute speeds in the 18-21 mph range (30-35 kph). Beyond that things got a bit sketchy on the Dahon. That chrome steering tube stabilizer always rattled a bit and didn't instill much confidence. 40 kph for an upper limit seems reasonable for the Ancheer.
"Commuter - DC Booster"
Iron Horse 3.0 hardtail - 48V / 1000W / 470rpm generic Chinese DD Hub motor (ebay)
8 x 36v 4.3ah 10s 2P battery packs - 1500W 30A DC Boost Converter delivers 54v and about 1000 watts peak
53T/42T Sakae Road cranks - 30mph+ on flats
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=90369

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 10 2018 3:36am

First off I would like to thank everyone for pulling together a nice knowledgebase for the Ancheer 20". I have picked one up to dip my toe into the ebike waters, and have been slowly modding it to fit my and my wife's needs. I have been looking at sizing up the front sprocket and I was glad to see that others had already had success doing this.

I have already removed the speed limiter and as noted you can get up to a speed where you are freewheeling on the pedals pretty quick. I decided to go a bit more reserved and am upgrading to a 58T front gearing. I believe this should be enough to make 30kph pretty easy to maintain on flats in 7th gear. Once the parts come I will post an update.

So far the tweaks I have made are.
  • Added a rear hard shell case
  • Switched to a suspension seat
Overall I can't be more pleased with the reliability of the bike. It has definitely been a fun project and my wife's daily commuter into work.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Aug 11 2018 11:22pm

You are welcome. Feel free to post you Ancheer mods on this thread ! :)

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Nickelodeon » Aug 12 2018 3:23am

I haven't had a chance to try my 48v Battery yet either. The 36v battery just does everything it needs perfectly. I'm at around 500 total km on it without any issues.

With the limiter disconnected I reach around 30 kph, which is plenty. I could pedal like a hamster and go to 35km/h but honestly whenever I'm driving 32+ on that thing, I get scared. Key point here: Cheap chinese FOLDING bike. So I'm afraid that something snaps/breaks (although it shouldn't, I've ridden it off-road as well without any issues).

I mostly drive around 20kph as that's the sweetsport for the motors efficiency and then only ever so slightly help to pedal it along. My longest ride so far was 45km and I still had 2 bars left. Pretty much throttle all the time (just twisting the throttle where I feel it engages and helps just enough that I don't really need to put in any effort - of course I help additionally on hills etc.)

Fantastic little bike, just brought it on a 2 weeks sailing trip for getting around whenever in Harbour - has been perfect!

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Aug 12 2018 11:40am

One thing though. I think the BMS (Battery Management System) does not balance cells. I think it only does protect against cell overcharge and overdischarge. Most likely it`s this one as it seems to be the same size:
s-l1600.jpg
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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by wturber » Aug 12 2018 2:36pm

Looks like the BMS on my 20 10S "Hoverboard" packs. I know the guy who sold those packs also was selling some of the BMS's from some of the packs that were apparently disassembled. If it is the same board, then they do not balance. The shut down for over and under current and apparently if some of the cell groups get too far out of balance from some of the other cell groups.
Last edited by wturber on Aug 12 2018 6:26pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Commuter - DC Booster"
Iron Horse 3.0 hardtail - 48V / 1000W / 470rpm generic Chinese DD Hub motor (ebay)
8 x 36v 4.3ah 10s 2P battery packs - 1500W 30A DC Boost Converter delivers 54v and about 1000 watts peak
53T/42T Sakae Road cranks - 30mph+ on flats
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=90369

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Aug 12 2018 3:52pm

I`m not absolutely sure this is the exact model, but I would think so because it was about that size when I took a peak in the battery case (did not remove the battery heatshrink myself though and BMS writings where in chinese).

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 13 2018 2:50am

I was worried that was the case. Would be nice to find a replacement that was pin compatible to make it an easy swap. I have seen many that are rated IP67 which would be an added bonus.

I don't really feel the need to jump to 48V, but building a battery with more mAh that fit in the same form factor would be a "nice to have". There are times when another 25% range would be useful.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by docw009 » Aug 13 2018 9:19am

You really can't tell a BMS by the cover (heat sink), although the small size does suggest no room for balance circuits. I would expect an ebike battery to have balance circuits, but who knows. They are probably mandatory in Europe on new batteries.

I did have to search thru a lot of ebay listings to find both 10S and 13S BMS boards that had balance circuits. I figured vendors were just dumping the old stuff.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 13 2018 1:32pm

Well I guess it is worth taking a shot in the dark and emailing Ancheer. Maybe they will be nice enough to clarify things.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 15 2018 2:12am

linux4kix wrote:
Aug 13 2018 1:32pm
Well I guess it is worth taking a shot in the dark and emailing Ancheer. Maybe they will be nice enough to clarify things.
Well I received a response, but not much clarification.

Dear customer,
This is Linda from Customer service Dept. It's really my honor to be on your service.
Thanks for your message.

Sorry, our battery doesn't include the BMS system.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 15 2018 2:54am

However last night I started down a new rabbit hole that seems like it will really scratch my itch for modding this ebike. I am looking at motor controllers that will be a relatively straight forward drop in replacement, but support OpenSource firmware. I found this project which seems like a good start, https://github.com/stancecoke/BMSBatter ... s_firmware along with lots of threads and forums discussing it.

Ideally what I want is an EU compatible ebike that allows throttle speed control. This would allow/require

1) throttle walk assist always on limited to 6kph
2) throttle controllable but only when pedalling.
3) motor cut out at 25kph ( this is less important to me since Denmark just allowed speed pedelecs, up to 40kph, on the bike paths and without registration or insurance )

The torque sensor simulation motor controllers do seem like another interesting avenue.

I currently have the throttle installed on my Ancheer and use that even though I always pedal. I just feel that you have better control over the bike at slower speeds, and cornering.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 15 2018 1:28pm

Been a busy week with the bike. This AM my new tires showed up, Schwalbe Big Apple Plus 20/2.15. It was a tight fit in the existing fenders but with some minor tweaks I was able to get full clearance. Wow what a difference! They roll much better, easily hitting 35kph on flats even without my larger front sprocket that is still in transit. Ride is much better as well. Everything feels more stable going down hills and taking corners. The Big Apple's would probably be a better fit but I wanted the additional puncture resistance of the Plus.

Some pics of all my mods. https://photos.app.goo.gl/AomF7deiXrjwN6KV7

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Aug 15 2018 5:20pm

Nice thanks for the pics! I like the seat with the Thudbuster !
What's the name of that rear rack box you got.
Love the rear light mod too !

I put you pics directly on the forum:
20180815_193913.jpg
20180815_193925.jpg
20180815_194000.jpg

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Aug 15 2018 5:21pm

How do you like your new tires ?
You did not like the original ones ?

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 15 2018 10:18pm

It is a Gerda Touring Box on the back. A SunTour suspension seatpost and gel saddle, super comfortable.

I always felt the Kenda tires were a bit jittery around corners and at faster speeds. I just never had much confidence in them. I will tell you the Big Apple Plus's make a huge difference. I have only ridden around on them after the original install, I can report back after I get through a week on them.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Aug 25 2018 1:37am

My replacement front chainring and crankset showed up finally, put it on last night. It is a 58T Single Speed Crank 170 mm Crank Arms 130 BCD LitePro fits perfect and didn't require a new chain. I have to say that this is probably the chainring that should have shipped with the bike. I feel the gearing is far more sensible for general use.
20180824_133059.jpg
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Quick update for posterity's sake. Took the bike out on a 15K ride. A bit of a head wind and a few stops but averaged about 28 km/h. Flats with no head wind I was holding 30 km/h easily with acceptable effort at a reasonable cadence. The wider Big Apple tires definitely help with the stability at this speed.

Overall I will say that this package now feels complete to me as a get around town and medium commute bike. My wife does a 5 mile commute to work each day and has been happy with the bike. With all the tweaks I have cut about 6 minutes off her time each way. Now to see how everything makes it through a second Danish winter ;)

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Aug 26 2018 7:47am

Nice work !


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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Sep 10 2018 9:31pm

More of the Inframe BATTERY pics. There is some kind of PCB, althought I doubt it is capable of balancing. More likely just a LVC and HVC that bricks the whole thing once cells get out of whack. So far so good though. Been 5 months of use and all 4P packs are 4.18 when fully charged (I always stay between 100% and 30% SOC, and when storing, never more than 39.5V).

Took some more pics after carefully dissecting...
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BMS or PCB writting on mine : SP-R13-068-A01-M10SY-8185/1709080380
TKBA engraved on aluminium cover.

Cells are FST 18650 2000 mAh in 10S4P configuration, as I said in earlier post (Datasheet PDF included at end) : viewtopic.php?f=2&t=93576#p1369212

Basically max discharge is 6.0A per cell (3C) and max charge is 2.0A (1C); standard charge 1.0A (0.5C).
So in theory, the battery is slightly overspeced for setup, with possible 24A max discharge even though controller is 7.5A continuous and 15A burst. BMS/PCB, I'm not so sure, this BMS is slightly different from what I thought it would initially be (see my previous post).

Theoretically, could safely charge at 4.0A and fastcharge at 8.0A. 4.0A would be way faster than with my 2.0A charger that came with the bike and can take up to 5 hours if really empty...

Posted for futur reference and because I was curious. Enjoy and feel free to comment.
If only someone could translate the chinese writings of pictures 2 and 3, that could be helpfull!

Matador
Last edited by Matador on Sep 11 2018 5:55pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Sep 10 2018 10:08pm

closest BMS I could find that fits the shape : https://www.elecycles.com/lithium-batte ... d-pcb.html

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Sep 10 2018 10:21pm

I'm really thinking of overclocking voltage from 10S to 14S.

250W (@nominal 36V) geared hub is manufacture spec'd at 350W @ 48V, so why not 52V (14S).

Caps in controller are all 63V.

FETS in controller are HY1607P (datasheet : https://datasheetspdf.com/pdf-down/H/Y/ ... -HOOYI.pdf )
These FETs seem good for 68V if i'm correct.

So at 14S, seems like it could work as it tops at 58.8V.

Even got a 48V version of the 36V 810LED-display I had...
I just can't burn my controller as I could NOT find any controller with similar cabeling...
Like this specific cabeling : viewtopic.php?f=2&t=93576&hilit=ancheer#p1369265

I crave for a spare controller to overvolt !

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by linux4kix » Sep 11 2018 8:59am

I had looked up the FETs previously to check the On State Resistance. Was pleasantly surprised it was so low, 6.8mOhm. You can find more efficient ones, but not nearly as bad as the stock ones that come in some of the Bafang motors. I think they are around 33mOhms.

I would be careful about going all the way up to 52V. Most the spec sheets for FETs are overly generous. There is an exact calculation that you can use to figure out FET sizing, but generally I think you want to keep your voltage something around the likes of 30% under what the rating of the FET is.

Thanks for the battery tear down. Saves me from having to do it to mine :)

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Sep 15 2018 12:09pm

So I' just did some preliminary testing to see If my stock controller (63V caps, 68V FETs) would handle 14S 58.8V (got 60 cells and a BMS ready for a new battery build).

I does handle it ! (See videos below). I pluged my ebike controller directly to a 58.8V charge. Works !

The thing though is the "Key-Disp KD26E" 36V 810LED display (also a PAS/throttle mode selector) that came stock has a 36V battery scale which is totaly inacurrate at 48 or 52 volts.

So I bought a 48V version of this Key-Disp KD26E on eBay. The scale is now very close to accurate, but for some reason this new display (same manufacturer, same model) does not allow to used Throttle mode, which sucks ! Any way configure/reprogram the display ??? Anybody has similar experiences with 810LED swaps ????

Here are 3 vids to compare the cadence befor and after overvolting. Also shows the "no-lighten LED" setting that corresponds to throttle mode on the 36V display that does not exist on the 48V version (the 48volt version only allows to put low, medium or high.... I cannot put "no PAS level".

Ancheer FM001908 eBike @ 58.8V (14S) with 48V KD26E display (only allows PAS no throttle)


Ancheer FM001908 eBike @ 58.8V (14S) with 36V KD26E stock display (allows PAS and Throttle)


Ancheer FM001908 eBike with stock 36V 8Ah battery @ 41.7V (full charge) with stock 36V KD26E display :


So it seems that I could run the 20 inch ebike stock controller with a 14S rather than a 10S battery.
That's an increase from 280 wheel RPM (28 km/h) to 390 wheel RPM () top speed... Should better cope with my new larger chainring and smaller rear gears (see previous posts).

If only I could see voltage correctly on that 36V throttle-mode capapble stock 810LED display. Or if I could just find a way to activate throttle mode on the 48V accurate dispay. Any advice on this issue would be super appreciated !

Matador
Last edited by Matador on Sep 15 2018 1:07pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: OVERCLOCKING an ANCHEER 20 inch folding ebike (Model AM001908 36V20" 250W)

Post by Matador » Sep 15 2018 12:23pm

So I played video #3 (10S battery @ 41.7V) and video #2 (14S equivalent full charge @ 58.8V), both vids in vey slow motion.

At 41.7V (video #2 played at 0.25X), I counted 120 wheel rotations in the course of 20 full seconds (from 1:21 to 1:40 just before turning to 1:41).
So that's 360 wheel RPM @ 41.7V (at least in free air, that's 34.5 km/h or 21.1 mph).
BTW, Extrapolating for a nominal voltage 36.0V average, we would get 29.8 km/h or 18.0 mph.
In practive, I've seen 28 km/h (speed radar) while pedelling after a 10 km ride (sdo I'm gessing around 37.5-38V). Account for fictionnal lost, drag and voltage sag under "real" load I guess.

Now at 58.8 (video #3 played at 0.25X), I counted 135 wheel rotations in the course of 15 full seconds (from 1:01 to 1:16 just before turing to 1:17).
So that's 540 wheel RPM @ 58.8V (at least in free air, that's 51.7 km/h or 32.1 mph).
By extrapolationg for 14S nominal average voltage (50.4V), I'm guessing we would get aroing 44.3 km/h or 27.3 mph
I dunno In practice thought as drag would be exponentially significant with speed in addition to friction from bearings and voltage sag under load, but I think I should be able to hit 37-38 km/h if not 40 km/h. That would be more than I would need. I just wanna cruise 32-35 km/h...

Now I need to build a 14S battery. Got 60 LG MF1 2150 mAh 10A cells and a 14S 45A BMS...

Matador

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