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Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 8:52pm
by mickk
I cant rremember where this nut should be positioned when I install the cassette, any clues?
Also whats the correct term so I can retitle this for future reference.
Ive looked everywhere, cant find the answer.
Thanks.
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Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 9:02pm
by e-beach

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 9:08pm
by mickk
I see thanks.
Its a locknut but theres nothing behind it to lock.
Is it supposed to be just under the rim of the hub, out of the way of the cassette?
Beacuse once the cassette is fitted, its hidden.
Do I take it off and use it after the cassette is installed so it goes on the outside of that?
Or should I screw it all the wat in?

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 9:22pm
by e-beach

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 10:05pm
by mickk
If the cassette lock ring holds the cassette on, then I guess this nut is for sitting inside the drop outs? withthe other nuts and washers?
Perhaps it goes on the other side to protect where the cable comes out of the axle? and was where it is to put it out of the way for shipping?

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 10:18pm
by e-beach
It holds the bearing cone against the bearings. It is inside the dropouts.

:D

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 10:23pm
by mickk
The bearings inside the hub shell are sealed, there are no cones :shock:

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 10:29pm
by e-beach
Your picture seems to show a bearing cup deep inside.

:D

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 10:35pm
by mickk
I can assure you theres no cones they are sealed bearings.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 10:52pm
by e-beach
Check this out and see if it is more like you got...

http://bicyclepatents.com/removing-repl ... eels/1673/

:D

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 20 2018 11:57pm
by Chalo
mickk wrote:
Sep 20 2018 10:05pm
If the cassette lock ring holds the cassette on, then I guess this nut is for sitting inside the drop outs? withthe other nuts and washers?
For cripes' sake, go to a bike shop. They'll sort you out, and the better kind of shop will show you what you want to know. But you are at the point where you should have a pro fix your bike, then do some research.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 21 2018 12:49am
by mickk
Chalo wrote:
Sep 20 2018 11:57pm
mickk wrote:
Sep 20 2018 10:05pm
If the cassette lock ring holds the cassette on, then I guess this nut is for sitting inside the drop outs? withthe other nuts and washers?
For cripes' sake, go to a bike shop. They'll sort you out, and the better kind of shop will show you what you want to know. But you are at the point where you should have a pro fix your bike, then do some research.
Oh ye of little faith. Youve gone off too soon. Just because you dont know doesnt mean all the users of the forum are ignorant on the subject.

What I have discovererd here is a gap in the knowledge base of wheel building. All rear hubs are shipped with this nut, its simply for sitting almost flush with the lock ring, i.e. it is really used as a spacer on the drive side to stop pressure being applied directly to the lock ring of the cassette and or to act as a stop for the inward pressure applied by the frame when tightening the bolts on the axle. I stand to be corrected as I am only using common sense. I can find no diagrams, videos, instructions featuring the manufacturers instructions for this nut.

When you look at all the information on wheel building, the location of this nut is a given and never described.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 21 2018 1:36am
by Chalo
I've been a shop bicycle mechanic for a long time, starting in 1992. I've also been a big proponent of sealed bearing hubs from back when they were uncommon and poorly understood.

The most important thing for sealed bearing hubs is to avoid placing the bearings under a static thrust load. So you either need an axle with correctly spaced shoulders for the bearings, or paired locknuts that can be tightened against each other on the axle without tightening against the bearings. It's not necessary to have both, but there's no real drawback to having both.

It's always a good idea to solicit the attention of a seasoned professional technician with this stuff. At the least, you'll probably come away with better insights than what you had before.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 21 2018 11:21am
by Voltron
Are you really really sure its sealed bearing, as in removable cartridge bearing? Sometimes the freehub side looks like it is but has regular bearing races inside the freehub. Either way, as Chalo said.. usually there's some locknut action involved on cheaper ones, or brand specific perfectly machined spacers and threaded caps or something on expensive ones.
freehub.jpg

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 21 2018 12:45pm
by Voltron
And usually you have to take off the left side nuts so the axle slides far enough out the freehub side to where you can get at it and lock it together like in the picture before sliding it back in.. then adjust it from the left side.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 21 2018 2:22pm
by Voltron
Hey, I get it suddenly, this is on a hub motor, and not just a hub? Then that nut just might screw on without normal locknutting, with some spacers to get the final one out past the cassette. Ideally the final one has the knurling on the outside to get it to bite into the dropout.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 22 2018 9:43pm
by mickk
Voltron wrote:
Sep 21 2018 2:22pm
Hey, I get it suddenly, this is on a hub motor, and not just a hub? Then that nut just might screw on without normal locknutting, with some spacers to get the final one out past the cassette. Ideally the final one has the knurling on the outside to get it to bite into the dropout.
Correct!

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 22 2018 9:48pm
by e-beach
mickk wrote:
Sep 22 2018 9:43pm
......
Correct!
You know, you haven't been very clear on your question. Do this, give us more photographs of what you have so we don't have to play 20 questions. Show us all the parts in clear photographs and you will get a clearer answer.

:D

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 22 2018 10:41pm
by mickk
Silly me I thought posting in ebike technical, it would be a given that I was talking about an electric bike.
More fool me for thinking that when I said no cones, I would be believed.
Dont blame me for people going off on tangents, pretending to know what they dont know.

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 22 2018 10:57pm
by e-beach
mickk wrote:
Sep 22 2018 10:41pm
Silly me I thought posting in ebike technical, it would be a given that I was talking about an electric bike.
More fool me for thinking that when I said no cones, I would be believed.
Dont blame me for people going off on tangents, pretending to know what they dont know.
I agree, silly you. Don't make assumptions and think it is other people whom don't get it. If you want help, play friendly or you get targeted as someone to ignore. And yes it would be your fault again that nobody around here will help you.

Post more pictures of your total setup and we will be more informed on how to help you.

:D

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 22 2018 11:59pm
by Voltron
mickk wrote:
Sep 22 2018 10:41pm
Silly me I thought posting in ebike technical, it would be a given that I was talking about an electric bike.
More fool me for thinking that when I said no cones, I would be believed.
Dont blame me for people going off on tangents, pretending to know what they dont know.
An FYI, many an ebike these days has a crank drive where it uses a normal rear hub instead of a hubmotor, and hub motors with cassette instead of freewheel were less common until recently, and cartridge bearings usually don't go together with threaded axle, hence the confusion of the people trying to help you about what you have going on there...

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Sep 23 2018 9:58am
by e-beach
Not to mention people who run front hub motors.

:D

Re: Where does this nut go?

Posted: Oct 05 2018 3:56am
by mickk
God help America.