How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

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Jamesavery22   1 mW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Jamesavery22 » Dec 02 2019 9:49pm

Does anyone make a high quality electric throttle? Or does this cable pull adaptor work and of decent quality?
https://cart.electricscooterparts.com/p ... e=THR%2D99

Tommm   100 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Dec 03 2019 3:53am

Jamesavery22 wrote:
Dec 02 2019 9:49pm
Does anyone make a high quality electric throttle? Or does this cable pull adaptor work and of decent quality?
https://cart.electricscooterparts.com/p ... e=THR%2D99
Domino throttle is the best, it will make even the stock controller usable with the right settings, but some people who ride motocross say it breaks all the same if you crash with it, but maybe they had it hanging off the end of their bar.
While it is working it is certainly the best.

SlowCo   100 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by SlowCo » Dec 03 2019 6:41am

Tommm wrote:
Dec 03 2019 3:53am
Jamesavery22 wrote:
Dec 02 2019 9:49pm
Does anyone make a high quality electric throttle? Or does this cable pull adaptor work and of decent quality?
https://cart.electricscooterparts.com/p ... e=THR%2D99
Domino throttle is the best, it will make even the stock controller usable with the right settings, but some people who ride motocross say it breaks all the same if you crash with it, but maybe they had it hanging off the end of their bar.
While it is working it is certainly the best.
Some members here have successfully used a throttle box combined with a OEM brand cable twist throttle assembly from a motorcycle (scrapyard):
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=102355&p=1513419&h ... e#p1513419

Here is the link to it:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3295490 ... 4c4diIEkju

Jamesavery22   1 mW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Jamesavery22 » Dec 03 2019 10:53am

What's the voltage put to the throttle? Is it not whatever the battery is? I saw the Domino has a max 40v.

Nvm. Makes sense. 5v:
https://electricbike.com/forum/filedata ... 1520442585

Are there any examples of wiring the Domino throttle to a Cyclone controller? Assuming it'll need some resistor in line.

Tommm   100 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Dec 03 2019 11:52am

Jamesavery22 wrote:
Dec 03 2019 10:53am
What's the voltage put to the throttle? Is it not whatever the battery is? I saw the Domino has a max 40v.

Nvm. Makes sense. 5v:
https://electricbike.com/forum/filedata ... 1520442585

Are there any examples of wiring the Domino throttle to a Cyclone controller? Assuming it'll need some resistor in line.
I already answered it here

viewtopic.php?f=28&t=88921&p=1513396&hi ... r#p1513396

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Skaiwerd   100 W

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Skaiwerd » Dec 03 2019 12:35pm

As for the domino throttle I put a 100k trimpot on the positive 5v throttle imput to lower it a little so the stock cyclone controller would not cut out under full throttle. Could also use it to act as a governor to lower the max power level, for newbie riders.

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fizzit   10 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by fizzit » Dec 06 2019 6:50am

You should call them, sometimes it will get stuck if the address is damaged, if the tracking number is intact they can find and update it for you.

For my package they had one of the tubes hanging out and sanding off the paint, I don't think it is packed as well as it should be for the weight and travel distance for the package.

I would ask for a payout even if it was $50, don't reward the animals for losing a package.
Yeah it's pretty frustrating, it's the most expensive thing I've gotten through USPS and they completely lost it. I opened a missing mail case, I tried to open a claim but the inquiry page says the tracking number is invalid. It works fine when I use it to track the package. Hopefully Paco was able to file a claim from his end.

Has anyone tried using this motor with a different controller? It seems like a good candidate for the Phaserunner (90V/96A max) or Nucular 6FET (90V/120A max). The stock controller seems ridiculously oversized for its power output and has a pretty limited feature set. The only potential issue I could see is the noisy hall sensor voltage waveform that I noticed when building my throttle converter, but that might be fixable with an RC filter on the halls.
-Colin

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Dec 06 2019 9:03am

fizzit wrote:
Dec 06 2019 6:50am
You should call them, sometimes it will get stuck if the address is damaged, if the tracking number is intact they can find and update it for you.

For my package they had one of the tubes hanging out and sanding off the paint, I don't think it is packed as well as it should be for the weight and travel distance for the package.

I would ask for a payout even if it was $50, don't reward the animals for losing a package.
Yeah it's pretty frustrating, it's the most expensive thing I've gotten through USPS and they completely lost it. I opened a missing mail case, I tried to open a claim but the inquiry page says the tracking number is invalid. It works fine when I use it to track the package. Hopefully Paco was able to file a claim from his end.

Has anyone tried using this motor with a different controller? It seems like a good candidate for the Phaserunner (90V/96A max) or Nucular 6FET (90V/120A max). The stock controller seems ridiculously oversized for its power output and has a pretty limited feature set. The only potential issue I could see is the noisy hall sensor voltage waveform that I noticed when building my throttle converter, but that might be fixable with an RC filter on the halls.
I kept it safe and bought a different yuyangking (same brand as stock controller)

It is cheap but square wave. Stock, 80A battery 220A phase (quite high) amps, there is a disassembly video of it, and compared to a 150A sabvoton, it is way beefier in the inside. I don't find this surprising as the 40/60a yyk can take 70-80a battery after a shunt mod.

https://www.aliexpress.com/i/32889268022.html

It will fit perfectly between the seatpost and wheel, if you open it up and cut 2.5cm from out of the alu box the non cable side and 1.5cm from the cable side.
The phaserunner is a lie, the amp depends on voltage. So at 72v you are looking at 45a battery. Forget it.

If you are advanced enough to correct the hall sensors then I think you could use just about anything.

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Skaiwerd   100 W

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Skaiwerd » Dec 06 2019 10:28am

I’d go nuclear 12f if you can afford it and it’s 4-5 month wait period. Power velocity is a very close 2nd to me if you want a controller faster, cheaper, a few less features like adjustable regenerative braking. Etc.

Sac037   10 mW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Sac037 » Mar 10 2020 5:13am

Update after 2.5 years of use.
Hi.
So after lots of uphill jumping and about 80kms a week and now on second battery, the mechanics and motor are still good.
I run @ 80 amp peak, on a steep accent its 80amps for a good few minutes flat out in first.
One thing that was starting to fail is the posts that support the metal planetary gears.
They are fuse welded to a round plate.
The fuse welds cracked and the gear noise increases alot, as the gears get out of alignment.
Good news. The 3 planet gears are softer than the pinion and ring gear.
If the shafts did break off, which was going to happen very soon, the gearbox would have been a complete write off.
The fix.
Ordered new gears and post plate assembly.
I will get a welder at work to add a descent fillet weld to the posts. Should be indestructible.
In the pic i changed one gear to plastic to check mesh. Until new gears arrive.
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Skaiwerd   100 W

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Skaiwerd » Mar 11 2020 6:39pm

Thanks for the update and info on amps and such. Are you running 72v? There has been some cyclone bashing, 3000w version mostly, but a low price point at first means a swap out when things break and wear out are cheaper. Twice the price for maybe better is a gamble. Thinking of this motor on a Honda grom frame they only cost about $130 new but I have to see if it is too small.

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Sac037 » Apr 08 2020 4:06am

I have a 3000w kit on another bike. And it is no where near as reliable as the coaxial.
I only get about 100 hours before the motors blow.
So far i have blown 4 of them at 40 amps.
The coaxial leaves it for dust.

BonafideZoocity   1 µW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by BonafideZoocity » Apr 10 2020 2:07am

Hey all,

As has been stated here earlier there's lots of good info here as I'm studying different bike options.

Currently I'm looking at the Elite Cyclone Coaxial. I've assembled my own bike previously and did lots of work with RC vehicles so I'm not concerned about the prospect of learning and making things work.

Really, after messaging Paul at cyclone-tw, I'm not sure it makes much financial sense to get the frame and motor kit over the un-assembled full bike kit. I can't get the elite-motor site to work so I'm essentially stuck with the cyclone-tw site which runs about $200 higher in price.

All of these are without a battery as I'd source a 52v battery elsewhere.
Frame and motor/controller kit shipped to my door: $1,168.70
Complete kit without wheels shipped to my door: $1,817.40
Complete kit with 26" wheels shipped to my door: $1,947.40

I'd have to find wheels, a fork, a rear shock, rear derailleur, chain, cassette, brakes, levers, shifters, etc. all to complete the kit under $779 which is a feat. I can find some cheap second hand components but I'm not sure I can swing anything that well. I do understand that I could acquire better components piecing them together separately but I'm not using the bike for anything more than enjoying the outdoors and getting around town occasionally.

I guess I'm looking for some input whether this is a fair price for this kit based on experiences.

Thanks.

Tommm   100 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Apr 12 2020 1:42pm

BonafideZoocity wrote:
Apr 10 2020 2:07am
Hey all,

As has been stated here earlier there's lots of good info here as I'm studying different bike options.

Currently I'm looking at the Elite Cyclone Coaxial. I've assembled my own bike previously and did lots of work with RC vehicles so I'm not concerned about the prospect of learning and making things work.

Really, after messaging Paul at cyclone-tw, I'm not sure it makes much financial sense to get the frame and motor kit over the un-assembled full bike kit. I can't get the elite-motor site to work so I'm essentially stuck with the cyclone-tw site which runs about $200 higher in price.

All of these are without a battery as I'd source a 52v battery elsewhere.
Frame and motor/controller kit shipped to my door: $1,168.70
Complete kit without wheels shipped to my door: $1,817.40
Complete kit with 26" wheels shipped to my door: $1,947.40

I'd have to find wheels, a fork, a rear shock, rear derailleur, chain, cassette, brakes, levers, shifters, etc. all to complete the kit under $779 which is a feat. I can find some cheap second hand components but I'm not sure I can swing anything that well. I do understand that I could acquire better components piecing them together separately but I'm not using the bike for anything more than enjoying the outdoors and getting around town occasionally.

I guess I'm looking for some input whether this is a fair price for this kit based on experiences.

Thanks.
A few things,
1, Ignore the pricing on the web pages, ask for an offer from them in mail.
2, The gear the bikes come with as a complete bike is fairly low end, they don't compare at all to what you could build it with for a similar price. Asking as a full bike will also increase you ship cost and tax cost!
3, You can get a banging, modern mid range setup from $800 if you get used(like new) quality wheels a fork on clearance and the rest new.
4, Be sure to ask for a tapered headtube frame for future proofing, and get a dnm 200mm eye to eye coil shock, $40), or maybe even 210. The 190mm they advise as standard is leaving a lot of suspension travel on the table.
5, Ask for the 142mm rear dropout as opposed to 170mm fatbike. Since the frame is steel, it is quite flexible, I used 148mm hub from day 1 and now even 150mm (dh standard).
6, Bike will happily eat 26, 27.5 or 29" wheels if you fork does too. 26 forks will generally eat 27.5 tires and long as you keep it under 2.8, same goes with 27.5 forks eating 29" wheels.

Example build for you resulting in incomparably better setup for a similar price:
- Dnm rear coil shock 200-210mm $40
- Shimano RD-M6000-GS long cage (42t max) $40 from aliexpress
- Boolany 9s 50t cassette with extender (use extender as hanger) $25
- Cassette spacer kit to fix chainline https://www.ebay.com/itm/233392370257 $15
- Sram x5/s500 9 speed shifter $25
- Clearance or lightly used, x-fusion fork 36mm stanchion 160-180mm travel, $230
For example:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/X-Fusion-Met ... 4143554435
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/X-Fusion-Swe ... 4226045111
First one 110x20mm axle, second one 110x15 axle, these are $1000 MSRP forks.
- Lightly used, like new Dt swiss wheel with ratchet 350 or 240 hub, $200
https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/2721437/ 100x15 front
https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/2708228/ 110x15 front, 29", will 90% fit linked 110x15 fork if you keep tire under 2.8
These are $600 MSRP wheels.
- Chain kmc e9 ept from rosebikes $25
- Chainring 30t narrow wide from aliexpress $8
- Long chainring bolts 10.5mm from ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/5pcs-lot-Bicyc ... 3314133858 $10
- Seat post, get the biggest offset one you can find, it will make the medium size bike feel roomier, $25
- Pedal, https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000791200114.html $28
- Brakes, magure mt5e (closer switch) 4 pot ebike/s-pedelec brakes for a pair $190
- Rotors, 203mm $8 each from aliexpress
- Tires, if you go 29" then possibly 2.25 29" marathon plus mtb, else supermoto-x 27.5" 2.8 $50
- Some brake mounts, and seat you may have some but whatever you like.
Optional but very good idea
- Domino highest quality throttle https://fasterbikes.eu/en/accessories/t ... p-throttle $90
- Resistor assortment to wire the throttle up Image you will need between 30 and 300 ohm, assortment has everything, $3

Stem, hanldebar, headset, headset spacers, don't bother, ask cyclone to send you some, they may do it for free (they did for me and I still use it).

$900 and you have components you would find on a $4000 e-MTB, instead of some cheap shiit you would find on a rental bike cyclone would give you.
Last edited by Tommm on Apr 18 2020 10:29pm, edited 4 times in total.

Tommm   100 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Apr 12 2020 2:15pm

Sac037 wrote:
Mar 10 2020 5:13am
One thing that was starting to fail is the posts that support the metal planetary gears.
They are fuse welded to a round plate.
The fuse welds cracked and the gear noise increases alot, as the gears get out of alignment.
Do you think it is an accident or it is bound to crack for everyone else?

A bit of an update for my latest mods:
Image
90v max 30w 6 led:
Image
Image
Image

I pulled it up with cable ties to rest it against the phone mount, so it doesn't wander away from it's position.


90v max Usb charger with led indicator:
Image

Both connected to main battery ignition return wire. I never run out of phone charge or visibility as long as my bike is moving.

Usb powered motor temperature sensor (old mod but now usb male connector, goes in the charger when I don't charge phone):
Image

To stop chain jumping off while under load+suspension bumping in very rare cases, top chain guide, it doesn't stick out sideways:
Image
Image

I style and use my bike somewhere between a lowrider cruiser on road+trial bike when offroad, neither of these require a high seat. So I lowered it as far as possible.
Seat post shortened 15mm total, including external seat post clamp profile:
Cut off 18mm
Image
Image
Simply add one of these
Image
No extra drilling required, factory cutout still pulls it together.
Image

Suspension still clears my seat perfectly under full depression

Sac037   10 mW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Sac037 » Apr 12 2020 4:30pm

Tommm wrote:
Apr 12 2020 2:15pm
Sac037 wrote:
Mar 10 2020 5:13am
One thing that was starting to fail is the posts that support the metal planetary gears.
They are fuse welded to a round plate.
The fuse welds cracked and the gear noise increases alot, as the gears get out of alignment.
Do you think it is an accident or it is bound to crack for everyone else ?
The new one i ordered had better welds, but i still beefed it up with a bigger fillet weld.
Running up to 80 amps is the killer. I have backed it off to 70, its a big difference in agressive acceleration but still just as much fun.
I would say 80amps is really pushing it.
On a full charge under load that's about 6000w
So 5000w is probably the best compromise for longevity and performance.
72v nominal 70 amps peak.
Depending on the cells used. I'm now using lg hg2
On full charge 84v they pull down to 76v under full load.

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Sac037 » Apr 12 2020 4:45pm

Hey tomm
Where are you getting kmc e9 chain for $25 ?
Its costing me about 80.
Only chain worth buying.

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Apr 13 2020 4:06am

Sac037 wrote:
Apr 12 2020 4:45pm
Hey tomm
Where are you getting kmc e9 chain for $25 ?
Its costing me about 80.
Only chain worth buying.
https://www.rosebikes.com/kmc-e9-e-ept- ... ke-2666252

Order 2 or 3 for free/cost effective shipping.

For some reason you can't find these on aliexpress like the $17 x9-93, I guess it isn't made in china or something.

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fizzit   10 kW

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by fizzit » Apr 14 2020 8:54pm

I hadn't heard of that chain before. I'll have to check it out, I'm already on my second chain at 500 miles.

Here's how my bike is looking these days:
Image

Image

I switched to mudhugger fenders, the old ones really weren't cutting it for the downpours we were having a couple months ago.
I added a 9V 1.1A DC-DC converter to the box with the throttle converter, it's powering a 6W Lezyne E115. I've liked it a lot because it's bright but the beam pattern is shaped so it doesn't blind other riders or drivers. For the taillight I went with a Supernova M99, it was a bit pricey but insanely bright. Like Tommmm I have the DC-DC hooked up to the key switch.

Image

Image

I'm still riding on the original suspension bushings and shock, I haven't done any offroading so they don't see too much stress.
-Colin

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Skaiwerd   100 W

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Skaiwerd » Apr 15 2020 6:53pm

fizzit wrote:
Apr 14 2020 8:54pm
I hadn't heard of that chain before. I'll have to check it out, I'm already on my second chain at 500 miles.

Here's how my bike is looking these days:
Image

Image

I switched to mudhugger fenders, the old ones really weren't cutting it for the downpours we were having a couple months ago.
I added a 9V 1.1A DC-DC converter to the box with the throttle converter, it's powering a 6W Lezyne E115. I've liked it a lot because it's bright but the beam pattern is shaped so it doesn't blind other riders or drivers. For the taillight I went with a Supernova M99, it was a bit pricey but insanely bright. Like Tommmm I have the DC-DC hooked up to the key switch.

Image

Image

I'm still riding on the original suspension bushings and shock, I haven't done any offroading so they don't see too much stress.
Hopefully you put some electrical tape on your white colored connectors that I see down by your crank. A little water there and you could go full throttle. You should know how I know this.

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by TRB.206 » Apr 18 2020 11:01am

Thank you all for sharing your experiences. I’m a first time poster building my first ebike. I’ve built a few high performance 2-stroke motorized bicycles for the Socal Motor Bicycle Racing series so I’m not new to tinkering and modifying things till it’s just right. I went from racing cars to racing 69cc bicycles, the bicycles themselves are still relatively new to me I admit. I decided on this motor/frame combo thanks to all the information here. I’m about ready to start ordering parts but I have some unanswered questions I hope you can help with:

Drivetrain- I’m motivated to make the most robust drivetrain possible, even better if it can shift under power(like 3000w) I kinda wanted to run SRAM EX-1 which I saw someone here using, but I noticed according to their site they have either 18 tooth chainring for Bosch mid-motors or 34-tooth chainring for Brose and Yamaha motors. Can I run that 34t on the cyclone coaxial? How about the 18?
Can any of you shift under power with your setups? Maybe I can accomplish this without using EX-1

Instead of having a gear set in the rear, can I run a single speed in the rear and a triple chainring on the front? Is this possible, would it provide adequate gearing? Do you recommend against this?

Motor - It looks like Cyclone is only offering the 4.8kw motor on their website now, I was going to choose the 4kw motor because that’s adequate for the power I want (I can probably still ask them for one), but should I just buy the 4.8kw instead? I intend on running 72v at 50amp continuous and maybe upgrade to 60amp continuous later.

PAS - From what I’ve gathered, PAS is not effective in this build unless you have a 3-speed switch. If I, say, reduce the power to 1000watts, would I be able to use PAS? I really want to use it and I’ll do whatever it takes to make it work.

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Apr 18 2020 10:48pm

TRB.206 wrote:
Apr 18 2020 11:01am
I’m about ready to start ordering parts but I have some unanswered questions I hope you can help with:
If you want to order parts, I just updated and detailed my parts list from my own build for some things that wouldn't be evident for a first time builder here.
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=88921&p=1545511#p1545511
TRB.206 wrote:
Apr 18 2020 11:01am
Drivetrain- I’m motivated to make the most robust drivetrain possible, even better if it can shift under power(like 3000w) I kinda wanted to run SRAM EX-1 which I saw someone here using, but I noticed according to their site they have either 18 tooth chainring for Bosch mid-motors or 34-tooth chainring for Brose and Yamaha motors. Can I run that 34t on the cyclone coaxial? How about the 18?
Can any of you shift under power with your setups? Maybe I can accomplish this without using EX-1
First off, this bike in functionality is way closer to a moped than a bike. In looks it is closer to a bike. So you don't need to buy these overpriced overmarketed weight weenie stuff that doesn't last 2x longer, but costs 20x more. You won't need to shift near as much as on a bike, you can pretty much set it and forget it, unless you have a change in terrain (more on that later).
TRB.206 wrote:
Apr 18 2020 11:01am
Instead of having a gear set in the rear, can I run a single speed in the rear and a triple chainring on the front? Is this possible, would it provide adequate gearing? Do you recommend against this?
The suspension of bikes like this means the chain line grows in length as your suspension travels, so even if you didn't have a derallieur in the rear, you would still need a chain tensioning device similar to a derallieur. You wouldn't be ahead at all.
You could go single speed chain/219 gokart chain though, but you'd have to figure out how to mount it both front and rear and tension it.
Neither of these have a narrow wide arrangement that helps chain retention as multispeed cogs do. The coaxial has a loooong chainline so unless you have good tension and guidance it wants to throw chains during bumps. The main ratio you will want to use with 72v is 30t front/50t rear off road (35mph tops), and 30t front/36t rear on road (45mph tops). If I had 7kw instead of 5kw, I would only need the 45mph top speed gear.
TRB.206 wrote:
Apr 18 2020 11:01am
Motor - It looks like Cyclone is only offering the 4.8kw motor on their website now, I was going to choose the 4kw motor because that’s adequate for the power I want (I can probably still ask them for one), but should I just buy the 4.8kw instead? I intend on running 72v at 50amp continuous and maybe upgrade to 60amp continuous later.
4.8kw is the 4kw that either got updated or uprated. Don't worry about it.
TRB.206 wrote:
Apr 18 2020 11:01am
PAS - From what I’ve gathered, PAS is not effective in this build unless you have a 3-speed switch. If I, say, reduce the power to 1000watts, would I be able to use PAS? I really want to use it and I’ll do whatever it takes to make it work.
PAS doesn't work for this controller or motor. The PAS doesn't fit in the motor for one, maybe an external PAS ring you'd have to add, and the controller doesn't support it. It is an on/off switch, as dangerous as it sounds. Again, this is a moped, not a bike, it just looks like one. You won't be able to pedal in sync with the motor as it spins 700rpm while your legs do 100. You will be able to pedal home if you run flat though.

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Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by TRB.206 » Apr 20 2020 1:49am

Thanks for the great parts list :thumb:

I’ll stick to a gear cluster in the rear and single sprocket in front. I’ve decided not to use the EX1, because of the price and mixed reviews. I’d love to try it one day though.

I’m going for more torquey gearing where 1st gear tops out at 20mph-ish, so I’m going with 22t in front. I played with the Cadence calculator and am posting a pic of the gearing I like most: 22t chainring + 26” wheels

Here’s why:

My first gear would be for off-roading hill climbs and super steep hills(Seattle has lots). 2nd gear for most common hills and putting around. My middle gears would be good for cruising between 22-39mph at 350-400rpm for max efficiency (cruising in the middle of the cassette where chainline is near perfect,) and top speed would theoretically be 68mph @ 700rpm using 22x18 gears (probably my 5th gear)
Since I’m getting the 104bcd adaptor it’ll be easy enough to try a larger chainring if I end up shifting too frequently for my taste. My gasbikes were all single speed so I’m really excited about shifting :D

Image Well I cant figure out how to post a pic

While I don’t intend on going over 50mph most of the time I do intend on putting my PPE on and finding out what the max speed is. The fastest I went on my gas bikes was 50mph. I’d be thrilled to hit 60mph on this build just for the footage (On a closed road)

My gasbikes use 24” wheels which handle better than 26’s on the racetrack. I was considering 24’s for this build too but since I intend to ride off-road I’m sticking to 26’s.

Now I need to pick out a rear ratchet style hub, cassette and derailer. I’m leaning towards a cassette where the first 3 gears are 1-piece.

PAS - I’m probably using a Lyen controller which accommodates PAS. I don’t mind an on/off switch if I can turn down the power to ~750watts when I want to pedal, hopefully that’ll work well enough.

Will be ordering the motor/frame tomorrow

Tommm   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1049
Joined: Apr 03 2018 2:32am

Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by Tommm » Apr 20 2020 5:38pm

TRB.206 wrote:
Apr 20 2020 1:49am
Thanks for the great parts list :thumb:

I’m going for more torquey gearing where 1st gear tops out at 20mph-ish, so I’m going with 22t in front. I played with the Cadence calculator and am posting a pic of the gearing I like most: 22t chainring + 26” wheels

Here’s why:

My first gear would be for off-roading hill climbs and super steep hills(Seattle has lots). 2nd gear for most common hills and putting around. My middle gears would be good for cruising between 22-39mph at 350-400rpm for max efficiency (cruising in the middle of the cassette where chainline is near perfect,) and top speed would theoretically be 68mph @ 700rpm using 22x18 gears (probably my 5th gear)
When it comes to the cassette, if you only use 3-4 cogs most of the time, after a while, if you use the rest they will skip as the chain and often used cogs will be worn in and the other cogs will be like new. If you then change to a new chain, then the 3-4 worn in cogs will skip. This is why it is generally a good idea to stay with 9 speed, and even then remove some cogs (more on that later).

I think I used the 22t for a while, with the 60a(modifiable to 70a+) controller, then I went with a 80a one, got a 30t chainring, I didn't miss it at all. You won't have trouble with power for hill climbs with 30 front 50 rear, or 32mph top speed. On inclines, you will loose grip on dirt way before you lack power, and on road inclines you will simply loop out way before you lack power. The 22t is integrated(part of the motor, $30-50 to replace) and non narrow wide, so it isn't viable long term anyway.

I got to 58mph on a whim with a saggy 72v battery and 80a controller, so depening on battery/tire it is easily doable.

This motor is great at bursts, lacking in heat sinks for continuous power. There are many upgrades to be done in that department. Polishing paint off inside/outside motor, putting heatsink outside, putting thermal potting compound inside on the windings, you name it. If you don't know what you are doing you can burn it, so check it often when you receive it so you learn what it likes/dislikes.

The wheel size, the 26" is getting less popular and it is becoming difficult to find good tires for it now, the frame will fit a 29" rear so with a 26" you will have a lot of empty space and can look goofy. I had a 26" 2.4 for a year, then changed to 27.5 2.8, both semi slick tires. The 27.5 are better at rolling over stuff off road and curbs too. Whatever you do, you need star ratchet(dt swiss 240/350 or similar) and not pawl hubs. I destroyed a pawl hub from the first throttle pull, rebuilt it, destroyed it again...

The gears, I don't even touch them when riding, it is more similar to a driving style switch in a car, offroad/city/road/pedaling all have their own gear, I put it in the right one and forget about it.

I see you have the right idea trying to keep the chainline straight, the spacer kit Iinked above will help you center all the useful cogs on your hub, the rest you can throw away.

TRB.206   100 µW

100 µW
Posts: 8
Joined: Apr 17 2020 10:57am

Re: How good is Cyclone 4kw coaxial suspension bike?

Post by TRB.206 » Apr 21 2020 3:06pm

Paco returned my email and said “ The PAS is not available with Elite frame kit, because it need to be left side belt drive”

When I asked if the 4kw could have PAS and if they were still available he said “ No, can only apply to enduro belt drive”

So now I’m reconsidering this build because pedal assist was pretty important to me, though not quite a deal breaker. There’s also another full-suspension frame that mates with the Bafang m620 and has a battery slot built into the frame. The m620 is not quite as powerful as the cyclone (1000watts) but it has 160nm of torque. However I’ve seen Andy Kirby on YoutTube push the m620 over 4000watts with no trouble so it’s kind of in the same league as the cyclone 4.8 coaxial except it has PAS integrated and works like a charm apparently. Back into the rabbit hole I go.

Here’s the frame:
https://m.alibaba.com/product/620115684 ... nduro.html

The motor:
https://m.alibaba.com/product/606675942 ... ultra.html

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