Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Nov 13 2020 4:23pm

Yeah, I have a bit of a plan to shrink it in all directions -

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Nov 20 2020 12:39am

Got a bit more fab work done over the last couple of evenings, I was struggling to find 44mm id tubing for the head tube then I had a brain wave.
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This old pit-bike frame looked to be close in dimensions
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Perfect!

Then I took to adding some strength to the motor mount plates
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This is 20 x 3mm flat bar - I tacked it at the start then slowly bent around tacking as I went then welded them up
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I had planned on TIG welding everything and leaving the welds (no sanding) but I got an air leak somewhere in my TIG torch/gas line which caused a bit of aggravation and a mess - I didn't take any pics of that bit - Was too busy being annoyed :lol:

Anyway long story short I went back to the trusty MIG (technically MAG but we don't need to have that discussion here) Got a few bits welded and mostly blended
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Someone asked on FB about the weight
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Excuse the butterfly scales :lol: that's 5.45 kg so far (That's about 12 pounds for the metrically challenged :P ) Hopefully should be able to keep it under 8kg including the swing-arm - A FUTR beta frame weighs 6.9kg for reference

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Nov 24 2020 12:33am

Bit more work done - Welding and strengthening the head tube area
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Weird camera angle on the last shot makes the frame look bent - I assure you it's not :thumb: The pics don't really give a good impression of what it looks like TBH I'll post a vid when I'm further through.

Pedrodemio   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Pedrodemio » Nov 24 2020 8:45am

I've been silently following this build for a while

If there is a dream bike for me, is someday building a similar frame as that, can't wait to see the results

Well done Chambers

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Nov 24 2020 4:14pm

Pedrodemio wrote:
Nov 24 2020 8:45am
I've been silently following this build for a while

If there is a dream bike for me, is someday building a similar frame as that, can't wait to see the results

Well done Chambers
Thanks

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 02 2021 12:15am

So I haven't completely disappeared - Apparently buying kids Christmas presents is more important than e-bike building :roll: :lol:.

Anyway with limited funds available and still waiting on parts I built a place holder swing-arm with some scrap I had lying around.
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Room left over for some additional strengthening of the pivot point..
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I will probably re-build this once I have the shock and hub in my hands (both on a VERY slow boat). Triangulation will be added between the pivot point and the hub and the rear most section will be replaced with some 6mm plate to hold the rear wheel.
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Tommm   100 kW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Tommm » Jan 02 2021 11:12pm

Chambers wrote:
Jan 02 2021 12:15am
Room left over for some additional strengthening of the pivot point..20210102_140123.jpg20210102_132914.jpg
If you are using an axle hole interface for the pivot it is better to weld some bushing holder instead of frame to axle action. Otherwise even if greased the pivot hole will be a half inch up and ovalised if you check it next year. :lol:
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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 03 2021 3:27am

Tommm wrote:
Jan 02 2021 11:12pm
Chambers wrote:
Jan 02 2021 12:15am
Room left over for some additional strengthening of the pivot point..20210102_140123.jpg20210102_132914.jpg
If you are using an axle hole interface for the pivot it is better to weld some bushing holder instead of frame to axle action. Otherwise even if greased the pivot hole will be a half inch up and ovalised if you check it next year. :lol:

Screenshot_20210103_051947.jpg
haha wow thats some good work!

Tommm   100 kW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Tommm » Jan 03 2021 10:29am

Chambers wrote:
Jan 03 2021 3:27am
Tommm wrote:
Jan 02 2021 11:12pm
Chambers wrote:
Jan 02 2021 12:15am
Room left over for some additional strengthening of the pivot point..20210102_140123.jpg20210102_132914.jpg
If you are using an axle hole interface for the pivot it is better to weld some bushing holder instead of frame to axle action. Otherwise even if greased the pivot hole will be a half inch up and ovalised if you check it next year. :lol:

Screenshot_20210103_051947.jpg
haha wow thats some good work!
What makes it better is the hole ovalised upwards on one side and downward on the other side. So there might have been some misalignment that is getting fixed (or getting worse) this way. When it gets long enough I plan on rounding the hole and making it take a press fit copper bushing. Maybe something harder.

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 11 2021 4:38am

Bit of linkage testing in real life.

BeachRider2016   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by BeachRider2016 » Jan 12 2021 2:09pm

Man, maybe someone can help you 3d print that part then cast in aluminum. It’ll be solid ! Great build btw, I’m definitely following.
My Ebike with chinese frame: viewtopic.php?t=83275
2nd Stealth clone ebb w/3k hub laced 19” dirt rim/tires
2 Walmart special dk duke fatties bbshd and the other w/1k rear hub motor
Full suspension fatty/AliExpress frame w/bbshd
29er hard tail w/tsdz 500w dyi programmed
Intense uzzi slx w/1600w mini cyclone
Trident fat trike 26” w/tsdz 500w diy programmed

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 12 2021 5:50pm

BeachRider2016 wrote:
Jan 12 2021 2:09pm
Man, maybe someone can help you 3d print that part then cast in aluminum. It’ll be solid ! Great build btw, I’m definitely following.
Thanks! The plan was to make the first iteration out of steel for testing purposes then when I find the time to build my CNC router it'll be made from aluminium.
Casting isn't a bad idea though! thanks

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 17 2021 4:32am

Bit of an update - Excuse the dodgy camera work...

Tommm   100 kW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Tommm » Jan 17 2021 5:38am

Chambers wrote:
Jan 17 2021 4:32am
Bit of an update - Excuse the dodgy camera work...
I think for a progressive spring rate you want the linkage to shock interface to ramp up in the rate it moves per cm of wheel travel, the further the wheel is in the travel. Is it setup that way?

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 17 2021 5:51am

Tommm wrote:
Jan 17 2021 5:38am
Chambers wrote:
Jan 17 2021 4:32am
Bit of an update - Excuse the dodgy camera work...
I think for a progressive spring rate you want the linkage to shock interface to ramp up in the rate it moves per cm of wheel travel, the further the wheel is in the travel. Is it setup that way?
Yes

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 17 2021 10:23pm

I think for a progressive spring rate you want the linkage to shock interface to ramp up in the rate it moves per cm of wheel travel, the further the wheel is in the travel. Is it setup that way?
Just to elaborate, because of the shape of the top linkage (kind of banana shape) and the associated position of the bottom link the rate of leverage changes throughout the travel of the swingarm

raggertje   10 mW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by raggertje » Jan 19 2021 7:53am

Hi chambers, great project! I’m following your progression closely :bigthumb:

I’m designing an aluminum battery box that is I’m going to be weld in my specialized demo 8 downhill frame for a 17S11P or a 18S10P battery. How much space do you give the battery in the box? Have you allready thought of waterproofing the box?

Keep on the great build!

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 20 2021 1:45am

raggertje wrote:
Jan 19 2021 7:53am
Hi chambers, great project! I’m following your progression closely :bigthumb:

I’m designing an aluminum battery box that is I’m going to be weld in my specialized demo 8 downhill frame for a 17S11P or a 18S10P battery. How much space do you give the battery in the box? Have you allready thought of waterproofing the box?

Keep on the great build!
Lots of variables to take into account TBH, depends on how your battery gets into the frame box i.e. side load or from the bottom etc.
I personally left enough room for a 5mm battery box (inside the down tube) on all sides when I did the CAD work but have ended up with a bit more. My battery box is going to bolted at the top and bottom of the down tube and kind of float inside the tube (not touch the sides) hope that helps

raggertje   10 mW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by raggertje » Jan 20 2021 2:08am

Yes I.m struggling with all those variables :wink: but there are challenges for :)

I'm also going for a bottom load, more strength in the frame with a closed alu box although things aren't easy to reach. I'm thinking of a 5-10mm gap between battery and box and fill it with foam but it is a good idea to fix the battery with bolts. But then again your battery must be in some kind of case I think.

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 20 2021 2:38am

raggertje wrote:
Jan 20 2021 2:08am
Yes I.m struggling with all those variables :wink: but there are challenges for :)

I'm also going for a bottom load, more strength in the frame with a closed alu box although things aren't easy to reach. I'm thinking of a 5-10mm gap between battery and box and fill it with foam but it is a good idea to fix the battery with bolts. But then again your battery must be in some kind of case I think.
Yes correct, I will have a box inside a box for my design - or perhaps a shrink wrapped battery attached to a plate.
My battery system idea is similar to a specialized kenevo (but with a much larger battery)

raggertje   10 mW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by raggertje » Jan 20 2021 3:43pm

Chambers wrote:
Jan 20 2021 2:38am
My battery system idea is similar to a specialized kenevo (but with a much larger battery)
Great idea, intergrating the skidplate/closing cap into the battery :thumb:

Buckow   10 µW

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Buckow » Jan 21 2021 3:18am

Amazing work. Out of curiosity what leverage ratios did you end up using? It looks like a nice rising rate linkage similar to the old Turner DH bikes.

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 21 2021 6:43am

Buckow wrote:
Jan 21 2021 3:18am
Amazing work. Out of curiosity what leverage ratios did you end up using? It looks like a nice rising rate linkage similar to the old Turner DH bikes.
Thanks! Yes very similar to a 2006ish Turner DHR. Leverage ratio is about 3.07 - 66 mm stroke with around 204 mm wheel travel (2.6 inches x 8 inches)
I may need to add a heavier spring (currently 550lbs) but I'll wait and see how it all pans out.

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Chambers   100 W

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Re: Custom frame for the Cyclone Coaxial motor

Post by Chambers » Jan 21 2021 6:52am

Buckow wrote:
Jan 21 2021 3:18am
Amazing work. Out of curiosity what leverage ratios did you end up using? It looks like a nice rising rate linkage similar to the old Turner DH bikes.
To be honest I must have redesigned the linkage at least 10 times - in the end I went with what felt about right with the view to modifying it in the future once I get a feel for how it rides

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