third GNG - The Kona Stinky

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christerljung   100 W

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third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Dec 05 2012 4:45pm

I couldn´t resist this little nimble thing. Got it for for 270$
Image
GNG will be ordered through aliexpress.
Last edited by christerljung on Dec 12 2012 10:17am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: third GNG -Kona Stiny

Post by melodious » Dec 05 2012 5:17pm

Yup. I'm just waiting for one to show up in a "for sale" section in my area :arrow: NICE FIND :!:

Hey is that a 69er? 26" in rear 29" in front :?:
Surly Ogre rigid 29er, rear 10T MAC @ 50V 25AH & 40A: 30mph road/gravel/hill machine
42" dual diagonal Eskateboard @6s & 90mm wheels
Next: eMTB @10-12s & 8"-12" pneumatic wheels; Got Strapped? d-(',')z

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snellemin   10 kW

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Re: third GNG -Kona Stiny

Post by snellemin » Dec 05 2012 5:33pm

Nice find. Might be my eyes, but it looks like the rear brake rotor is larger then the front.
Silent speed Racer

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG -Kona Stiny

Post by christerljung » Dec 06 2012 4:27pm

The pic is a bit strange, 26" both rear and front. Thats perfect now because winter spike tyres are most 26"
Yes rear disc is a larger one. Dont know if thats the original one but nice anyway.

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stiny

Post by christerljung » Dec 12 2012 6:34am

This Kona frame is really tight at the BB and swingarm mount. Had to file off the GNG-mount a little.
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The perfect frame for a torque strut mount. The lower shock-mount extra hole is in the exactly correct position.

Image

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Dec 14 2012 3:07pm

This weekend is dedicated to a chain encapsulation. The first reduction of the GNG is getting full protection from dirt, water and snow. Also it will be easier to keep it with plenty of grease and some protection if it jumps.

Image

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by crossbreak » Dec 15 2012 8:30pm

Great! that fast progress! finally someone takes me as an example :D

chain encapsulation sounds great. how will you make it? fiber glass, epoxy glue and polystyrene as a model?

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Dec 16 2012 2:09pm

Yeah, i like it fast. Beauty can wait, let´s have fun now :mrgreen:
It´s a simple solution with alu and plastic sheet from a cuttingboard.

Image

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deecanio   10 MW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by deecanio » Dec 16 2012 5:10pm

Very nice, watching this one with interest.

D
Kona Stinky 2004
Marzocchi JNR T's 2004
72V 10ah lipo
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Lyen 12 FET Jozz mod

Ariane   10 kW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by Ariane » Dec 20 2012 8:45am

deecanio wrote:Very nice, watching this one with interest.

D
Indeed good work :D

Black Arrow

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Feb 09 2013 5:32pm

Finally some progress. Batterymount is finished and next thing is to try the adjustable sheets together with my chainencapsulation.
Thanks for those fantastic sheets, Lighteningrods!!
Notice the upsized cranksprocket, 48t. What topspeed will that give with 24S :shock: :mrgreen:
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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by iovaykind » Feb 09 2013 11:31pm

any reason you bought off aliexpress? better price? i can't seem to find it

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by skyungjae » Feb 09 2013 11:57pm

Wow! 3rd GNG... then again, I am considering a second. :wink:
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

2005 Jamis Dakar build thread: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 27#p972546
2005 Kona Stink-E build thread: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 64#p690597

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Feb 15 2013 5:07pm

A little progress again. Got the cassette, derailleur and some other parts from CRC today.
Trying to fit the 48t ring on the exisiting GNG-chainring:
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skyungjae   10 kW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by skyungjae » Feb 15 2013 5:18pm

On my build, the inner chain ring was already quite close to the hex bolts going through the motor mount bracket. Hopefully you don't run into any clearance issues there.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

2005 Jamis Dakar build thread: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 27#p972546
2005 Kona Stink-E build thread: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 64#p690597

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by crossbreak » Feb 16 2013 2:47am

48T is nice! but for gearing it right for human speed, you would need 60-64T @ 44.4V/12s lipo ;)

Edit: Ok, that's BS, since I see you install a larger final drive chainring? Why do you do that?
Since it seems like you dont pedal anyway, it should even LOWER both torque and efficiency?!?! :shock: :shock:

for your needs a 36T final drive chainring would fit a lot better, you still use your 74V/20s lipo battery, do you?

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by crossbreak » Feb 16 2013 3:05am

OK is see you even want to use 24s lipo. That absolutely makes no sense at all. You will waste most energy to eddy current parasitic loss. The motor is made for 72V MAX for a reason.

If you want more speed, then you need more current, since your setup never runs into the good efficiency region.

I would try 12s lipo @ 60amps battery current limit.

But now that you own this setup: It would help a lot, if you could measure no-load current @24s lipo. this way we could see how much eddy current loss rises in fact!

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Feb 16 2013 4:57pm

I´m aware of the eddiecurrent problem. It´s easy to reroute the wiring for 72v if 88v seems bad.
This is a realworld test is to see if these "eddies" will be a obvius loss i accelleration at higher rpm:s. Or maybe it isn´t?
Even if there is a loss it would be nice to have a motor able to pull, both at low trail climbing speed (no losses and good torque, we already now that the GNG has massive torque), and HIGH speed ability. That´s what i meant in the GNG-thread, where you showed the diagrams. At first i didn´t realize that the diagram was without eddies.
It´s always better to make watts out of more volts. More amps gives more heat, thicker cables, thicker windings and so on. But ofcourse high voltage also got it´s problems.

Tonight i did finish the back drivetrain. A cheap Acera mesh will do the shifting. I liked the stable and big cage-wheels of this derailleur. But the angle of the shifting-cable is horrible. Not for off-road use. :?
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Last edited by christerljung on Feb 16 2013 5:16pm, edited 1 time in total.

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Feb 16 2013 5:12pm

crossbreak wrote:48T is nice! but for gearing it right for human speed, you would need 60-64T @ 44.4V/12s lipo ;)

Edit: Ok, that's BS, since I see you install a larger final drive chainring? Why do you do that?
Since it seems like you dont pedal anyway, it should even LOWER both torque and efficiency?!?! :shock: :shock:

for your needs a 36T final drive chainring would fit a lot better, you still use your 74V/20s lipo battery, do you?
Since the first reduction in this setup now is a 12/72 chain-kit, i got 6:1 reduction.
The 72v setup did never need to use the 20 - 34 coggs in the cassette, so thats why i want 48t finaldrive chainring. This will also help pedal cadense at >50kph. Ideally the chain would almost never need to use the smallest gears in the cassette, since these will be worn out too fast.
48t maybe was overkill, 46t would been more reasonable. My dream is to test this setup on the sea-ice soon. The first GNG above 100kph? :shock: :shock:

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by crossbreak » Feb 17 2013 4:22am

Great that you did not fix your battery voltage. Can you measure no-load current at 88.8V for us. I'm waiting keen to see this figure!

The graph below just looks too good to be true ;)

made some calcs about your setup. Seems like 100 km/h is out of range. Power is just too low. Needs a second GNG :twisted:
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Ariane   10 kW

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by Ariane » Feb 17 2013 8:01am

crossbreak wrote:Great that you did not fix your battery voltage. Can you measure no-load current at 88.8V for us. I'm waiting keen to see this figure!

The graph below just looks too good to be true ;)

made some calcs about your setup. Seems like 100 km/h is out of range. Power is just too low. Needs a second GNG :twisted:
Even at 88 Kph with your graph his ebike is faster than a Stealth Bomber :shock: :shock: :D
Black Arrow

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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Mar 27 2013 1:38pm

Finally i got it out on a little test.
I´m still on 18S 72 volt, need to re-program the controller before we fly on 88volt.
Anyway, i had some fun before the motorpulley was sliding on the shaft. Never got those setscrews in good thgtened way, it´s some strange size of the screw that i didn´t have the right tool for.
Was afraid that the gearing with 48t final drive would be too high, but in the big 34 cassette ring it felt really nice for some lounge-riding. Never had it in the high speed gears since i had to walk it home when the motorpulley said: stop.
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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Apr 01 2013 11:52am

I had a brutal ride yesterday. Got the controller configured for 24s 95A phase current and 65A rated. Also added power levels. I never got to open field to try full throttle at max power beacuse the chain jumped and destroyed the 52 chainring. The chain jumped at no power but a little jump when i was in the lowest gear (11t). Probably my homemade chaingudie wasn´t tight enough. Power was insanely brutal. CA was reading 100volt and 50 amps. It felt totally out of control. Gonna look for the magura/denisesewa throttle setup. And of course a professionally made chainguide.
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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Apr 06 2013 12:50pm

Made some more tests today.
Added a mud and waterprotection coat. Really ugly but all things (battery, motor, chains, frewheels and gears) are totally protected.
The freewheel was in the beginning of unscrewing itself so i added a little welddot to it.
The phase current was set down to 30A ,was 95A before. I just wanted to feel the difference.
30A Feels almost soft and lame. But there is just enough power to make a wheelie.
95A Is furious.
40% power in lowest power mode(out of three) gives ultra-slow creeping speed. Really stealthy and fun in the woods.
The gearing with 12/72 ,12/48 and 48/ 11-34 is absolutely great.
Another thing to notice is how silent the #25 first reduction is. It's maybe even more silent than the original belt.
The Kona original rockshocks fork is awful, probably needs a rebuild.
Kona frame feels nice for slow trail. Good low gravity balance with this setup. A little nervous in higher speed.
No possibillity to try the topspeed yet. 8)
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christerljung   100 W

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Re: third GNG - The Kona Stinky

Post by christerljung » Apr 07 2013 4:16am

This is how the first reduction looks now, with encapsulation(lid off):
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