GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modifications

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t0me   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by t0me » May 27 2013 3:56am

Just a bit of feedback. Since doing the chain mod, other than changing the secondary chain to a halflink one (thanks rp3) I've had to do nothing to the drivetrain other than charge and ride. It works. Works great. Highly recommend doing it, especially if you use your bike for XC or Offroading.
Kona Stink-E - GNG based mid-drive - http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 16#p839416
Giant Anthem - LightningRods mid-drive http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 7#p1008007

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jateureka   10 kW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by jateureka » Jun 26 2013 10:14pm

t0me,
is your chain conversion still holding up ok?
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t0me   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by t0me » Jun 26 2013 11:48pm

Yes, its excellent, has worked flawlessly since I did the mod.
Kona Stink-E - GNG based mid-drive - http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 16#p839416
Giant Anthem - LightningRods mid-drive http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 7#p1008007

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Secret1511   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Secret1511 » Aug 06 2013 8:53am

Hello,

Question how i get the adapter out of the big pulley?
Like to do the chain mod. I have a freewheel sprocket 65t
Banshee Chaparral
GNG 1.1
Lyen 12 fet mod 50a
LightningRods UpperSheets
18s2p lipo
Chain mod. 11t <> 65t

Denisesewa   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Denisesewa » Aug 06 2013 9:51am

Secret1511 wrote:Hello,

Question how i get the adapter out of the big pulley?
Like to do the chain mod. I have a freewheel sprocket 65t
Unscrew it , mine was tight as hell though.

Denisesewa   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Denisesewa » Aug 06 2013 9:58am

Denisesewa wrote:
Secret1511 wrote:Hello,

Question how i get the adapter out of the big pulley?
Like to do the chain mod. I have a freewheel sprocket 65t
Unscrew it , mine was tight as hell though.
Here is a pic of what mine looked like apart >>

http://s1191.photobucket.com/user/Denis ... 1957480235

meelis11   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by meelis11 » Aug 09 2013 1:49am

Hi,
has anybody measured amperage/wattage before and after primary drive modifications - how much motor is consuming in full speed and no load (back wheel off the ground)
All are saying that stock belt tensioner is robbing lots of energy - exactly how much?
I actually doubt that removing secondary tensioner gives you much efficiency gains - If it does then how much?

* I am currently running it in stock configuration and tensioners are needed, because that big belt wheel and small freewheeling sprocket are wobbling a bit - tensioner keeps chain tight.

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Miles   100 GW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Miles » Aug 09 2013 2:23am

meelis11 wrote:Hi,
has anybody measured amperage/wattage before and after primary drive modifications - how much motor is consuming in full speed and no load (back wheel off the ground)
All are saying that stock belt tensioner is robbing lots of energy - exactly how much?
I actually doubt that removing secondary tensioner gives you much efficiency gains - If it does then how much?
The short answer http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... 62#p631962 :)

Preamble: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... 69#p628669

meelis11   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by meelis11 » Aug 09 2013 5:14am

Cannot believe that you can drop load by 100W just by removing tensioner - my test was showing about 50W difference: belt-on with stock tensioner vs belt-off.

That big belt sprocket was hard to turn when I first time took belt off so I had to fix it (took freewheeling sprocket off and filed that tube-shaped spacer shorter about 0.5-1mm what is behind freewheel sprocket - that removed tension/resistance in that shaft)

Maybe I can make new test with photos to show difference between belt-on and belt-off. Now my motor consumes about 130W when in full speed and is driving belt but chain is off. When it drives off-the-ground bike wheel, it is about 150W

Meelis

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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by speedmd » Aug 09 2013 8:44am

Jack shaft has issues at least on the one I got. Bearing spacing was too tight causing compression of the outer races onto the balls. Shaft stack length (bearing shoulder to opposite side shoulder) was shorter than the support stack distances. When shaft / hub retainer nuts were tightened down, the shaft bound up and was overly stiff. Basic engineering tolerance error having the inner support spacers .1-.2mm too long and fighting this with ball compression. When I corrected this it spun like a bike wheel. The new solid support structure should be much better at holding tolerance. The way mine was, it would have been most likely been over a 50 watt loss just in the shaft.

t0me   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by t0me » Dec 12 2013 11:03am

Just a quick update on my primary chain mod.
I changed my secondary driven sprocket to a 48 and now I've broken the primary chain twice. Seems the 04b 6mm chain isn't up to it anymore.
Also, its difficult to get in Australia. #25 chain however seems to be available though and is 30% stronger from what I've found spec's wise. So I'll be re-modifying to take that chain (and try to up the ratio a little on the primary).
Just need to find a #25 10mm bore 11t sprocket. TNT don't have them in stock and I haven't had any luck finding one locally yet.

The drive sprockets I've seen use a through pin. Has anyone just modified one like that (tapped those holes) to use grub screws instead? Theoretically I think that'd work? I'd rather not drill through my output shaft if I can avoid it.
Kona Stink-E - GNG based mid-drive - http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 16#p839416
Giant Anthem - LightningRods mid-drive http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 7#p1008007

Denisesewa   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Denisesewa » Dec 12 2013 11:12am

t0me wrote:Just a quick update on my primary chain mod.
I changed my secondary driven sprocket to a 48 and now I've broken the primary chain twice. Seems the 04b 6mm chain isn't up to it anymore.
Also, its difficult to get in Australia. #25 chain however seems to be available though and is 30% stronger from what I've found spec's wise. So I'll be re-modifying to take that chain (and try to up the ratio a little on the primary).
Just need to find a #25 10mm bore 11t sprocket. TNT don't have them in stock and I haven't had any luck finding one locally yet.

The drive sprockets I've seen use a through pin. Has anyone just modified one like that (tapped those holes) to use grub screws instead? Theoretically I think that'd work? I'd rather not drill through my output shaft if I can avoid it.
Yep, I drilled and tapped the drive sprocket, filed flats on the shaft for the screws to sit against and have had no problems, Try to source "Diamond" #25 chain , best specs of any #25 I could find, If I remember right its availible through combat robot sites.

t0me   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by t0me » Dec 20 2013 4:47am

Nice one thankyou.

Ran into some problems today after fitting some new 04b chain (till the new 25 chain and sprockets arrive).
My controller died...

I'll post in the main GNG thread about it, some weird stuff happening with the "spare" controller I had.
Kona Stink-E - GNG based mid-drive - http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 16#p839416
Giant Anthem - LightningRods mid-drive http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 7#p1008007

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Whiplash   100 MW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Whiplash » Dec 20 2013 3:31pm

Denisesewa wrote:
t0me wrote:Just a quick update on my primary chain mod.
I changed my secondary driven sprocket to a 48 and now I've broken the primary chain twice. Seems the 04b 6mm chain isn't up to it anymore.
Also, its difficult to get in Australia. #25 chain however seems to be available though and is 30% stronger from what I've found spec's wise. So I'll be re-modifying to take that chain (and try to up the ratio a little on the primary).
Just need to find a #25 10mm bore 11t sprocket. TNT don't have them in stock and I haven't had any luck finding one locally yet.

The drive sprockets I've seen use a through pin. Has anyone just modified one like that (tapped those holes) to use grub screws instead? Theoretically I think that'd work? I'd rather not drill through my output shaft if I can avoid it.
Yep, I drilled and tapped the drive sprocket, filed flats on the shaft for the screws to sit against and have had no problems, Try to source "Diamond" #25 chain , best specs of any #25 I could find, If I remember right its availible through combat robot sites.

Just for repeatability, what size set screws did you use? I am doing this on my brothers bike very soon...
Power is a fascinating thing, the more you have, the more you want, but the real power is having the restraint not to use it all at once...............Um...Yeah..

The harder you work.....The luckier you get!!

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Denisesewa   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Denisesewa » Dec 20 2013 4:54pm

I used two 8 x 32 , one each side

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Whiplash   100 MW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Whiplash » Jan 01 2014 11:46pm

Just saw that thanks!
Power is a fascinating thing, the more you have, the more you want, but the real power is having the restraint not to use it all at once...............Um...Yeah..

The harder you work.....The luckier you get!!

"People who say it can't be done are often interrupted by those that have already figured out how to do it!"

Email me @ currentcycles@gmail.com
OR check out http://www.CurrentCycles.net

E-Vince   100 µW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by E-Vince » Apr 26 2014 2:16am

Dear Forum members,

Apologies for tagging on to a previous post, maybe somebody can point me to a different location. I bought a 450w 48V mid drive kit from Hong kong. I am very happy with it and I mounted it and initially ran it without any problems on my hard tail mountain bike.

Unfortunately I didn't mount the cables in the yellow motor to controller box. The cables were not tightened together and before I had noticed the problem the motor stopped working. After analysis I saw that the yellow cable was severely melted and inside the yellow box there was plenty of burning & the screws were corroded.
DSC_0528.JPG
Burnt connector box
I have re-stripped the wires and reconnected them via a normal screw in electrical connector. All is connected up properly but the motor will not run. I am concerned that I have somehow damaged the controller, otherwise I do not know what is wrong.

Could somebody offer some advice, is there way that I can proof the controller and motor to see if they are ok. I have heard about hall sensors on the kit could I have damage one of them also ?

Many thanks in Advance

E-Vince
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DSC_0525.JPG
Solution ?

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by ebike11 » Aug 25 2014 12:17am

Hi guys
Does anyone know of bolt on tensioners or rollers etc. for the primary drive? Im using #25 chain and its loose on the 65T and 13T sprockets
There are a few possible mounting holes already on the stock GNG chain reduction motor (where the protective guard bolts onto)
Perhaps I could use those to mount.
However, I dont have access to a garage o anything to do homemade modifications, so Im looking for a bolt on solution :D

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Overclocker   10 kW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Overclocker » Apr 20 2015 1:04am

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

chain conversion done. 80T and 11T #25 sprockets from electricscooterparts.com

hacked the belt cog into a "spider"

#25-HD KMC chain

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by ebike11 » Apr 20 2015 4:32am

Do you have chain adjusters to tighten the chain??

t0me   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by t0me » Apr 20 2015 4:36am

looks like adjustable top plates...
Kona Stink-E - GNG based mid-drive - http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 16#p839416
Giant Anthem - LightningRods mid-drive http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 7#p1008007


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Cyclebutt   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Cyclebutt » Jun 08 2015 10:30pm

Good work! I put my GNG on the back burner while you guys figured out how to correct the inherent problems associated with this kit. I LOVE the design but hate the execution. With my LightenRods sheets and a little "mod" work I may have this project back in the running before too long. Please keep those efforts published here so we all don't have to reinvent the wheel. Thanks to all! Oh, and photos! Please share your photos! Cheers!
Though the river tells no lies, many do not trust it.

meelis11   100 W

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by meelis11 » Jun 10 2015 5:27am

Here is my stock belt drive modification - only new part you need is new shorter belt (460mm length instead of 475mm)
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 8#p1032663

Image
Last edited by meelis11 on Jun 10 2015 3:58pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Overclocker   10 kW

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Re: GNG 450 brushless Mid Drive - Primary Drive Modification

Post by Overclocker » Jun 10 2015 5:55am

so meelis hows the reduced tooth engagement working out for you?

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