AFT mid drive build

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Jul 19 2013 8:50am

jk1 wrote:Wow that's a really nice build, probably one of the best builds I have seen with a cyclone type motor. I like how u have a frame battery better then the EGO kit in the back pack types.

How many km's have you done now on the kit and how is it holding up? I had heard the cyclone motors had problems with the gearbox teeth with grease ?

What distance and speeds can you do on the kit with your battery ? what efficiency do u get per km , wh/km ?

Do you have any video footage ?
hi jk1
so far i have done 901 km and have max speed of 97 km (down a huge very long hill while pedalling like a maniac).
if i just ride as i would normally i can get 65 to 80 km distance from 48v 20 ah .
wh readings vary depending on if i see road riders wearing lycra or not.if i do then its payback time for leaving me in the dust while looking down their noses at my fat tyres.
a sensible day would be around 8.5wh per km.
this motor has the oil conversion kit with external res.it keeps it quieter and helps with the teeth eating each other, i also went with the emax upgrades so all bearings are ceramic too.
i tried running my batt. in a rucksack but all it did was make the bike into a wheelie machine and scared the pants off me.
i am waiting to borrow some cameras from a friend to do some urban assault videos as i only ride roads generally
darren

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Jul 25 2013 5:38am

jk1 wrote:Wow that's a really nice build, probably one of the best builds I have seen with a cyclone type motor. I like how u have a frame battery better then the EGO kit in the back pack types.

How many km's have you done now on the kit and how is it holding up? I had heard the cyclone motors had problems with the gearbox teeth with grease ?

What distance and speeds can you do on the kit with your battery ? what efficiency do u get per km , wh/km ?

Do you have any video footage ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFMZi7To ... e=youtu.be

jk1   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by jk1 » Jul 26 2013 1:17am

Cool video and nice build. your bike is really quick to accelerate from a stop in that video.

Your bike is nearly twice the power of the optibike 1100R for about the same weight 28.5kg

And your top speed above 40MPH is nearly as much as the Stealth bomber which weighs nearly twice as much 53 kgs compared to your bike .

I bet the acceleration of your bike since it uses the gears is quite close or better then a stealth bomber? And your efficiency is probably better being mid drive and you have ceramic bearings on the motor.

Your bike should be more nimble and easy to ride offroad due to the low weight and especially NO weight in the wheel ? Have you taken it offroad how does it feel?

Do you have any friends with Optibikes or stealth bombers to race against to compare ?

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Jul 26 2013 6:55am

jk1 wrote:Cool video and nice build. your bike is really quick to accelerate from a stop in that video.

Your bike is nearly twice the power of the optibike 1100R for about the same weight 28.5kg

And your top speed above 40MPH is nearly as much as the Stealth bomber which weighs nearly twice as much 53 kgs compared to your bike .

I bet the acceleration of your bike since it uses the gears is quite close or better then a stealth bomber? And your efficiency is probably better being mid drive and you have ceramic bearings on the motor.

Your bike should be more nimble and easy to ride offroad due to the low weight and especially NO weight in the wheel ? Have you taken it offroad how does it feel?

Do you have any friends with Optibikes or stealth bombers to race against to compare ?
hi matey,all that video was done on the small 34 tooth chain ring,i did one yesterday on the 48 tooth and was still accelerating at 45 mph but ran out of road.
dont really do offroad as i have no acl or mcl in both knees and my one of my hips is a bit screwed,old age is a bitch.also do not have any friends with e bikes as they are all peasants and i am a horrible c**t.
darren

Megsy73   1 W

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by Megsy73 » Jul 26 2013 3:32pm

Awesome bike dude, sounds wicked too!

Hey can you summarise your specs, i'm interested in putting together a similar bike, maybe on a lightweight frame :)

I'm currently riding around on a Currie Ezip and got the electric bug, I want more!

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Jul 26 2013 4:49pm

Megsy73 wrote:Awesome bike dude, sounds wicked too!

Hey can you summarise your specs, i'm interested in putting together a similar bike, maybe on a lightweight frame :)

I'm currently riding around on a Currie Ezip and got the electric bug, I want more!
trek remedy 8
rock shock reba dual air forks
xt 8 spd cassette
chris king hubs
hope 4 pot brakes
titec carbon handle bar
adapted gear shifter
dmr moto tyres
xt deraileur
28.5 kg 63 pounds total weight
i weigh 170 pounds
48v 20ah of turnigy 20c 6s 5000mah
AFT 1680w emax kit
i was going to build the kit on a hard tail but the roads here are shocking so i use a full suspension bike.after changing tyres and swapping my 12v battery (lighting and horn power)for a voltage dropper the bike should weigh just under 60 pounds.i was surprised by the amount of power this kit delivers ,i dont think anyone would be disappointed to have one.
darren

jk1   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by jk1 » Aug 05 2013 1:29am

Hi

So you have the AFT 48v 1680w emax kit, what is the average max power you normaly see on your cycle analyst when you are at full throttle ? is it 1680w ?

And also what is the peak power you see on your cycle analyst for a few seconds ? I.e climbeing a steep hill do you see spikes above 1680w ? or is the maxiumum you ever see 1680w ?

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Aug 05 2013 6:28am

jk1 wrote:Hi

So you have the AFT 48v 1680w emax kit, what is the average max power you normaly see on your cycle analyst when you are at full throttle ? is it 1680w ?

And also what is the peak power you see on your cycle analyst for a few seconds ? I.e climbeing a steep hill do you see spikes above 1680w ? or is the maxiumum you ever see 1680w ?
hi jk1
full throttle is 1680 ish but i do get peaks of 2000+ if i hit the wrong gear and the limiter cuts in.
i try never to use full power as a rule,if i am climbing a large hill i try to stay at about 1000 watts.
doing this i have never had any thermal cut out
my c a is limited to 35 amps so at 48v i get 1680,charging to 50v would get me 1750 watts
the max amp peak i have had is 43 which is 2064 watts
darren

Megsy73   1 W

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by Megsy73 » Oct 28 2013 12:55am

Hi Darren,

I'm close to ordering the AFT kit, did you get the Emax version? What other options should I get?

How many kms have you done now? Any problems with it?

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Oct 28 2013 6:36am

Megsy73 wrote:Hi Darren,

I'm close to ordering the AFT kit, did you get the Emax version? What other options should I get?

How many kms have you done now? Any problems with it?
hi mate,i went with the emax upgrade plus gearbox noise cover,big cooling fins and primary chain cover.
i have done 1200 miles with no trouble.
darren

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by andrenoites » Nov 07 2013 6:06pm

cheekybloke wrote:
jk1 wrote:Hi

So you have the AFT 48v 1680w emax kit, what is the average max power you normaly see on your cycle analyst when you are at full throttle ? is it 1680w ?

And also what is the peak power you see on your cycle analyst for a few seconds ? I.e climbeing a steep hill do you see spikes above 1680w ? or is the maxiumum you ever see 1680w ?
hi jk1
full throttle is 1680 ish but i do get peaks of 2000+ if i hit the wrong gear and the limiter cuts in.
i try never to use full power as a rule,if i am climbing a large hill i try to stay at about 1000 watts.
doing this i have never had any thermal cut out
my c a is limited to 35 amps so at 48v i get 1680,charging to 50v would get me 1750 watts
the max amp peak i have had is 43 which is 2064 watts
darren

Hello cheekybloke

Can you show us the configuration you are using in your controller?

I have the same kit and I'm trying to find the best current and throttle configuration for this motor/controller combo

Tks,

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Nov 08 2013 5:42am

Can you show us the configuration you are using in your controller?

I have the same kit and I'm trying to find the best current and throttle configuration for this motor/controller combo

this must be the 4th time you have asked me for these parameters,i have not plugged my esc in to the pc.i have no idea of the settings you need.
once more i will say ask Paco at cyclone or Jim at AFT

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by andrenoites » Nov 08 2013 11:37am

cheekybloke wrote:Can you show us the configuration you are using in your controller?

I have the same kit and I'm trying to find the best current and throttle configuration for this motor/controller combo

this must be the 4th time you have asked me for these parameters,i have not plugged my esc in to the pc.i have no idea of the settings you need.
once more i will say ask Paco at cyclone or Jim at AFT
Sorry about that, didn't realize that was so difficult to have other members configurations to compare.
From all the forums I asked until now no one had posted pictures from the configuration controls :(

Maybe this controller is too recent and with time someone will post the configurations.

Already asked cyclone but they only send the default configuration. It will not serve to my purpose, I was thinking in learning some extra tweaking with other members.

Best regards,
Andre

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by namoon » Nov 26 2013 5:43pm

Hello - been hard to decipher all this - looks like im getting the kit - but i need to know which battery to get and which bike it will work on - I would like a full suspension and am looking at the trek remedy 8 as i can see you have it working. it doesnt seem clear or i am confused what batteries you are using and where i can get them. and if there are better quality or easier to deal with/ set up options.

I was told by jim at aft to go here - http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route= ... uct_id=123

mind telling me if this would fit on your frame, and if not what the name of the batteries you are using are or what my options are fo a full suspension bike that doesnt have foom for something like this?

thank you much!

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Nov 26 2013 6:47pm

namoon wrote:Hello - been hard to decipher all this - looks like im getting the kit - but i need to know which battery to get and which bike it will work on - I would like a full suspension and am looking at the trek remedy 8 as i can see you have it working. it doesnt seem clear or i am confused what batteries you are using and where i can get them. and if there are better quality or easier to deal with/ set up options.

I was told by jim at aft to go here - http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route= ... uct_id=123

mind telling me if this would fit on your frame, and if not what the name of the batteries you are using are or what my options are fo a full suspension bike that doesnt have foom for something like this?

thank you much!
hi mate,i will measure the bike in the morning to check sizes.as for batteries i use lipo,lithium polymer used for rc stuff mainly.i am no expert on them if you have no knowledge of them go to the battery technology section on here and have a read.
i use 8 individual batt. units each of them is 22.2 volts and 5000 mah at a 20c rating when wired up they give 44.4volts (slightly more when charged )at 20000mah.
hope this helps and you will really enjoy the ride.
darren

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Nov 27 2013 8:03am

namoon wrote:Hello - been hard to decipher all this - looks like im getting the kit - but i need to know which battery to get and which bike it will work on - I would like a full suspension and am looking at the trek remedy 8 as i can see you have it working. it doesnt seem clear or i am confused what batteries you are using and where i can get them. and if there are better quality or easier to deal with/ set up options.

I was told by jim at aft to go here - http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route= ... uct_id=123

mind telling me if this would fit on your frame, and if not what the name of the batteries you are using are or what my options are fo a full suspension bike that doesnt have foom for something like this?

thank you much!
hi matey,just checked out sizing,i have a med size and the bag will not fit.i would be inclined to make a metal batt. box as i dont trust the bag to protect batt. from crashing as they like to burst into flames.
darren

delphinus   1 mW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by delphinus » Mar 01 2014 4:14am

Thanks for the informative posts and video. Great work.
I'm thinking of getting the same motor, Jim is very very helpful. What sort of range or Wh do you get when doing no pedalling?

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » Mar 01 2014 7:15am

delphinus wrote:Thanks for the informative posts and video. Great work.
I'm thinking of getting the same motor, Jim is very very helpful. What sort of range or Wh do you get when doing no pedalling?
hi matey,my range is dependant on how much throttle i use,a good day would be 18 to 20 miles but i live in sheffield uk which is stupidly hilly.
did i mention how hilly it is lol
darren

delphinus   1 mW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by delphinus » Mar 01 2014 5:21pm

Good to know, I am hoping for about 30km of range with low levals of pedalling. I will be using it for multiple commuting trips round town each day (can charge in between trips). I live in Dunedin (NZ) which is fairly flat in the CBD but getting back to my office I need to climb a monster hill. Trying to avoid returning to office bathed in sweat.

http://goo.gl/maps/4D43x Gain of 112m altitude over 1km. Average slope 12%, max slope 28%
route1.PNG
route1.PNG (57.87 KiB) Viewed 342 times
So trying to work out what battery and capacity will give me that 30km range as well as get up that hill at the end.

delphinus   1 mW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by delphinus » May 11 2014 4:57pm

My kit has arrived from AFTech and it works really well. Fantastic heading up hills.
Main problems I'm having at the moment is securing the top bracket enough to ensure the motor doesn't slip out of alignment reducing chain tension.

Also do you have a CAv3 on there? How did you wire the throttle from that into the Kelly controller?

cheekybloke   1 kW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by cheekybloke » May 11 2014 6:33pm

delphinus wrote:My kit has arrived from AFTech and it works really well. Fantastic heading up hills.
Main problems I'm having at the moment is securing the top bracket enough to ensure the motor doesn't slip out of alignment reducing chain tension.

Also do you have a CAv3 on there? How did you wire the throttle from that into the Kelly controller?
hi mate,do you have the motor tensioner upgrade?
i use a ca 2.3 direct plug in so no idea sorry
darren

delphinus   1 mW

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by delphinus » May 11 2014 6:49pm

Don't have the tensioner upgrade. Main problem is the motor cog is pulling itself out of alignment outwards which is both loosening the chain and then causing it to jump off.

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by dypsomaniart » May 11 2014 7:01pm

delphinus wrote:Don't have the tensioner upgrade. Main problem is the motor cog is pulling itself out of alignment outwards which is both loosening the chain and then causing it to jump off.
You might need to get a shorter "t-bolt clamp" from an auto parts shop? If the clamp is pulled tight around the frame so the barrels are close together it wont have much torsional bracing. Also it might need a few more washers in the clamp bolt so its tightening right up against the brace and the motor plate as well as tightening on the frame. Check the washers on each side of the bolt, if theyre loose, it'll need more. I also stretched a length of racer bike tube over the clamp to protect the frame which probably would help with slippage.

Its a bit hard to explain, but if you look at my thread "aft mid drive giant glory" theres some pics of the mounting, mines solid as a rock.

Jesse

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AFT mid drive build

Post by drew12345 » May 11 2014 7:27pm

I have the aft drive also. I use the stand alone version of cycle analyst. There is a shunt that hooks in line between battery and controller on the positive and negative. There is connector from shunt that goes to CA.

I had problems also at first with a couple dropped chains on the motor wheel under extreme conditions. You will get dropped chain if not aligned right. Aft has tool now that will help with alignment. Talk to Jim and he can help.

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Re: AFT mid drive build

Post by delphinus » May 11 2014 7:39pm

Hi Drew,

Are you referring to this shunt?
IMG_20140511_140535.resized.jpg
Cycle Analyst Shunt
IMG_20140511_140535.resized.jpg (228.11 KiB) Viewed 2120 times
The heatshrink sealed cable pictured coming from the controller side of the shunt has a green yellow and black cable inside. According to the documentation this is:
Green: Throttle. "The green ThO wire from the breakout cable provides the controller throttle Sense signal."
Yellow: Hall Wire (optional)
Black: Ground (not used).

Can I ignore the yellow and black wires?

I tried tieing the green cable from the shunt to the green pin on the empty 3 pin plug (Throttle 0-5V signal IN) and plugged the 2pin plug into old throttle so I could use the on/off switch. When turning it on I got an error on the controller:
Throttle error at power-up.
Throttle signal is higher than the preset dead zone at Power On. Fault clears when throttle is released.
Somehow I managed to get it to clear and the motor ran at a low RPM with 0 throttle. Opening the throttle sped it up till I got to about half throttle then it stopped. Closed throttle and it ran at low RPM by itself again.

Any thoughts? Is it something to do with hall vs resistive throttle?

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