BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
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nutnspecial   1.21 GW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by nutnspecial » Jan 19 2016 9:00pm

Kudos, sweet! Keep us posted!
Saw your cx too diggler, those things have gotta be a blast!

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sn0wchyld   1 MW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by sn0wchyld » Jan 19 2016 9:22pm

John Bozi wrote:I know it was mentioned some pages ago, but can anyone confirm this motor runs just as well in reverse?

I am contemplating running it via the disc brake side.

I was wondering if there is something off the shelf for the 420 sprockets too

this looks cool but for 410 http://shop.jakebike.com/9-hole-offset- ... p-8898.htm

Image

or anyone out there do custom sprockets or adapters for 420 that anyone knows?

thanks
i can probably make some if needed mate (got a cnc router) - made a 219 sprocket adapter for my norko build. sprockets are harder though, as they really need anodising to last very long...

diggler   1 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by diggler » Jan 22 2016 4:45am

allinv wrote:Diggler, thanks very much for the advice on the settings.
I'm in Ohio, so it will be a while before I can do some more experimenting (it finally got cold here [well, probably not as cold as Minnesota]).
Unfortunately, I don't have a CA.
With my Lyen controller the motor runs forward nicely (ccw viewed from the end opposite the shaft) with ALL the colors coordinated.
But since I am running it on the left side of my mongoose cx, I had to reverse it.
By trial and error I ended up leaving the phase green to green, and the hall yellow to yellow (swapped the others).
I am running an 8 tooth sprocket on the motor, and 30 on the 20" rear wheel, but I will be going bigger when I get back to working on it again.

I would also like to extend my swingarm and run a bigger wheel on the back.
Thanks a lot allinv for the pics and confirming clockwise is matched for you like me so revers is most likely the same for me too.
I like the way you have it mounted! I was thinking of mounting it up and down with just some clamps. Your way is better, more stable.
Did you get the bht shaft machined?

Today was a balmy 23.
GAS ELECTRIC FAT BIKE 49CC/3000W MXUS V1 18s Lipo 18 Fet BUILDING...http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =6&t=65638
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HOLANDIA BEACH CRUSER 1000W 9C ?TURN REBUILDING... no thread yet.
Next project will be 18" Iron Horse hard tail mid drive

allinv   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by allinv » Jan 22 2016 11:45am

diggler wrote: Did you get the bht shaft machined?
I did it myself, I have a lathe and a mill. The steel shaft is held in by a circlip on both ends, so it can be removed from the rotor, it is a pretty light press fit.
I got the shaft out of mine out without removing the rotor from the motor,...with only minor difficulties.

diggler   1 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by diggler » Jan 22 2016 9:33pm

O cool.
I'd rather pay a fellow ebike enthusiast than some run of the mill machinist to do it for me.
Be easier anyway because you already know what I'm talking about.
Could use that bar for mounting it too.
Also, the threaded rod for my fat bike.

Man I would LOVE to have a lathe and mill!
GAS ELECTRIC FAT BIKE 49CC/3000W MXUS V1 18s Lipo 18 Fet BUILDING...http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =6&t=65638
600W CAPACITIVE SPOT WELDER BUILDING... http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =2&t=66466
HOLANDIA BEACH CRUSER 1000W 9C ?TURN REBUILDING... no thread yet.
Next project will be 18" Iron Horse hard tail mid drive

allinv   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by allinv » Jan 22 2016 10:37pm

diggler wrote:O cool.
I'd rather pay a fellow ebike enthusiast than some run of the mill machinist to do it for me.
Be easier anyway because you already know what I'm talking about.
Could use that bar for mounting it too.
Thanks, but I think you'd get quicker and cheaper results with a local guy.
It's one thing to spend 4 hours or more tinkering and custom fitting parts on my own stuff, but if I have to charge an hourly rate, I'm just not competitive.
I'd end up doubling the cost of your motor, sorry.

diggler   1 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by diggler » Jan 22 2016 11:52pm

I get it.
Thanks for being honest.
I was just thinking that it would probably be quicker locally too.
GAS ELECTRIC FAT BIKE 49CC/3000W MXUS V1 18s Lipo 18 Fet BUILDING...http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =6&t=65638
600W CAPACITIVE SPOT WELDER BUILDING... http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =2&t=66466
HOLANDIA BEACH CRUSER 1000W 9C ?TURN REBUILDING... no thread yet.
Next project will be 18" Iron Horse hard tail mid drive

goa604   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by goa604 » Jan 27 2016 9:46pm

just to write my little experience.
Found a big block motor, bought it with taobao agent, the whole package weighted 6300 grams, when they tried to send it to me, China big air mail refused to take the package because it contained magnets. I dont know whats the deal with that. Only other option was DHL but their quote was around 200 for shipping alone which i couldnt accept.
I got fully refunded though.

allinv   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by allinv » Jan 27 2016 9:57pm

Buy it from here, it ships DHL, reasonable price and quick.
http://e-bike-diffusion.com/index.php?m ... _num%253D1

goa604   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by goa604 » Jan 27 2016 11:50pm

The one i ordered from china was slightly bigger though. http://i.imgur.com/saS9EpA.jpg
Anyone confidently knows how much does ebike diffusons motor take peak without being terribly inefficient?
I was willing to take a slight risk with that motor from china since it was 16cm long and had a fan but this one kinda looks like a toy compared.
I mean on a page before this one there is a comment how this motor gets hot quick on acceleration at 1000w, if so thats pathetic.

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Skalabala   1 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by Skalabala » Jan 29 2016 1:45am

You must have misread I think.

"Running 11/50 to a 24" currently -just around 40mph top on flat @80v. 70/160 amps, rider+ bike 230lbs=

a rocket, and takes alot to get it hot (summertime and slowspeed highdraw aggressive stuff)."

Anyway I have one of those chinese motors with the fan. However my project is going slow :(
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Boosted cars are like hot women. A little edgy, every guy wants one, some guys can't handle them, and if you throw a little alcohol in them they'll rock your world! Born a Jap raised as a boer!

9lives   10 W

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by 9lives » Jan 29 2016 2:13am

For those without access to lathe, I successfully machined mine for 12 tooth 35 sprocket with file. Wired up motor and ran at modest speed and set upon with metal files. Took about an hour but worked a treat. Likewise, created the key way by drilling small holes, expanding and then file and dremmel without having to disassemble motor. If you have the time the shaft material isn't that hard. You just need to keep measuring as you go to ensure it remains square. Magnet on bench catches all the metal dust as you go.

diggler   1 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by diggler » Jan 29 2016 2:28am

sn0wchyld wrote:
John Bozi wrote:I know it was mentioned some pages ago, but can anyone confirm this motor runs just as well in reverse?

I am contemplating running it via the disc brake side.

I was wondering if there is something off the shelf for the 420 sprockets too

this looks cool but for 410 http://shop.jakebike.com/9-hole-offset- ... p-8898.htm

Image

or anyone out there do custom sprockets or adapters for 420 that anyone knows?

thanks
i can probably make some if needed mate (got a cnc router) - made a 219 sprocket adapter for my norko build. sprockets are harder though, as they really need anodising to last very long...
I've been looking at what is available.
Here is some stuffs I found.
This rear hd left side free wheel kit for motorized gas bike. Looks to be for a 410 chain.
http://www.bikeberry.com/engine-kit-par ... e-kit.html
Also randomly found these guys that will do custom.
http://shop.pbisprockets.com/product.sc ... egoryId=56
Don't know if aluminum is any good. or if anodized but for motorcycles so.
GAS ELECTRIC FAT BIKE 49CC/3000W MXUS V1 18s Lipo 18 Fet BUILDING...http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =6&t=65638
600W CAPACITIVE SPOT WELDER BUILDING... http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =2&t=66466
HOLANDIA BEACH CRUSER 1000W 9C ?TURN REBUILDING... no thread yet.
Next project will be 18" Iron Horse hard tail mid drive

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bzhwindtalker   1 MW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by bzhwindtalker » Jan 29 2016 11:31am

If you guys are in europe I have 5 motors in stock, and 25 more on the way.

goa604   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by goa604 » Jan 29 2016 5:56pm

Skalabala wrote:You must have misread I think.
"Running 11/50 to a 24" currently -just around 40mph top on flat @80v. 70/160 amps, rider+ bike 230lbs=
a rocket, and takes alot to get it hot (summertime and slowspeed highdraw aggressive stuff)."
I could have swore i read someone wrote his motor is hot at 1000w.
Anyway, if it is true the motor can take 10kw peak and 4kw cont. i would be happy with that and i would strongly consider buying that motor.

sraff   1 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by sraff » Jan 30 2016 9:56am

bzhwindtalker wrote:If you guys are in europe I have 5 motors in stock, and 25 more on the way.
specs? price?

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by crossbreak » Jan 30 2016 12:00pm

at 8kg this thing is more heavy but should accept 3 kW continuous without getting too warm. 284€ is quite a lo though. shipping is €80 to Ger :shock:
still, on the cyclone taiwan site i read something about 93% efficiency which would be nice. But on the other hand they claim 97% for their smaller models :lol: from calcs we know it cannot be more than 87%, maybe a typo :P
from what they tell on their HP, Kv should be in the 45 rpm/V range...same as RV160 and rv120 but cant tell for sure

Edit: Kv is 65 rpm/V according to the seller. Sadly max efficiency more like 83% rather than 93 :?
http://www.turbobikekit.com/cyclone-750 ... olt-72volt
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Last edited by crossbreak on Feb 05 2016 1:49am, edited 1 time in total.

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bzhwindtalker   1 MW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by bzhwindtalker » Feb 01 2016 3:54am

sraff wrote:
bzhwindtalker wrote:If you guys are in europe I have 5 motors in stock, and 25 more on the way.
specs? price?
Price for motor with sprocket is 150€, with mount its 180€, EU shipping ~25€
Here is a drawing, please note its not 100% accurate, its based on our measurements of our samples.
Attachments
LMX big block - V1 - Assembly 1 Drawing 1.pdf
(84.29 KiB) Downloaded 238 times

goa604   10 mW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by goa604 » Feb 04 2016 9:41pm

Even more info?

9lives   10 W

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by 9lives » Feb 06 2016 4:07am

Starting to get towards the end of my component collection for my big block project. Picked up a dual disk hub from the Vector crew along with some cheap go-cart sprockets which are readily available. Starting with 12 to 60 teeth noting I have one of the low kv motors. After torque not top speed and will run on 20S pack. In order to use the go-cart rear sprocket knocked up an adapter (ignore the temporary bolts) but will still need to make some spaces to get the chain line correct. Employed low tech solution for building the adaptor, drew what I wanted on Solidworks, printed it off and stuck it to a piece of 6mm Aluminium sheet. Jigsaw, a couple of hole saws, drill and file and presto.

Have tested the big block on an CA3 and Lyen 18 I had and it runs well once I sorted out the CA settings. As others have pointed out match the colours from the motor to the lyen controller and it will run straight out of the box. Anyway some pictures for anyone who is interested.
IMG_1203.jpg
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IMG_1204.jpg
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IMG_1205.jpg
IMG_1205.jpg (28.92 KiB) Viewed 4068 times

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Overclocker   10 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by Overclocker » Apr 07 2016 8:02am



just got my motor! now testing w/ the controller that came w/ my GNG kit. just swapped yellow and green for both halls and phase

but i noticed a slight rattling sound. is this normal for this motor?

i think my hall/phase combo is correct because i'm getting less than 2amps no-load current. and the motor isn't jittery. just that rattle. if you listen closely the rattle is there even as the motor is spinning down (throttle released)

could it be bearing noise?

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by skeetab5780 » Apr 07 2016 8:05am

My motor did that when I had that wrong wiring combo. Once I wired it color for color with the lyen/Infineon controllers it was quiet as ever with no load on it.

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by skeetab5780 » Apr 07 2016 8:14am

actually after listening to the video a few more times it seems like its internal maybe off balance or a bearing or lams rubbing hah

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Overclocker   10 kW

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by Overclocker » Apr 07 2016 8:23am

skeetab5780 wrote:actually after listening to the video a few more times it seems like its internal maybe off balance or a bearing or lams rubbing hah

yeah the noise is still there AFTER i release the throttle, as it spins down. so it can't be wrong hall/phase combo at this point

Altair   100 W

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Re: BIG BLOCK alternative Motor

Post by Altair » Apr 07 2016 8:39am

My motor has a similar sound when I turn it by hand, and I have never connected it yet!
I think it is caused by some steel drilling chips stuck to the magnets inside.
I'll have to dismantle it and extract the rotor to check it out, not an easy job. :x

Edit: Yes, it was what I thought.
The rotor was full of metal chips, as if the rotor was dropped on the floor during production, and then they assembled it anyways.
Then the motor was probably rejected at a later stage and thrown in a bin.
I'm sure that what BHT sells are the rejects from the manufacture.
My shaft was also mangled, many fins were bent, and the output bearing had too much slack within itself to be called a bearing. I replaced it with a proper 6004-2RS.
Last edited by Altair on Oct 20 2016 2:43pm, edited 1 time in total.

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