Kuberg Free Rider

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Kuberg Free Rider

Post by ilovehotshot » Mar 10, 2014 9:51 pm

New to electric so I am wondering if these specs are OK? Thanks for your input.

Weight: 84 lbs (38 kg)
Carrying capacity: 220 lbs (100kg)
Seat height: 34 in (860 mm)
Motor 2kW BLDC (peak power 4kW)- 3kW motor in the RACE version
Top speed: 34 MPH (55km/h)
Swapable Battery: Lithium polymer 48V, 15 Ah (666Wh)
Recharge cycles: min 500
Range: 60 minutes
Distance range: up to 60 km in flat terrain with 165 lbs (75kg) rider and smaller sprocket
Recharge time: up to 2 hours (recharging possible anytime, 30 min quick charger available as optional accessory)
2 2016 Kickstarter Kuberg Free-Riders
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by gwhy! » Mar 11, 2014 5:51 am

ilovehotshot wrote:New to electric so I am wondering if these specs are OK? Thanks for your input.

Weight: 84 lbs (38 kg)
Carrying capacity: 220 lbs (100kg)
Seat height: 34 in (860 mm)
Motor 2kW BLDC (peak power 4kW)- 3kW motor in the RACE version
Top speed: 34 MPH (55km/h)
Swapable Battery: Lithium polymer 48V, 15 Ah (666Wh)
Recharge cycles: min 500
Range: 60 minutes
Distance range: up to 60 km in flat terrain with 165 lbs (75kg) rider and smaller sprocket
Recharge time: up to 2 hours (recharging possible anytime, 30 min quick charger available as optional accessory)
yes the specs are ok,

BUT.... if I had one I would re-gear it for a top speed of more like 25mph- 30mph. 35mph with only 4kw peak will be pretty lame and will not really be a exciting ride. I like the idea of a swappable battery.

but it really depends on price when there are other bikes with better spec out there .i.e. the race 20" oset and the 20" etricks.
also the range of 30mile + is a bit optimistic even with a smaller sprocket.

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by ilovehotshot » Mar 11, 2014 9:38 am

$2000 for the 2kW and $2600 for the 3kW.
Free-Rider.jpg
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by gwhy! » Mar 11, 2014 10:31 am

if thats the real price then yes its worth going for the 3kw. The oset will end up quite a bit more than this by the time you have added all the factory tweeks. and the etricks is more or less the same spec but around $1000 more ( i think ).

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Mar 11, 2014 11:46 am

keep in mind that the prices you listed are for kickstarter only pricing..
and only if the kickstarter project is funded.. otherwise MSRP is about $1.5K more..

also, the free rider lacks pedals (or a pedal kit).. so this can limit range & trail access..
however, the etricks evolution & the upcoming motoped electric bikes both have pedal or peg options..
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/15 ... free-rider
:idea:
ilovehotshot wrote:$2000 for the 2kW and $2600 for the 3kW.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by gwhy! » Mar 11, 2014 12:14 pm

if the actual price of the 3kw is $3,500 and you dont mind not having peddles the the oset 20" with the controller maxed out and a lipo uprade will come in at around the same price but will have much better power performance but if you want something more run of the mill with peddle option then its got to be the etricks ( or the Motoped dependent on price and spec )

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by steelmesh » Mar 11, 2014 1:21 pm

It definitely looks unique (ugly IMO). Seems like there is a big waste of space where you could lower CG and/or add more battery cap.

Image
(Unedited screen shot from their website)

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by bzhwindtalker » Mar 11, 2014 4:39 pm

Deciving weigth/capa/ componets sets :cry:

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by Hillhater » Mar 11, 2014 10:28 pm

I hope they dont build it with that swing arm pivot / drive belt arrangement ! :roll:
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by dirkdiggler » Mar 11, 2014 11:39 pm

After just getting done looking at bikes, the price is great for what you are getting (this is for the kickstarter pricing). Any cheap full suspension mountain bike not from wal-mart is about 2k. This thing has a motor and a decent size battery pack. Even the 750w bafang BBS-02 kit and lipo batteries from Hobbyking are around $700, $750 with charger. If you got a brand new full suspension bike for the kit you will end up over what this costs. This is with the 3kW motor and not a 750w.
That being said, I couldn't get away with this bike on the mt. bike trails. Looks too much like a motorcycle. I do like to take sharp turns using the pedals on my bike to shift my weight and actually enjoy using my own muscles to help the bike. That adds to the entertainment of it all. Lastly the option of bigger tires would help the bike. The video looks like he's riding a pit bike built for a ten year old.
I do hope they make their goal on kickstarter, but doesn't look too promising right now.
I'd like a bike from BZHwindtalker, but I don't think he'd sell one for this price.

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Mar 12, 2014 11:57 am

i personally would like to see more options added to the free rider kickstarter etc..
pedal kit options, different wheel size options, bare frame & frame w motor options etc..
but it looks like the product is already fully developed & tested so this is just marketing
but the kickstarter price discounts offered are significant & this is a nice bike..
looks like they actually may reach their funding goal as they are nearly 20% there w still a month to go..
2 people have already backed the kuberg trex trial bike.. thats where i would be shopping.. 8)
dirkdiggler wrote:After just getting done looking at bikes, the price is great for what you are getting (this is for the kickstarter pricing). Any cheap full suspension mountain bike not from wal-mart is about 2k. This thing has a motor and a decent size battery pack. Even the 750w bafang BBS-02 kit and lipo batteries from Hobbyking are around $700, $750 with charger. If you got a brand new full suspension bike for the kit you will end up over what this costs. This is with the 3kW motor and not a 750w.
That being said, I couldn't get away with this bike on the mt. bike trails. Looks too much like a motorcycle. I do like to take sharp turns using the pedals on my bike to shift my weight and actually enjoy using my own muscles to help the bike. That adds to the entertainment of it all. Lastly the option of bigger tires would help the bike. The video looks like he's riding a pit bike built for a ten year old.
I do hope they make their goal on kickstarter, but doesn't look too promising right now.
I'd like a bike from BZHwindtalker, but I don't think he'd sell one for this price.

free ride uses chain drive, not belt drive..
also uses a chain roller/retainer, here are some pics :
Image
Image
Hillhater wrote:I hope they dont build it with that swing arm pivot / drive belt arrangement ! :roll:

part of the "wasted space" is to accommodate the larger motor option..
also positions the motor for chain clearance of the swingarm under suspension movement..
the battery design keeps the weight centered and facilitates quick change battery removal..
more battery capacity would of course add more weight, maybe not the best option for a "freeride" bike..
steelmesh wrote:It definitely looks unique (ugly IMO). Seems like there is a big waste of space where you could lower CG and/or add more battery cap.

Image
(Unedited screen shot from their website)
some ride & sk8 videos:
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http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by ilovehotshot » Mar 12, 2014 12:07 pm

I've backed the Trex already but wonder if I should order the Free-Rider to play on until the Trex is released. I know nothing about electric bikes so I am really interested in what all of you experts are saying. I know that most are really happy with the kid's bikes but I don't have a young child. Thanks for all the feedback.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Mar 12, 2014 12:22 pm

i think you will be happy w the trex, especially at that price! 8)
and kuberg has an expanding us dealership so service should be good as well..
i dont think you should have much problem selling the free rider once the trex arrives
but maybe your son will like this bike more than the gas bikes???
as a kuberg kickstarter backer you can make comments & help drive product development etc..
please comment that you would like to see an enduro seat kit option for the trex! :)
after all im guessing your not a trials competitor & therefore may prefer not to have to stand only as your trail riding all day..
the quick removable enduro/trail seat could even have a supplement battery pack underneath to extend range & or power when the enduro seat/battery kit is installed.. :idea:

ilovehotshot wrote:I've backed the Trex already but wonder if I should order the Free-Rider to play on until the Trex is released. I know nothing about electric bikes so I am really interested in what all of you experts are saying. I know that most are really happy with the kid's bikes but I don't have a young child. Thanks for all the feedback.
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by Tench » Mar 12, 2014 1:47 pm

I don't like the swing arm/drive sprocket relationship either, it seems the chain tension is at its tightest with the suspension fully extended creating massive slack under full compression, I would have thought it better positioned to be at the point it sags to with a rider on or in the middle of the travel to minimise the extent of slack at either suspension extreme, also the large distance between motor and pivot point exaggerates the large variation in chain tension throughout the suspension travel. done properly it wouldn't need a tensioner.
It strikes me that this is somebodies first attempt at designing a long suspension travel chain drive bike. Also as more weight acts on the suspension the pivot drops further below the chain run so the motors power will try to lift the back wheel making the suspension squat further when under power, this effect is also exaggerated by the large distance between motor and pivot.
Looking at the frame around the motor the tubes appear parallel so it would be a simple job to locate the motor a little further back, this would also have the benefit of placing the pivot slightly above the sprocket centre line moving the chains tightest spot to when there is some load on the suspension reducing both the above problems that have been designed into this chassis.
I would consider this far too important to compromise for the ability to put a different motor in which would also have the same drive line traits.
Its a grand looking bike! but could be designed better.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by Miles » Mar 12, 2014 6:30 pm

steelmesh wrote:It definitely looks unique (ugly IMO). .....
Image
(Unedited screen shot from their website)
The non-native screen resolution used for the screenshot doesn't do it any favours, either..... :mrgreen:

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by ilovehotshot » Mar 12, 2014 9:53 pm

I posted a comment on the Kickstarter about the extended ride seat. Thanks efMX Trials Electric Free Ride, I used the words right off of your post.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by neptronix » Mar 12, 2014 10:23 pm

It's pretty neat, not my favorite design.. the price seems too good to be true though.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by Dauntless » Mar 13, 2014 1:39 am

Image

I won't say ugly, but I'd say it's still in need of refinement. Nothing unusual about something coming to market before they took a really good look at what they made it look like. The 'Start' is the best looking of the lot. The kids bikes in general look pretty good, what went wrong on the Free Rider?

Meanwhile, your kids bikes. Razor of course has 2 650w bikes under $400, can be had as low as $319, both about the size of your 'Start.' Then there's the 500w electric version of the old XGames BMX bike at $449. http://www.walmart.com/ip/Hyper-Motobik ... e/23149110 I know you're going to say yours is so much better, but people don't really go paying so much more, do they?
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Mar 13, 2014 10:32 am

thanks ilovehotshot!
looks like they are going to run with my idea! 8)

ilovehotshot wrote:I posted a comment on the Kickstarter about the extended ride seat. Thanks efMX Trials Electric Free Ride, I used the words right off of your post.
some ride & sk8 videos:
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http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
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R : Kuberg Free Rider

Post by ilovehotshot » Mar 22, 2014 9:49 am

Since the Trex is not going to be here until 2015, I am going to order a Free-Rider. Now I need to decide if I should order the Free-Rider $1999 ( 2kW motor) or the Free-Rider Race $2599 ( 3kW motor). I personally don't need the extra power but when the Trex comes in I will probably want to sell the Free-Rider. So I need it to be desirable for resale. Could I get some opinions. Also will the stronger motor drain the battery faster or only if the extra power is used. Thanks.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by trevc2 » Mar 22, 2014 10:42 am

How come we don't see completely new frame designs with a motor of that size mounted directly on the swingarm, as close to the pivot point as possible? Why does a smaller/lighter motor than the gas equivalent still need to be mounted in that empty frame space? It feels like companies are simply taking the same designs and only swapping parts.

Not an engineer, just curious :)
Tench wrote:I don't like the swing arm/drive sprocket relationship either, it seems the chain tension is at its tightest with the suspension fully extended creating massive slack under full compression, I would have thought it better positioned to be at the point it sags to with a rider on or in the middle of the travel to minimise the extent of slack at either suspension extreme, also the large distance between motor and pivot point exaggerates the large variation in chain tension throughout the suspension travel. done properly it wouldn't need a tensioner.
It strikes me that this is somebodies first attempt at designing a long suspension travel chain drive bike. Also as more weight acts on the suspension the pivot drops further below the chain run so the motors power will try to lift the back wheel making the suspension squat further when under power, this effect is also exaggerated by the large distance between motor and pivot.
Looking at the frame around the motor the tubes appear parallel so it would be a simple job to locate the motor a little further back, this would also have the benefit of placing the pivot slightly above the sprocket centre line moving the chains tightest spot to when there is some load on the suspension reducing both the above problems that have been designed into this chassis.
I would consider this far too important to compromise for the ability to put a different motor in which would also have the same drive line traits.
Its a grand looking bike! but could be designed better.

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Mar 22, 2014 9:18 pm

depends on the bikes design & purpose..
more answers/opinions/research here :
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 25#p867852
:idea:
trevc2 wrote:How come we don't see completely new frame designs with a motor of that size mounted directly on the swingarm, as close to the pivot point as possible? Why does a smaller/lighter motor than the gas equivalent still need to be mounted in that empty frame space? It feels like companies are simply taking the same designs and only swapping parts.

Not an engineer, just curious :)
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Mar 22, 2014 9:38 pm

ilovehotshot wrote:Since the Trex is not going to be here until 2015, I am going to order a Free-Rider. Now I need to decide if I should order the Free-Rider $1999 ( 2kW motor) or the Free-Rider Race $2599 ( 3kW motor). I personally don't need the extra power but when the Trex comes in I will probably want to sell the Free-Rider. So I need it to be desirable for resale. Could I get some opinions. Also will the stronger motor drain the battery faster or only if the extra power is used. Thanks.
i don't think the extra 3kW motor power will drain the battery or reduce range significantly..
unless you use it to go faster etc, but to have more power & not use it is not easy haha..
im hesitant to recommend you buy either if you will only resell it..
that said i think either would sell easy at those discounted prices..
but more power would appeal to performance minded here on the sphere imo...
did you ever get your sikk trailbike going???
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by ilovehotshot » Mar 22, 2014 10:20 pm

I quickly learned that I am not at a time in my life when I have time to work on projects. Day to day life is keeping me way too busy. (Today's necessary was to repair the trash compactor quickly enough to go on a Ural ride) So I sold it for a profit to buy my next toy. Figure the Kickstarter is a good place to start since the prices are reasonable. I am going to a trials event next weekend and if I don't buy a bike there then I will order a free-rider. I can't stop thinking about the free-rider. I am already a Trex backer but who can wait a year for a new toy.
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Re: Kuberg Free Rider

Post by gwhy! » Mar 23, 2014 12:37 pm

if you cant wait for the trex then why dont you go for the Em 5.7 There really isnt much price difference ( and I have heard that the 2014 model of the 5.7 is much better than previous versions ) :mrgreen:

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