Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
sputnik2513   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 3
Joined: Aug 12 2014 12:28pm

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by sputnik2513 » Aug 12 2014 1:43pm

Hi teslanv

I put on a crank on the square bottom bracket and indeed the clicks go away if the bracket rotates at the same speed as the motor.

Is it normal for a new unit to have some resistance rotating forward (ie peddling) the square bottom bracket? It does not spin freely and feels like two hands rubbing each other. Spinning it backwards produces the freewheel click and this has less resistance.

amigafan2003   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 459
Joined: Jul 14 2011 10:05am
Location: UK

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by amigafan2003 » Aug 12 2014 1:53pm

sputnik2513 wrote:and first revolutions... end in the dreaded clicks problem

Here's a video, showing how loud they are
http://youtu.be/JRGq7Qc9lXE
That's normal - it's just the freewheel clicking.

amigafan2003   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 459
Joined: Jul 14 2011 10:05am
Location: UK

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by amigafan2003 » Aug 12 2014 2:01pm

sputnik2513 wrote:Is it normal for a new unit to have some resistance rotating forward (ie peddling) the square bottom bracket? It does not spin freely and feels like two hands rubbing each other. Spinning it backwards produces the freewheel click and this has less resistance.
Yes, that's normal too.

User avatar
Aushiker   100 W

100 W
Posts: 170
Joined: Mar 08 2014 8:47am

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by Aushiker » Aug 12 2014 7:06pm

tomjasz wrote:I'd take the opportunity to get a motor gear and sensor at least. I have a gear stashed. I'm betting on a sensor fail and I didn't get one. $6 from greenbikekit, probably no more from Paul. I'd also ask if he has access to any connectors. Maybe you could score the plug in for the controller? Or a controller extension cable. Worth asking. Seeing I have two motors I'd stash a clutch assembly too. But I tend to be a bit of a hoarder.
I have a motor gear. Are you referring to the speed sensor? Controller extension cable might be handy for setting up the programming. Hadn't considered a clutch assembly. Anyone else have thoughts on what spares are worth getting? I see Paul has a controller listed on his website. Worth getting one?

Thanks
Andrew

User avatar
tomjasz   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4106
Joined: Mar 29 2014 1:45pm
Location: Out riding, MN USA
Contact:

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by tomjasz » Aug 12 2014 10:49pm

I'm betting against needing a controller on my BBS01. Based on the lack of problems written about. Totally unscientific, just my Las Vegas gambling odds brain at work. I have two, one for leisure and one is primary transport. So I'm covered. I am again, guessing that if there is a weak spot it might be the clutch. It gets a good workout. But again, just a bet. It's cheap, enough if I can piggyback it as I did on someones order. Someone from our cable group buy was kind enough to piggyback my spare downtube battery base. IMO if we work together on orders we can all asset each other and not get quite so brutalized on shipping, even if we need to reship a part. Most bits will reship across the USA for $5.25, to at most $10. Coop buying could change the game for those able to build trust relationships using Paypal.

Just an idea...

Potentially completely off the mark, thoughts?
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

mclark999   100 W

100 W
Posts: 110
Joined: Jun 12 2014 5:53pm
Location: Denver, CO, USA

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by mclark999 » Aug 13 2014 8:42am

tomjasz wrote:I'm betting against needing a controller on my BBS01. Based on the lack of problems written about. Totally unscientific, just my Las Vegas gambling odds brain at work. I have two, one for leisure and one is primary transport. So I'm covered. I am again, guessing that if there is a weak spot it might be the clutch. It gets a good workout. But again, just a bet. It's cheap, enough if I can piggyback it as I did on someones order. Someone from our cable group buy was kind enough to piggyback my spare downtube battery base. IMO if we work together on orders we can all asset each other and not get quite so brutalized on shipping, even if we need to reship a part. Most bits will reship across the USA for $5.25, to at most $10. Coop buying could change the game for those able to build trust relationships using Paypal.

Just an idea...

Potentially completely off the mark, thoughts?
I like your idea. I'd even be willing to ship my programming cable around for use if a regular poster wanted to pay for shipping both ways.
-------------------------------------
Sikk Bikes cruiser with 66cc China girl
Trek FX 7.2 with Bafang BBS02 750W 20A
Trek 5500 with human power
Giant Trance with human power

User avatar
tomjasz   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4106
Joined: Mar 29 2014 1:45pm
Location: Out riding, MN USA
Contact:

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by tomjasz » Aug 13 2014 10:55am

mclark999 wrote:
tomjasz wrote:I'm betting against needing a controller on my BBS01. Based on the lack of problems written about. Totally unscientific, just my Las Vegas gambling odds brain at work. I have two, one for leisure and one is primary transport. So I'm covered. I am again, guessing that if there is a weak spot it might be the clutch. It gets a good workout. But again, just a bet. It's cheap, enough if I can piggyback it as I did on someones order. Someone from our cable group buy was kind enough to piggyback my spare downtube battery base. IMO if we work together on orders we can all asset each other and not get quite so brutalized on shipping, even if we need to reship a part. Most bits will reship across the USA for $5.25, to at most $10. Coop buying could change the game for those able to build trust relationships using Paypal.

Just an idea...

Potentially completely off the mark, thoughts?
I like your idea. I'd even be willing to ship my programming cable around for use if a regular poster wanted to pay for shipping both ways.
That's cool, perhaps a Paypal deposit, returnable, and first class tracked postage would be under $6 round trip!

I just had another conversation and compared something like a MAC motor clutch. a group of 5 could knock the price from $55 down to $40. Maybe even more if the seller would give a break on 10 pieces. Key to success being a reliable seller of the parts. There's lots of potential for problems but the group buy concept sure has worked every time I've been involved in one. I participated in several in the Vespa forums as well.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

User avatar
cycborg   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 469
Joined: Jul 05 2014 4:45pm
Location: Boston metro, US

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by cycborg » Aug 16 2014 1:34pm

Hello all,

This weekend’s project was supposed to be building a programming cable and playing around with the settings on my 750 W BBS02. I built the cable, but not only could I not communicate, but the drive doesn’t work at all now.

In troubleshooting my wiring, I found that some wires had pulled out of the solder pins in the new connectors I’m using, so something likely shorted in there. My bad.

Anyway, here’s what happens when I try to use it now. I connect the display (961), connect the battery, and when I hold down the display’s power-on button, the display comes on for about a second with a flashing empty-battery indicator, then blanks except for “Error 30” in the corner.

Well, first of all, Error 30 doesn’t appear in the manual I have. Anybody know what this might be?

Second, the battery measures 53.3 V (16s LFP) both when disconnected (using a multimeter) and with the whole system connected (using a CA), so the display’s empty-battery condition is wrong.

I’m short on ideas about what to try next, any suggestions? Thanks.

Arakasy   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Aug 05 2014 8:47pm
Location: Townsville, Qld, Australia.

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by Arakasy » Aug 16 2014 5:44pm

Hi guys !!
Do dads new 20ah batterie arrived the other day, all was working well.
( working so well I was thinking about getting one)

THEN

yesterday we were riding around town and his motor stopped working. (display is on and everything there looks good) just nothing goes to the motor, I'm about to strip it down and check all the connections.. Any idea's on a more severe issue that could be at play ? Thanks guys.

Ps. Bbs01 250w 20 ah power pack.

amigafan2003   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 459
Joined: Jul 14 2011 10:05am
Location: UK

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by amigafan2003 » Aug 16 2014 6:06pm

Error 30 is a communications problem. Check EVERY connector. Test after each connector is checked.

User avatar
cycborg   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 469
Joined: Jul 05 2014 4:45pm
Location: Boston metro, US

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by cycborg » Aug 16 2014 9:35pm

Thanks, Amigafan, but I did spend at least an hour today checking every connector - continuity, shorts, wire colors, etc. I won't bore you with details, although I did cover a full page with testing notes if you're interested. :wink:

Hopefully a good night's sleep will give me a fresh start on some troubleshooting strategies.

User avatar
Tom L   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 361
Joined: Jan 15 2012 1:09pm
Location: Tasmania, Australia

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by Tom L » Aug 17 2014 2:09am

cycborg wrote:Hello all,

This weekend’s project was supposed to be building a programming cable and playing around with the settings on my 750 W BBS02. I built the cable, but not only could I not communicate, but the drive doesn’t work at all now.

In troubleshooting my wiring, I found that some wires had pulled out of the solder pins in the new connectors I’m using, so something likely shorted in there. My bad.

Anyway, here’s what happens when I try to use it now. I connect the display (961), connect the battery, and when I hold down the display’s power-on button, the display comes on for about a second with a flashing empty-battery indicator, then blanks except for “Error 30” in the corner.

Well, first of all, Error 30 doesn’t appear in the manual I have. Anybody know what this might be?

Second, the battery measures 53.3 V (16s LFP) both when disconnected (using a multimeter) and with the whole system connected (using a CA), so the display’s empty-battery condition is wrong.

I’m short on ideas about what to try next, any suggestions? Thanks.
I did exactly this when I was working out the cable pin out.

Bad news: You have fried the communications port in your motor/controller. Most likely by shorting the battery (P+) pin to either the TXD or RXD pin.
You need to buy a new controller (part of the motor, not the display).

Good news: You might still be able to set the assist level you think you will need for your ride. You just have to be quick. If you set the assist level right after turn on, before the ERROR 30 time out - it may change. Does mean you have to power the display off and on every time you want to change the assist level though. This depends on there only being damage to the TXD line. If the RXD line is gone too this will not work.

I gutted the potting compound out of my fried controller looking to see if there was a fuseable link or protection diode on the serial lines I could replace. There wasn't. The lines pretty much go straight into the micro controller.

EDIT: More here: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 16#p863816 and http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 77#p869277 and http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 85#p891985

pompeimtb   100 µW

100 µW
Posts: 7
Joined: Feb 21 2014 7:48am

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by pompeimtb » Aug 17 2014 8:13am

hi

crankset broken in my bafang... where i can buy pars crank Right and left?

User avatar
cycborg   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 469
Joined: Jul 05 2014 4:45pm
Location: Boston metro, US

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by cycborg » Aug 17 2014 9:17am

Tom L wrote:Bad news: You have fried the communications port in your motor/controller. Most likely by shorting the battery (P+) pin to either the TXD or RXD pin.
You need to buy a new controller (part of the motor, not the display).

Good news: You might still be able to set the assist level you think you will need for your ride. You just have to be quick. If you set the assist level right after turn on, before the ERROR 30 time out - it may change. Does mean you have to power the display off and on every time you want to change the assist level though. This depends on there only being damage to the TXD line. If the RXD line is gone too this will not work.
This is what I was afraid of. Thanks for the "good news" tip, but it turns out it isn't good news for me - I can get the PAS numbers to advance on the display but apparently they aren't getting to the controller because the CA just reads 0 W regardless of the setting.
I gutted the potting compound out of my fried controller looking to see if there was a fuseable link or protection diode on the serial lines I could replace. There wasn't. The lines pretty much go straight into the micro controller.
I remember seeing a photo of an unpotted controller on here somewhere, but I can't find it and i'd like to have it for reference/curiosity. Was that yours? If so, could you link to the post, or just repost the photo?

In an attempt to see a bright side to this, hopefully I can order my new controller pre-programmed the way I want it. Of course, without experimenting myself I don't know exactly what I want, but I do know I want the PAS speed limits lifted. I'll read through the programming thread again to see what else I might want changed.

Thanks for the input. Sorry you fried your controller but thanks for putting your experience to good use by advising other victims and potential victims.

User avatar
Tom L   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 361
Joined: Jan 15 2012 1:09pm
Location: Tasmania, Australia

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by Tom L » Aug 17 2014 9:27am


gorndog   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 15
Joined: Jan 10 2013 10:36pm
Location: London

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by gorndog » Aug 17 2014 2:54pm

I too having the tiny click-no power when throttle depressed issue too.

I had done only 20 miles (10 miles on load - the rest done free air) when this occurred.

Purhcased from Paul- EM3EV.

Throttle doesn't work
PAS doesn't work
Display shows no errors
Slight click when throttled depressed.

I don't have the S/N to hand but its the new 25A 750 BBS-02 that Paul is selling at EM3EV. I've contacted him hoping to get some resolution soon.

From reading through these threads it seems that most faults are happening in the first 0-200 miles. Seems like a QC issue.

dumbass   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1276
Joined: Apr 25 2008 10:42am
Location: Chicago Western Sub.

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by dumbass » Aug 19 2014 4:43pm

gorndog wrote:I too having the tiny click-no power when throttle depressed issue too.

I had done only 20 miles (10 miles on load - the rest done free air) when this occurred.

Purhcased from Paul- EM3EV.

Throttle doesn't work
PAS doesn't work
Display shows no errors
Slight click when throttled depressed.

I don't have the S/N to hand but its the new 25A 750 BBS-02 that Paul is selling at EM3EV. I've contacted him hoping to get some resolution soon.

From reading through these threads it seems that most faults are happening in the first 0-200 miles. Seems like a QC issue.
Same problem I had on my first kit (never resolved problem because I was refunded my money). When you hit the throttle you get a slight click. Or if you press the (-) bottom you will get the same click. But it doesn't happen if you are holding the brake on. If you hit the throttle enough times (1 in 20 times or so) you may actually get the motor to jerk slightly.

As I remember there are several wires coming out of the controller with a plug on them that plugs into the a board on the motor. I am betting the problem is in the connection plug or wiring to/from this plug.

Bob

User avatar
speedmd   100 MW

100 MW
Posts: 2787
Joined: Nov 14 2012 12:16pm
Location: new england

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by speedmd » Aug 19 2014 6:20pm

it seems that most faults are happening in the first 0-200 miles. Seems like a QC issue.
They most likely worked at the factory QC check. It is what is commonly called infant mortality. Something is very borderline in the design or part spec. Some car manufacturers still do the few mile drive to the boat or train yard to help kick out this type of defect.

dumbass   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1276
Joined: Apr 25 2008 10:42am
Location: Chicago Western Sub.

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by dumbass » Aug 19 2014 9:05pm

speedmd wrote:
it seems that most faults are happening in the first 0-200 miles. Seems like a QC issue.
They most likely worked at the factory QC check. It is what is commonly called infant mortality. Something is very borderline in the design or part spec. Some car manufacturers still do the few mile drive to the boat or train yard to help kick out this type of defect.
I would agree something is very borderline in their specs. Hopefully, one of the suppliers can help pin it down because it seems to be one of the common problems with the kit. Once identified we can hopefully just replace a component and move on.

Bob

spockie   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 15
Joined: Aug 26 2013 8:49am
Location: London, UK

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by spockie » Aug 21 2014 4:42pm

Been following the many threads on this Bafang mid drive motor and even read the mega thread on this in its entirety, I think I need to re-read some of it as my brain when numb mid-way through :oops:

I've finally made the commitment and bought a BBS01 36V 500W from BMSBattery and installed it today. When I finished, it was getting late so only done a couple of miles to try it out. So far I'm impressed with the pulling power especially on steep slopes.

After the excitement, I'm gutted to find the motor got the dreaded clicking noise which occurs when pedaling OR on throttle. I also hear this clicking when pedalling without power. Should I continue using to allow the motor to bed in and hope the noise disappears or would this be destructive exercise. Please help as I'm not sure what I should do next.

Sorry I haven't got the serial number to hand but will post it up tomorrow.
Last edited by spockie on Aug 21 2014 5:16pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
speedmd   100 MW

100 MW
Posts: 2787
Joined: Nov 14 2012 12:16pm
Location: new england

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by speedmd » Aug 21 2014 4:55pm

The click to worry about is the one where nothing else happens. You may just have a bit of a loose fit / screw somewhere if it is running. Check it in a few and if it is not notable, it may be just the normal sound from the sprag / gear movements that are common. Mine is much quieter now with the new controller and packing the gearbox with much more grease.

User avatar
tomjasz   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4106
Joined: Mar 29 2014 1:45pm
Location: Out riding, MN USA
Contact:

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by tomjasz » Aug 22 2014 6:33am

I lower the volume control on my hearing aids and ride on...

"Dreaded click" seems to be becoming an over used phrase?
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

dumbass   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1276
Joined: Apr 25 2008 10:42am
Location: Chicago Western Sub.

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by dumbass » Aug 22 2014 4:18pm

spockie wrote:



After the excitement, I'm gutted to find the motor got the dreaded clicking noise which occurs when pedaling OR on throttle. I also hear this clicking when pedalling without power. Should I continue using to allow the motor to bed in and hope the noise disappears or would this be destructive exercise. Please help as I'm not sure what I should do next.
The click your hearing I have had since day one but as speedmd indicated that's not the click we're talking about. We are talking about when your drive goes completely dead with no indication of a problem. Not even a fault on the monitor screen. But you can hear a very slight click when you hit the throttle or press the - button.

Bob

untilsummer   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 3
Joined: Aug 21 2014 2:25pm

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by untilsummer » Aug 23 2014 2:24am

Hi all,

I recently purchased a Bafang BBS02 and installed on my Nihola cargo bike. I had no issues and it worked great hauling kids around town here in Copenhagen, and we've put on about 500km. A quiet motor, easy to use, and sufficient power for us. We've been happy with it.

A week or so ago, there was a heavy rain overnight (bike was not covered) and now it doesn't work. The display doesn't even power on. Tested the battery and the fuse and the waterproof connectors on the battery line and everything is ok.

Has anyone had issues with the Bafang and water/rain? I must say it's a bit disappointing as, in spite of a relatively dry summer, it rains here a good bit.

Any suggestions on fault fixing?

Thanks for any support!

amigafan2003   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 459
Joined: Jul 14 2011 10:05am
Location: UK

Re: Bafang BBSxx - fault finding and fixes

Post by amigafan2003 » Aug 23 2014 8:05am

The kit is water resistant, not waterproof - I wouldn't leave it out in heavy rain uncovered.

Best I can suggest is take off the display, throttle and motor unit and put them somwhere warm (airing cupboard) for a couple of days and try again.

Post Reply