new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 24 2016 11:05pm

juanfeli wrote:Yes I saw it thank you. But I don't have experience with this kind of stuff, so I don't want to mess with my only controller. Perhaps if somebody has upgraded his and can sell the Cyclone controller to me, I'll do it.

But again, so far the only one that has done it is G and He found that is not worth it. (I think that to a CA2)

I'll do it just to learn more and to share my experience here.

Otherwise, I'll wait for a Phaserunner. I'm interested in that one because with it I'd be a little closer to a posible upgrade to a Tangent Drive. If I want to. So far I'm very pleased with my C3000
Phaserunner is probably the wisest route, that thing is a really nice controller.

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

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Grizzl-E   100 W

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new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by Grizzl-E » Apr 24 2016 11:28pm

juanfeli wrote: Otherwise, I'll wait for a Phaserunner. I'm interested in that one because with it I'd be a little closer to a posible upgrade to a Tangent Drive. If I want to. So far I'm very pleased with my C3000
Not sure if you can use the phaserunner on an astro motor. It doesn't have the lowest inductance requirements or the highest erpm capability. That said im going to be using mine on my c3k once it gets here. Ill post my configuration if anyone else has a phaserunner they want to use with this. Im hoping its a good match, its so small you barely notice it. Amazing for a 4+kw controller.

On that note, can someone confirm the pole count in this motor? Haven't been able to find it yet.
Only brutal acceleration will do.

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 24 2016 11:34pm

Grizzl-E wrote:
juanfeli wrote: Otherwise, I'll wait for a Phaserunner. I'm interested in that one because with it I'd be a little closer to a posible upgrade to a Tangent Drive. If I want to. So far I'm very pleased with my C3000
Not sure if you can use the phaserunner on an astro motor. It doesn't have the lowest inductance requirements or the highest erpm capability. That said im going to be using mine on my c3k once it gets here. Ill post my configuration if anyone else has a phaserunner they want to use with this. Im hoping its a good match, its so small you barely notice it. Amazing for a 4+kw controller.

On that note, can someone confirm the pole count in this motor? Haven't been able to find it yet.
For an astromotor I would run a RC ESC, something like a CC 160 or something super high amps like that; but be prepared for custom-all-the-way kind of build... I think Motomoto used an Astroflight motor to do his 66 mph run.

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 25 2016 3:24pm

More updates:

This weekend was a major milestone for the trike: 200 miles with nothing more than a couple of small glitches and some mechanical tweaks. The Cyclone seems to be holding well at 6.5 kW so I have no complains. The chain arrangement in the front is working well too... I was worried that running two chains so close could be a problem, but the tensioner setup really works well.

So, in order to ensure things were going wll I did a major teardown, mostly to check for issues and wear, all inside and out; I also wanted to check the battery placement to see if things moved and whatnot, and for any potential damage anywhere. Nothing so far.

I also took the time to trim and paint the motor mounting brackets. So the motor mount is now in an state that I would considered finished. Haven't had any motor flex to date so that work for me; not even at 6.5 kW.

I also ended up drilling a bolt right through the boom and tightened it to stun so the boom flex is now almost gone; some still there, but that was expected since 6.5 kW is no slouch.

The Cyclone throttle ignition key now controls the entire trike like a real car: If you turn the ignition ON, everything powers up, including Cycle Analyst and the HOTAS controls. The alarm remains always ON regardless of ignition switch state and has the ability to cut-off ignition from the remote.

I've also changed the way the DB25 plug is accessed so now it won't get wet when it rains. Charging the packs on this guy is fairly easy considering you have so many packs inside. I've gotten 72 miles on a charge so I am happy about that.

This weekend also marked the end of the SLX era for me; an era that started with my Cyclone eBike back in November 2015. After careful consideration I decided to run Shimano XT 10-speed Dynasys shifters with instant release and multi-release; this has convinced me beyond any doubt that you really get what you pay for in terms of cycling groupset stuff. The instant release and multi-release are godsends: no more having to shift twice to get the thing going fast... now I can shift the gears like if I was running 5 speed sequential race car transmission (rather than a 10 speed and having to double click on every upshift) and that allows for a significantly quicker trike.

I've replaced the rear tire with a slightly wider Schwalbe Marathon. The Hemisphere brand tire I was running wasn't as nice on the wet compared to my front smaller 20" Marathons so I decided to change those.

I also added a ziptie to hold the rear upper chainguide tube so it doesn't rub the wheel under hard cornering; yes, hard cornering; I've already taken some seriously tight turns on this guy at high speed, and the grip seems infinite.... maybe a tad of understeer if you really push it, but no oversteer to date which is good. So the trike handling came out really nice. Without the hard cases the trike weight distribution is close to 80 20, where 80% of the weight (including rider) is sitting over the front wheels so the trike is nearly impossible to flip under normal driving conditions, locking the rear wheel might still yield some scary moments tho, so the rear brake is better left alone, or used sparingly for long descents as a drag brake... or as a parking brake.

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

juanfeli   100 W

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by juanfeli » Apr 25 2016 5:20pm

Have a look at this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ojifdokMKw
Grizzl-E wrote: Not sure if you can use the phaserunner on an astro motor. It doesn't have the lowest inductance requirements or the highest erpm capability. That said im going to be using mine on my c3k once it gets here. Ill post my configuration if anyone else has a phaserunner they want to use with this. Im hoping its a good match, its so small you barely notice it. Amazing for a 4+kw controller.

On that note, can someone confirm the pole count in this motor? Haven't been able to find it yet.
27.5 Plus Temple Chromoly Frame Cyclone 3000 https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 6#p1240096

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 26 2016 2:35am

That tangent drive sounds crazy... but nothing like the C3000W on 6.5kW tho...

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

juanfeli   100 W

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by juanfeli » Apr 26 2016 6:19am

Looking forward to see how the phase runner will work with this motor and the parameters that you'll find. This video is in Russian from the thread that G shared. May be it will help you with the pole count. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cyeWADNLNM
Grizzl-E wrote:
... That said im going to be using mine on my c3k once it gets here. Ill post my configuration if anyone else has a phaserunner they want to use with this. Im hoping its a good match, its so small you barely notice it. Amazing for a 4+kw controller.

On that note, can someone confirm the pole count in this motor? Haven't been able to find it yet.
27.5 Plus Temple Chromoly Frame Cyclone 3000 https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 6#p1240096

worldpax   1 W

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by worldpax » Apr 26 2016 5:47pm

Hoo rah! My kit arrived from Luna. Battery, also from Luna, is still en route. I did notice that the battery connector on the controller is red and not yellow. Am I going to have to do some connector swapping?

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by spinningmagnets » Apr 26 2016 5:55pm

Am I going to have to do some connector swapping?
Changing connectors between the battery and controller:

https://www.electricbike.com/matching-c ... ontroller/

Image

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by worldpax » Apr 26 2016 6:08pm

Dang it, think I just remembered that the battery comes with a matching pigtail. I'm an idiot.

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by evolutiongts » Apr 26 2016 9:10pm

Comparison between stock cyclone 3000w motor mounts (left) and upgraded motor mount solid aluminum block (right)

- No more bent bolts, or damaged mounts.
- Stiffer than stock mounts, virtually eliminates flex
- Bulletproof, over 1000 miles tested. Off road and on the street. 74V.

Image

Image
http://www.electricrt.com
Electric Race Technologies

Schwinn 405 2WD Track Bike 18KW
EDGE 1500W Hub / MXUS 3K Turbo
ASI BAC 2000 / BAC 4000 Bluetooth
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=93079

10Kw KMX death trike
MUXUS 3K Turbo
Sabvoton 72V150A
Moto Wheels all around
Front Suspension Kit
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=83423

Giant Trance 4 Full Suspension
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74V 3000W
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =6&t=59005

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 26 2016 11:36pm

:D BLASPHEMY.... A BAFANG picture in CYCLONE SACRED LAND!!! UUUGGGHHHH.... BURN THE HERETIC...

LOLOLOL...

G.
spinningmagnets wrote:
Am I going to have to do some connector swapping?
Changing connectors between the battery and controller:

https://www.electricbike.com/matching-c ... ontroller/

Image
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 26 2016 11:42pm

evolutiongts wrote:Comparison between stock cyclone 3000w motor mounts (left) and upgraded motor mount solid aluminum block (right)

- No more bent bolts, or damaged mounts.
- Stiffer than stock mounts, virtually eliminates flex
- Bulletproof, over 1000 miles tested. Off road and on the street. 74V.

Image

Image
Cool, but what I did works for me at 6.5kW; just the washer mod, the robocam plate and two extra brackets to hold the motor to the frame (required so motor doesn't flip up). I did it for a total of 10 dollars in parts. Right now my concern would be with the flex from the boom at 5000 watt than the motor.

IMO 99 bucks for a drilled block of AL seems a bit excessive to me but hey, is not what I say, is what ppl are willing to pay.

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

dirkdiggler   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by dirkdiggler » Apr 27 2016 12:33am

So, do you need to use the cyclone bottom bracket or can you use one from the LBS? I need to know if I want to use an ISIS BB, do I need to purchase the cyclone version. I can never tell from the pics if there is any difference.
Also still curious if you can run this kit direct to the rear sprocket, say maybe just use a 32 tooth on the rear. Would I need to lower the pinion sprocket tooth count?
Thanks

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by tomjasz » Apr 27 2016 12:56am

worldpax wrote:Hoo rah! My kit arrived from Luna. Battery, also from Luna, is still en route. I did notice that the battery connector on the controller is red and not yellow. Am I going to have to do some connector swapping?

Sent from my MT2L03 using Tapatalk
Being put off by something as simple as a connector isn't a good sign!
I think EVERY builder should learn to solder an do connectors from day one.

rant over
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by worldpax » Apr 27 2016 6:05am

tomjasz wrote:
worldpax wrote:Hoo rah! My kit arrived from Luna. Battery, also from Luna, is still en route. I did notice that the battery connector on the controller is red and not yellow. Am I going to have to do some connector swapping?

Sent from my MT2L03 using Tapatalk
Being put off by something as simple as a connector isn't a good sign!
I think EVERY builder should learn to solder an do connectors from day one.

rant over
My soldering iron is ready, but for a second there I thought I was going to need to source a connector. If I was scared of some fab, I wouldn't have got the Cyclone.

Sent from my MT2L03 using Tapatalk

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by spinningmagnets » Apr 27 2016 7:18am

Although writing that article was indeed in response to a Luna request to help new builders who had bought a Bafang product, I took it upon myself to compartmentalize the info into three parts, so that the BB cartridge removal (part one) would be relevant for ANY mid drive owner, even competing systems. Part two was sorted in a way that it would be useful to many new builders, even someone who had bought a hubmotor kit.

If you were cynical, it would be reasonable for you to fear I was trying to slip in a BBSHD pic into a Cyclone thread, but the Cyclone is capable of much more power, so they are really in two separate classes, and not competing for the same customers. Here's part one (BB cartridge removal, and the tools needed) for those who missed the link before.

https://www.electricbike.com/removing-b ... cartridge/
https://www.electricbike.com/matching-c ... ontroller/

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by chupa » Apr 27 2016 9:17am

gman1971 wrote:That tangent drive sounds crazy... but nothing like the C3000W on 6.5kW tho...

G.
This motor can up to 8000w but with very lo eff.

Watch my test -

Image

The EFF with 5kw power input is a approx 70% on 63v. if you will add 6.5kw , the EFF will be approx 55%. It means that about 3 kilowatts will go to heat.
It seems to me 6.5 it is possible to give on dispersals quickly. It is long to give 6.5kw not expediently as nearly a half of energy goes to heat.

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gman1971   10 kW

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 27 2016 10:53am

Nice Chupa!!! Thanks!!!

The C3000 motor is a BEAST on 6.5 kW so it is good to know I can still crank 2 more kW out of this cyclone motor if I ever want to.

Spinningmagnets:

I was just trying to be funny... I personally don't care about Bafang, maybe in the future, but not now. You also confirmed what I've been trying to tell everyone who is hesitant to buy a Cyclone over a Bafang: all mid drive installations are basically the same.

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by jk1 » Apr 27 2016 7:03pm

Chupa

The EFF% of this tuned motor like Cyc.3000w. But cyc 1650w have weigth 3kg. I wanted to change my Cyclone 1650w to new 3000w , but after compared tables I stay with my old cyclone 1650w.

For explanations - Cyclone 3000w - made in a china motor with mid quality . Cyclone 1650w made in Taiwan have good quality
The EFF with 5kw power input is a approx 70% on 63v. if you will add 6.5kw , the EFF will be approx 55%. It means that about 3 kilowatts will go to heat.
Hi Chupa just trying to understand your tables and why you went back to the smaller 1680w cyclone motor as it was more efficient and lighter. How much efficiency difference at 3 , 4 and 5kw input ? and what is the weight difference between the Cyclone1680w cyclone 3000w ?
Last edited by jk1 on Apr 28 2016 8:36pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by 1KW » Apr 27 2016 8:41pm

plus the older 1680 cyclone had tons of issues, from controller to gear box to other issues..?

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by 1KW » Apr 27 2016 8:43pm

http://www.sickbikeparts.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=26

sells both units, seems they upgraded the mounts for the older kit, however I remember many many posts about bad gearbox or controller.

StinkyGoalieGuy   100 W

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by StinkyGoalieGuy » Apr 28 2016 11:36am

gman1971 wrote:
Cool, but what I did works for me at 6.5kW;

G.
gman, I'm sure I missed it, but how are you running 6.5kW through the stock cyclone controller? Assuming you are at around 72 volts, that's about 90 amps. I thought the stock controller would only push between 40 and 50 amps. Thanks!

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by gman1971 » Apr 29 2016 10:37am

StinkyGoalieGuy wrote:
gman1971 wrote:
Cool, but what I did works for me at 6.5kW;

G.
gman, I'm sure I missed it, but how are you running 6.5kW through the stock cyclone controller? Assuming you are at around 72 volts, that's about 90 amps. I thought the stock controller would only push between 40 and 50 amps. Thanks!
Yes, I shunt-modded the controller with a piece of copper wire. I guess too many people have obnoxious gman1971 on the ignore list... LOL. So my controller is now effectively capable of unlimited amps. (I've pulled up to 90 amps before the controller seems to cut out) 90 amps x 74 volts = 6.6 kW... trust me, is wicked fast. Controller barely gets warm to the touch; motor mount hasn't come undone with the washer mod and robocam plate idea.

I will be getting a better controller when (and if) this one dies; so nothing like testing the limits of the Cyclone kit at twice of the max power rating. Allows me to get to 50 mph with ease; problem is tho, batteries get drained REAL FAST once you start dishing 4 and 5 kW speed runs.

G.
I am all about high-speed, low-drag, mid-drives and gears...
A-1B trike, 6+kW, 65+mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFC8MRwvgUM
A-2A trike 3kW, 50mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNoqp0wl6Vo
eB-1C bike 3kW, 42mph (Cyclone powered): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_weSmz_h3Ig

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Re: new cyclone 3000 w mid-drive kit?

Post by StinkyGoalieGuy » Apr 29 2016 11:43am

Thanks, G. This is definitely the best bang for your buck kit for mid-drive. If my current project doesn't work out, i'll end up going for this or a Tangent kit.

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