BBSHD Troubles

Hello,

So I have about 115 miles on my BBSHD and I am having some issues.
I am not sure if its an issue with the chain line or my derailleur is failing.

I bought the bike new to install the BBSHD on it and this started two days ago.
The bike runs fine if its on gears 1, 2, 3, 4 no matter how much I wind up the motor it runs fine.
However in gears 5. 6. 7. the rear derailleur jerks (idler pulley) forward constantly making a loud clunk noise.

If I shut off the motor it runs fine on all gears but with the motor on with a load the derailleur sounds like its falling apart.
If the bike is on a stand with no load it runs fine on all gears.

I have a video I will upload when I get a chance, maybe it better explains the issue.

for shifting problems only under load, check for chain stretch and cog wear..
adding motor power to your drive train can cause chains and cogs to stretch / wear faster..
if your chain and/or cogs are worn / stretched then replace parts as needed..
but maybe consider an ebike specific chain and larger cogs for longer wear..

http://www.parktool.com/product/chain-wear-indicator-CC-3-2

also make sure your derailleur is adjusted properly :
http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help/rear-derailleur-adjustment#article-section-2
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html

Sounds like worn teeth on the top gears. Replace them and the chain and report back.

When I get home I will inspect the cogs and post a video.
Its only been running for a week or so so it will be a bummer if it already wore through the drive train.

12 bicycle chain links pin to pin should measure 12 inches..
beyond that length and you have chain wear..
http://thebiketube.com/tutorial/how-check-if-your-bike-chain-worn-out

is your problem with the larger rear gears or smaller rear gears???
small rear gears such as 11teeth tend to wear quickly (esp. under motor power)
then that wear could spread to the chain and other cogs..

if the problem is with the larger rear gears then check your chain line..
extreme angled chain line may not shift as well, etc than a straighter chain line..

efMX Trials Electric Freeride said:

12 bicycle chain links pin to pin should measure 12 inches..
beyond that length and you have chain wear..
http://thebiketube.com/tutorial/how-check-if-your-bike-chain-worn-out

is your problem with the larger rear gears or smaller rear gears???
small rear gears such as 11teeth tend to wear quickly (esp. under motor power)
then that wear could spread to the chain and other cogs..

if the problem is with the larger rear gears then check your chain line..
extreme angled chain line may not shift as well, etc than a straighter chain line..

Click to expand...

Its the smaller gears that are giving me issues.
1 2 3 4 all work fine and 5 6 7 it clanks on motor power.

It shifts into the cog fine and it doesn't come out but the idler starts swinging forward.

I had the same problem with a cyclone mid drive a few years ago and I discovered that I already had worn teeth on my 7,8 and 9 speed teeth....

Shortly after putting my BBS02 on my bike the chain started skipping teeth in the higher gears. https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=73635 I was running a 36t in the front and an 11-32 9spd cassette in the back. I put on a 42T bling ring on the front and a 12-36 cassette along with a KMC e-bike chain (I made sure to make the chain the optimum length for that set up). That gave me about the same ratios but more teeth on rear sprockets and less force on the chain for any given ratio. It worked fine after that. Now I've got the BBSHD on there and it's still OK but don't have that many miles on it yet. We'll soon see how often the drive train needs replacement. I think it will pay to use the highest quality drive train parts available. This of course is not the fault of the BBSHD, any mid drive of equivalent power would have done the same thing.

Dogboy1200 said:

Shortly after putting my BBS02 on my bike the chain started skipping teeth in the higher gears. https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=73635 I was running a 36t in the front and an 11-32 9spd cassette in the back. I put on a 42T bling ring on the front and a 12-36 cassette along with a KMC e-bike chain (I made sure to make the chain the optimum length for that set up). That gave me about the same ratios but more teeth on rear sprockets and less force on the chain for any given ratio. It worked fine after that. Now I've got the BBSHD on there and it's still OK but don't have that many miles on it yet. We'll soon see how often the drive train needs replacement. I think it will pay to use the highest quality drive train parts available. This of course is not the fault of the BBSHD, any mid drive of equivalent power would have done the same thing.

Click to expand...

Took off the wheel and gear 6 in the rear cassette is trashed.
That's why 5 and 7 also have issues since 6 is right in between.

Brand new bike too
I will bring the wheel to LBS and get the best 7sp cassette they have,

MrZo said:

Dogboy1200 said:

Shortly after putting my BBS02 on my bike the chain started skipping teeth in the higher gears. https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=73635 I was running a 36t in the front and an 11-32 9spd cassette in the back. I put on a 42T bling ring on the front and a 12-36 cassette along with a KMC e-bike chain (I made sure to make the chain the optimum length for that set up). That gave me about the same ratios but more teeth on rear sprockets and less force on the chain for any given ratio. It worked fine after that. Now I've got the BBSHD on there and it's still OK but don't have that many miles on it yet. We'll soon see how often the drive train needs replacement. I think it will pay to use the highest quality drive train parts available. This of course is not the fault of the BBSHD, any mid drive of equivalent power would have done the same thing.

Click to expand...

Took off the wheel and gear 6 in the rear cassette is trashed.
That's why 5 and 7 also have issues since 6 is right in between.

Brand new bike too
I will bring the wheel to LBS and get the best 7sp cassette they have,

Click to expand...

too much power? :lol:

The "best" cassette they have might have alloy gears..... Steel gears will live longer in an eBike with a mid-drive.

It may be a good idea to measue your chain as well before buying some new components and running the new stuff with the old. The text from the link in one of the earlier replies says if the chain is 1/8" longer than it should be at the 12" mark then you may need to replace more than just the chain so this may also apply to needing more than just the rear cogs if other parts of the drive train is worn. If the chain is only 1/16" longer you may get away with running some old stuff with some new stuff.

The comments below here are not so helpfull for your trouble shooting at the moment but I feel are worth mentioning for good mid drive practise. They are of course just my opinion..........

What I have learned with mid drives is that the extra power from the motor will amplify any feedback from drivetrain in a big way and also make it hard to quickly back off the power when the drive train is talking to you. Under human power alone, if the crunching and munching starts you kind of instantly back off the power to the pedals but with a motor assist by the time you get the power backed off some damage will be done so its extra important to have everything perfect. For myself I have would never run a mid drive with anything but an old school friction shifter on the handle bars,I would shift under pedal power only and give three full revs of the cranks after things sound good from the shift before appling any motor assist at all. I am too cheap to pay for these fancy shifters that dont work that good when things start to wear out and especially with a motor assist.

Good luck MrZo with your bike and drive. I look forward to joining the Bafang gang shortly. Mine is in the mail

Maybe high quality bike Parts are the way to go with a high power mid Drive. 7 speed on a brand new bike sounds to me that you put 1000$ elektrik components on a 200$ bike ...
Spend another 50$ on a quality drive drain. Shimano hg-30/50 components are cheap and strong... For the future I would recommend to spend at least 600$ for a bike. Where you want to put a Motor on that makes it run 30mph...

--freeride-- said:

Maybe high quality bike Parts are the way to go with a high power mid Drive. 7 speed on a brand new bike sounds to me that you put 1000$ elektrik components on a 200$ bike ...
Spend another 50$ on a quality drive drain. Shimano hg-30/50 components are cheap and strong... For the future I would recommend to spend at least 600$ for a bike. Where you want to put a Motor on that makes it run 30mph...

Click to expand...

No it wasn't a Walmart bike, I bought it at a lsb for 600 with some upgrades.

Still, it sure didn't have a KMC E-bike chain on it. A cheap chain will stretch and then ruin the sprockets.

I would not worry about this, you are just finding the weak links in the chain and fixing them

Seriously, you are asking that bike to do something it was never intended to do: take BBSHD torque. And you 're going to have to upgrade parts as needed until stuff stops breaking. Most likely, a new chain and a quality steel cluster will be enough. Then your brakes or tires will start to wear out from all those high speeds........ :?

Dogboy1200 said:

Still, it sure didn't have a KMC E-bike chain on it. A cheap chain will stretch and then ruin the sprockets.

Click to expand...

It has whatever specialized bikes come with.
I will look into kmc as i dint know they existed. I will need one though to make things more reliable.


Took it down and had a new cassette put in and all is well for now.

I would be interested to hear how a KMC e-bike specific chain holds up. I am going to assume this is marketing hype, until I hear what is specifically different about it.

The answer is running a 14-40 cassette, instead of a 12-34, and upping the chainring size to match. This reduces chain tension AND ups number of teeth engaged by ~15%.

Warren said:

I would be interested to hear how a KMC e-bike specific chain holds up. I am going to assume this is marketing hype, until I hear what is specifically different about it.

The answer is running a 14-40 cassette, instead of a 12-34, and upping the chainring size to match. This reduces chain tension AND ups number of teeth engaged by ~15%.

Click to expand...

On a 750w BBS02 I went through the original cheap chain and cassette on my bike in a month - chain slip, chain drop. Swapped to a KMC ebike chain and a new cheap steel shimano cassette and I've not experienced chan slip or drop in 10 months now.

FWIW, I.m using an 8 speed Shimano cassette and chain on my 750w BBS02 (Luna 52V, 10 ah battery) equipped bike with a Shimano Altus derailleur; shifts great (I hit the "kill switch" - brake when shifting) and seems to wear well (plus cheap; $20 each for cassette and derailleur).

2old said:

FWIW, I.m using an 8 speed Shimano cassette and chain on my 750w BBS02 (Luna 52V, 10 ah battery) equipped bike with a Shimano Altus derailleur; shifts great (I hit the "kill switch" - brake when shifting) and seems to wear well (plus cheap; $20 each for cassette and derailleur).

Click to expand...

I been doing the same when I shift.
I added a shimano cassette in the rear and its so far so good. Only have 30 miles on the new cassette though so lets see.
I have noticed that I don't really have to shift much anyway, I can leave it on 5th and still take off fine and reach 33mph with motor only.

Brakes seem to be wearing pretty fast though.
Any recommendations on new pads.

MrZo said:

Brakes seem to be wearing pretty fast though.
Any recommendations on new pads.

Click to expand...

Kool Stop Salmon

http://www.amazon.com/Kool-Stop-Mountain-Bicycle-Threaded/dp/B001CJZ0Q2/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1449178678&sr=8-3&keywords=kool-stop+salmon

Thanks, I have disc brakes on mine though.
Front pads are still good but the rear wont last long.

From my experience, the best disc wear life has been with metallic pads. Probably I ride too slowly since I prefer rim brakes on whichever bikes will accommodate them.

2old said:

From my experience, the best disc wear life has been with metallic pads. Probably I ride too slowly since I prefer rim brakes on whichever bikes will accommodate them.

Click to expand...

THanks!
I will look into the metal pads.
I mainly use the rear brakes and they are rather low at this point.
I am riding it 30-35 miles a day with most of the ride around 35mph.

On that note what are some of you getting for range.
The commute to work I ride it as fast as I can to get good time and I get 30 miles or so.
Lots of stop and go with about 50 percent of the commute in the woods ( Take a shortcut).

I have a Lunacycle 25r 20AH battery.