Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

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davidahn   100 µW

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Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by davidahn » Jan 25 2016 4:21am

I'm getting a pair of Electra Townie Balloon 7i EQ's for my wife and for myself and am planning on converting to e-Bikes using the Bafang BBSHD. But the options are kind of bewildering!

The options are bewildering as a newbie to e-bikes:
1. LV cut: 41, 43V? With a 52V battery do I need a higher LV cut level? or is 41V fine?
2. chain wheel: no silver Bling Ring option?
3. throttle type: left or right? thumb or half twist?
4. e-brake choices: standard? cable? hydraulic?
5. do I need gear sensors? For the Townie 7i's it would be the IGH version
6. which brake controls: standard? cable? hydraulic? the Townie 7i has Shimano Nexus Roller Brakes w/Cooling Fins
7. 68 or 72 mm? I'm pretty sure the Townie 7i is not a fat bike, so probably 68?
8. I'd like to get a Satiator but it's not cheap... can I share one Satiator between two bikes/batteries?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by SlowCo » Jan 25 2016 7:46am

Hopefully the more experienced people of this forum will also reply with accurate feedback. Until then here are my thoughts:

The bicycle you mentioned seems to have a Shimano Nexus 7 speed gear hub and is equipped with roller brakes. Onto that you want to put the BBSHD (25-30A controller inside) with a 52V (almost 60V HOTC) battery. That is >1500W to go through a delicate IGH designed for human (<300W) pedal power. I wonder how long the IGH will survive. And you yourself (survive that is). As this combination will be able to reach 30mph with bad brakes....

So maybe a less powerful middrive or a better bike (better brakes / cassette or freewheel gears) might be wise.

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by spinningmagnets » Jan 25 2016 10:24am

I've seen this before. I empathize with your new-found enthusiasm for ebikes, and...I have a recommendation. Buy one of this model of bicycle, and one kit that you want.

Sort out the various issues to get that combination working for you before you buy the second set-up. You may end up absolutely loving it, and then feel that my recommendation was just wasted time. Then again...you may find that one of you would be happy with less power, and the BBS02 would be less expensive and also lighter.

I'm not trying to get you to spend less money, for all I know, you may end up wanting a longtail cargobike, and you could put the BBSHD on that. Between you and your wife, one of you might end up putting many more miles on their ebike than the other. The second battery pack could then be larger or smaller (a smaller pack would be lighter, and less expensive). By starting with just one bike, you would have many choices.

I'd recommend they both be the same voltage, and 52V is an excellent choice.

davidahn   100 µW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by davidahn » Jan 25 2016 5:04pm

SlowCo wrote:The bicycle you mentioned seems to have a Shimano Nexus 7 speed gear hub and is equipped with roller brakes. Onto that you want to put the BBSHD (25-30A controller inside) with a 52V (almost 60V HOTC) battery. That is >1500W to go through a delicate IGH designed for human (<300W) pedal power. I wonder how long the IGH will survive. And you yourself (survive that is). As this combination will be able to reach 30mph with bad brakes....

So maybe a less powerful middrive or a better bike (better brakes / cassette or freewheel gears) might be wise.
@SlowCo, I have been asking myself that too, whether the BBSHD is way too much power. But I was leaning toward the more robust build quality of the BBSHD and planning on using lower power settings. I would make sure the motor disengages for shifts. More robust brakes are probably a good idea.
spinningmagnets wrote:I've seen this before. I empathize with your new-found enthusiasm for ebikes, and...I have a recommendation. Buy one of this model of bicycle, and one kit that you want.

I'd recommend they both be the same voltage, and 52V is an excellent choice.
Thanks, @spinningmagnets. I will definitely be phasing the implementation, maybe even more phases than you suggest. As it is, I'm not the best at finishing projects, and the last thing I need is TWO half-finished projects for my wife to nag about. Haha

1. Either way, I'm getting the Townie Balloon 7i EQs; my wife has her heart set on the Townie, and I can't think of bikes much better suited to cruising.
2. IF I feel the need for pedal assist or going long distances, I'll get one setup for myself, probably the BBS02 with the 52V 13.5Ah bottle battery.
3. If my wife tries mine and wants it too, we may get another setup, at which point I can decide whether I need more power or less, more battery or less.

Thanks again to both of you for your advice!

Any specific advice about throttles, brakes (disc? hydraulic?), displays, chain wheels, Satiator or not, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by SlowCo » Jan 25 2016 7:14pm

No building needed and no chances of not finishing just buy and ride:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 31&t=73415

http://stunner.biktrix.com/

Although I would choose the full suspension bike and mount a higher comfortable cruiser style handle bar and a plush cruiser saddle (slided to the rear):

http://stunner.biktrix.com/monte/

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by spinningmagnets » Jan 25 2016 7:17pm

The Townie is one of my favorite frames...the only upgrades I recommend immediately are a Suntour NCX seatpost, and a cup-holder for a beverage!

davidahn   100 µW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by davidahn » Jan 26 2016 3:04am

SlowCo wrote:No building needed and no chances of not finishing just buy and ride:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 31&t=73415

http://stunner.biktrix.com/

Although I would choose the full suspension bike and mount a higher comfortable cruiser style handle bar and a plush cruiser saddle (slided to the rear):

http://stunner.biktrix.com/monte/
@SlowCo, thanks, these are great options! I was really driven to research the DIY route after sticker shock from the Stromer ST2. The biktrix are much more reasonable. But I'm still leaning toward the Electra Townies' beautiful lines. And MAYBE I'll convert one or both to e-bikes. We'll see!

davidahn   100 µW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by davidahn » Jan 26 2016 3:26am

spinningmagnets wrote:The Townie is one of my favorite frames...the only upgrades I recommend immediately are a Suntour NCX seatpost, and a cup-holder for a beverage!
@spinningmagnets, the NCX seat post looks amazing! I'm getting the balloon versions of the Townies, which I've heard is more comfortable than standard tires. But the balloon tires are probably nothing compared to the comfort of a suspension seatpost, right?

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by davidahn » Jan 26 2016 5:25pm

Ordered the bikes today. 2016 Men's Townie Balloon 7i EQ (Slate), and a 2016 Ladies' Townie Balloon 7i EQ (Azure).

In case anyone else is interested in the Townie Balloon 7i as a starting point for your e-bike, the 2016 Men's Townie Balloon 7i EQ is in stock in the US (but not for long), but the Ladies' is not yet available in the US. I talked to the Trek Bicycle Superstore and they said they had none of the Ladies' Balloon 7i EQ in stock. I found it online from a German dealership and was about to buy it and get it shipped, but I heard warranty support would require shipping the bike to Germany, they ship it to Electra and back to the dealer, then back across the pond to me. I called Electra and they confirmed indeed no warranty support stateside if purchased from a European dealer. But they said the Ladies' Balloon 7i EQ was initially only released to Europe, but that it was decided to also bring them to the US. It's supposed to be coming to the US in early March, so I've pre-ordered through my local Trek Bicycle Superstore. A little late for my wife's birthday, but not THAT late.

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by tomjasz » Jan 27 2016 2:48am

Who needs a warranty on a frame? I have built on 4 crank forwards. Fantastic rides, now one wth the BBSHD (if I ever quit taking it apart to check out how the BBSHD is built!)
Last edited by tomjasz on Feb 09 2016 12:19pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by tomjasz » Feb 09 2016 12:17pm

Gimmick.

I've been riding Townie, KHS Smoothie, TrekPure crank forwards with BBS01, BBS02, and now BBSHD's for 2 years. My exclusive transportation.

If you search the threads you'll find that we, on ES, were the first testers of the gearsensor. Lectric got them after we suggested he might be a good reseller.

I don't pop chains, tear up freewheels or otherwise mess up my bike without one. ESPECIALLY on a crank forward.There's no panic to shift as on a single track. A slight backpedal or tap on the brake does the job of a overpriced gimmick. Other sellers will soon have them only because of the demand created by n00bs buying the line.

From electric fat bike and confirmed by me, "Bafang has stepped up their game something fierce with the BBSHD and created a platform with the BBSHD that is incredibly reliable. They have also decided to start integrating the gear sensor plug into every new BBSHD that they sell (as of right now), which is a decision they should have made several years ago."

E-Rad is a horrible premium soon to be available elsewhere for FAR less $$.

I ran a Sturmey Archer 3 spd with drum brake and never tore it up either. I sold the bike and even built another wheel with a second SA drum brake for future use with a BBSHD.
Last edited by tomjasz on Feb 09 2016 2:14pm, edited 1 time in total.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by tomjasz » Feb 09 2016 12:32pm

spinningmagnets wrote:The Townie is one of my favorite frames...the only upgrades I recommend immediately are a Suntour NCX seatpost, and a cup-holder for a beverage!
With a BBSHD the crank forwards are incredible rides! Solid 33MPH. Now I need to sort a fork for improved front braking. Maybe a new hub motor added for regenerative brakes...It's a disease.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

rick (nova scotia)   10 mW

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by rick (nova scotia) » Feb 09 2016 8:41pm

tomjasz wrote:
spinningmagnets wrote:The Townie is one of my favorite frames...the only upgrades I recommend immediately are a Suntour NCX seatpost, and a cup-holder for a beverage!
With a BBSHD the crank forwards are incredible rides! Solid 33MPH. Now I need to sort a fork for improved front braking. Maybe a new hub motor added for regenerative brakes...It's a disease.
Was thinking the same thing, I did get one of those STUNNERS from BIKTRIX, and I wouldn't mind getting a fork with disc brake mounts. If anyone knows...I'm all ears.

Still a rather noob myself here, so don't know how to watch threads, etc. but will try to keep an eye on this.
To the O.P. hope you like your Townies, BTW they seem a lot like the stunner, in fact I was looking at the townie for fender options for my Stunner.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by tomjasz » Feb 09 2016 8:51pm

isn't the stunner an old school bbs02?
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by rick (nova scotia) » Feb 09 2016 9:20pm

tomjasz wrote:isn't the stunner an old school bbs02?
Old school, hardly, all BBSxx's are quite new and the stunners have the newer upgraded Mosfets, and I guess? all the watts we're aloud on the road with here in Canada. (36V, 500W)

I only got it a short time ago, and because it is winter I haven't had much of a chance to try it long distance, but I live on "English Mountain Road" and I can say I am impressed with it's hill climbing ability for sure. You can google earth that, it's about as steep as any paved road, and it does it with no help from me. Again impressed.

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by spinningmagnets » Feb 09 2016 9:57pm

Last summer, all BBS02 were upgraded from 6 FETs to 9, and shortly after, they were upgraded from generic FETs to name-brand authentic 3077 FETS, so they produce less heat per the same watts of power (compared to before) and because they have 9 FETs instead of 6, they dissipate that heat into the aluminum case better. Since the fall of last year, everyone who retails the BBS02 is getting the latest version.

For the BBS02, I recommend 52V X 20A = 1040W, and many gears to choose from on the rear wheel (7-speed freewheel/Nexus/NuVinci/etc).

For frequent steep hills I recommend the BBSHD at 48V X 30A = 1440W...and only three gears, like the Sturmey SX-RK3

http://electric-fatbike.com/2016/02/08/ ... -for-more/

http://electric-fatbike.com/2016/01/16/ ... da-da-dum/

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Re: Help on BBSHD Options for Townie Balloon 7i EQ

Post by tomjasz » Feb 10 2016 10:04am

By old school I meant to say that despite the improvements in the BBS02, the improvements in the BBSHD really outpace the BBS02.
A very different and much more powerful, better designed, easier to repair, and far more exciting ride with the BBSHD.
The BBS02 has it's place but the BBSHD is the latest, newest, and most exciting product out of Bafang to date. IMO
Check out what Karl has to say. He kinda farted the BBSHD off at first and has a very different opinion today.

I will add another BBS02 to my stable to replace the BBS02 clone I have. But it's old school compared to the HD. Biktrix has a big investment in BBS02's. I love his bikes. I like my HD's better.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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