New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
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famichiki   100 mW

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Re: Tandem battery mounting?

Post by famichiki » Jul 29 2019 8:32pm

RicMcK wrote:
Jul 29 2019 5:55pm
My ideas are that I could put it on the bottom of the cross tube, the bottom of the stoker top tube, or the rear rack. If I mount it upside down I will add some secondary straps to secure it. Do you think it would be OK on the bottom cross tube? I wonder if there is enough ground clearance.
Under the top tube with straps looks good. It's probably wasted space anyway, unless you normally have a frame bag there. Just check first to make sure there is no rubbing on the stoker's legs. I wouldn't put it under the bottom tube, as you probably already have clearance issues there over bumps, curbs etc due to the long wheel base and will end up scraping the battery or getting stuck on something.

Rydon   100 W

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Re: Tandem battery mounting?

Post by Rydon » Jul 29 2019 8:51pm

RicMcK wrote:
Jul 29 2019 5:55pm
With the help of the community I have a plan for the motor and chainring ect. Thank you :D.

My new question is about mounting the battery. I want to use the same battery I am already have, as I don't need 2 batteries as I can only ride one bike at a time. Sadly the battery is about 1.5cm too long to fit in the front or lower triangle. I opened up the case and there is no space to cut out. I could remove the 2 bottle cages in the upper stoker triangle but we need them for water.

My ideas are that I could put it on the bottom of the cross tube, the bottom of the stoker top tube, or the rear rack. If I mount it upside down I will add some secondary straps to secure it. Do you think it would be OK on the bottom cross tube? I wonder if there is enough ground clearance.
When you do a conversion you have to make compromises. The best spot for that battery is where the water bottles are in the stoker position. In fact, I just did a Cannondale tandem just like that and the Jumbo Shark battery mounted perfectly in that spot.
Cannondale tandem BBSHD.jpg
Cannondale tandem BBSHD.jpg (176.98 KiB) Viewed 1031 times
Don't mount it under the bottom tube. You would be asking for trouble. There are a lot more creative solutions for waterbottles than for batteries. However, if you need waterbottle mounts in another spot there are a few creative solutions here: https://www.electrifybike.com/store/c20 ... aft.html#/ Note the Bottle Bob and E-Rad products. You can also add rivnuts to the frame if needed.

hydrinium.h2   1 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by hydrinium.h2 » Jul 30 2019 12:52am

Demion wrote:
Jul 26 2019 3:50am
Anyone tried using Shimano Steps FC-E6000 crank arms? I tried 175mm and when I tighten they are not moving freely. Original crank arms fit well. I have 73mm bottom bracket. Thanks.
Yeah I just ran into the same issue, the holes are bigger than the stock crank arms so instead of leaving an air gap between the bottom bracket and the arm they grind against each other. IDK whats the solution except a shim to make the spindle holes smaller?

famichiki   100 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by famichiki » Jul 30 2019 1:49am

hydrinium.h2 wrote:
Jul 30 2019 12:52am
Demion wrote:
Jul 26 2019 3:50am
Anyone tried using Shimano Steps FC-E6000 crank arms? I tried 175mm and when I tighten they are not moving freely. Original crank arms fit well. I have 73mm bottom bracket. Thanks.
Yeah I just ran into the same issue, the holes are bigger than the stock crank arms so instead of leaving an air gap between the bottom bracket and the arm they grind against each other. IDK whats the solution except a shim to make the spindle holes smaller?
Have newer models shortened the axle? Mine seem don't seem to protrude very much at all, about 17mm. This post has a picture that I shows some differences. So maybe changing the crank arms is not so necessary any more?

https://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/v ... 1#p1481931

hydrinium.h2   1 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by hydrinium.h2 » Jul 30 2019 5:07am

You have the fc-e6000 installed on an older model and they're fine? Mine is from this year so I guess the spindles are shorter. Would you mind posting a picture to show the size of the gap between the crank and the bottom bracket?

jk0ka   1 µW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by jk0ka » Jul 30 2019 6:34am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wThQH5I ... 3e5f88QQK2 in this video at 0:40 the guy uses a scale to see if the motor will fit. Does someone knows the dimensions of the scale, so i could check if i have enough clearance on my fat bike. Or if someone could measure what i indicated on photo so i could check if i need 100mm or 120mm motor. The picture i found online. Thank you. Image
Last edited by jk0ka on Jul 31 2019 3:07am, edited 1 time in total.

Bartman   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Bartman » Jul 30 2019 10:38am

I just installed my new TSDZ2 36v and 48v battery on my purpose-built cargo bike. I am very disappointed by the performance of overvolting. I expected it to be like experimental high cadence 36v on my v0.16 TSDZ2 which is on my other bike. It's not even close.

I have v 0.19 of the firmware and a KTLCD3. I reset everything to factory defaults and setup the motor as type 1 (36v). there is no discernible increase in cadence with the48v battery when compared to swapping it for the 36v battery. and it doesn't seem to register cadence correctly with the 48v battery it eratic. sometimes high sometimes low.

It runs fine with the 36v battery. the new 36v experimental high cadence mode is much improved over v0.16.

I tried the new motor (with 48v battery) in mode 0 (48v) it feels teh same as mode 1. However, in mode 3 (experimental high cadence 36v) it flies. its brilliant.

So my question is - whats the danger with keeping the 48v battery and running in experimental high cadence mode 36v ?

I'm very tempted to return the battery and just get another 36v one. Thoughts?

casainho   1.21 GW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by casainho » Jul 30 2019 11:07am

Bartman wrote:
Jul 30 2019 10:38am
I just installed my new TSDZ2 36v and 48v battery on my purpose-built cargo bike.

So my question is - whats the danger with keeping the 48v battery and running in experimental high cadence mode 36v ?
Please post pictures of your cargo bike!! There aren't much pictures of cargo bikes with TSDZ2.

The high cadence modes should be less efficiency, using more battery power and maybe heating more the motor controller. By now, I think some users already use this mode and no one reported any fatal issue like motor or motor controller burned so I think is probably safe to use it.

You can try find what is limiting the motor RPM and hence cadence, see your values of battery current, motor ERPS and motor PWM ducty-cycle -- see my graphs here showing this variables:

Here is an example of a real riding I did, pulling about 13 amps from my battery that is the max it can handle.

As you can see, the duty-cycle and the motor ERPS values were not at their max values (255 and 525 respectively) but if I was using the max cadence or the max motor power for the battery available, the motor hits his limit even if I pedal harder/use higher assist level. Because of this, I would like to show some warning to user when the motor power hits the limit, maybe changing the power power number from white to orange or something like that.

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Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

Bartman   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Bartman » Jul 30 2019 11:47am

casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2019 11:07am
Bartman wrote:
Jul 30 2019 10:38am
I just installed my new TSDZ2 36v and 48v battery on my purpose-built cargo bike.

So my question is - whats the danger with keeping the 48v battery and running in experimental high cadence mode 36v ?
Please post pictures of your cargo bike!! There aren't much pictures of cargo bikes with TSDZ2.

The high cadence modes should be less efficiency, using more battery power and maybe heating more the motor controller. By now, I think some users already use this mode and no one reported any fatal issue like motor or motor controller burned so I think is probably safe to use it.

You can try find what is limiting the motor RPM and hence cadence, see your values of battery current, motor ERPS and motor PWM ducty-cycle -- see my graphs here showing this variables:

Here is an example of a real riding I did, pulling about 13 amps from my battery that is the max it can handle.

As you can see, the duty-cycle and the motor ERPS values were not at their max values (255 and 525 respectively) but if I was using the max cadence or the max motor power for the battery available, the motor hits his limit even if I pedal harder/use higher assist level. Because of this, I would like to show some warning to user when the motor power hits the limit, maybe changing the power power number from white to orange or something like that.
I'll take some photos over the next day or so and post them here. I specifically built it for the TSDZ2. If I keep the 48v battery, I'll be overvolting the 36v experimental high cadence mode, and my main concern is heat. I live in the highlands of Scotland and heat isn't usually a problem, but we have some high temperatures just now, in the mid 20 degrees.

RicMcK   1 W

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Joined: Jun 19 2019 9:12am

48V motor types?

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 12:29pm

Is there any difference between the 48V motors? IE 500, or 750W? Except for the price?
Rick Seattle WA

RicMcK   1 W

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Re: Tandem battery mounting?

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 12:55pm

Rydon wrote:
Jul 29 2019 8:51pm
RicMcK wrote:
Jul 29 2019 5:55pm
With the help of the community I have a plan for the motor and chainring ect. Thank you :D.

My new question is about mounting the battery. I want to use the same battery I am already have, as I don't need 2 batteries as I can only ride one bike at a time. Sadly the battery is about 1.5cm too long to fit in the front or lower triangle. I opened up the case and there is no space to cut out. I could remove the 2 bottle cages in the upper stoker triangle but we need them for water.

My ideas are that I could put it on the bottom of the cross tube, the bottom of the stoker top tube, or the rear rack. If I mount it upside down I will add some secondary straps to secure it. Do you think it would be OK on the bottom cross tube? I wonder if there is enough ground clearance.
When you do a conversion you have to make compromises. The best spot for that battery is where the water bottles are in the stoker position. In fact, I just did a Cannondale tandem just like that and the Jumbo Shark battery mounted perfectly in that spot.

Cannondale tandem BBSHD.jpg

Don't mount it under the bottom tube. You would be asking for trouble. There are a lot more creative solutions for waterbottles than for batteries. However, if you need waterbottle mounts in another spot there are a few creative solutions here: https://www.electrifybike.com/store/c20 ... aft.html#/ Note the Bottle Bob and E-Rad products. You can also add rivnuts to the frame if needed.

Thanks. I think I will do as your photo and move 1 bottle to seat tube, or I might be able to fit the battery all the way down to the seat tube and have room for a bottle in front of it. Rivnuts are a great idea, I forgot about them for the relocation of the bottle cage.

Thanks
Rick Seattle WA

RicMcK   1 W

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850C display?

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 1:06pm

I saw some posts about only buying the 850C display from a specific vendor because they have the "correct one" (can be hacked & has the required memory), but the final recommendation was not clear to me. How do I specify or know that I am ordering the correct version (hackable)? Or is there a specific store that only sells the correct -hackable version?

Thanks
Rick Seattle WA

casainho   1.21 GW

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Re: 850C display?

Post by casainho » Jul 30 2019 1:46pm

RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:06pm
I saw some posts about only buying the 850C display from a specific vendor because they have the "correct one" (can be hacked & has the required memory), but the final recommendation was not clear to me. How do I specify or know that I am ordering the correct version (hackable)? Or is there a specific store that only sells the correct -hackable version?
You should ask the seller, that will be the safe way.
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

RicMcK   1 W

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Re: 850C display?

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 2:01pm

casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:46pm
RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:06pm
I saw some posts about only buying the 850C display from a specific vendor because they have the "correct one" (can be hacked & has the required memory), but the final recommendation was not clear to me. How do I specify or know that I am ordering the correct version (hackable)? Or is there a specific store that only sells the correct -hackable version?
You should ask the seller, that will be the safe way.
OK thanks. What do I need to ask? Is there a specific version# or some other ID that will help both the vendor and myself be sure I get the correct one?
Rick Seattle WA

casainho   1.21 GW

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Re: 850C display?

Post by casainho » Jul 30 2019 2:18pm

RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 2:01pm
casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:46pm
RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:06pm
I saw some posts about only buying the 850C display from a specific vendor because they have the "correct one" (can be hacked & has the required memory), but the final recommendation was not clear to me. How do I specify or know that I am ordering the correct version (hackable)? Or is there a specific store that only sells the correct -hackable version?
You should ask the seller, that will be the safe way.
OK thanks. What do I need to ask? Is there a specific version# or some other ID that will help both the vendor and myself be sure I get the correct one?
Not that I am aware of. The information I have is the one that is on the wiki.
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

RicMcK   1 W

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Joined: Jun 19 2019 9:12am

Re: 850C display?

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 2:58pm

casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2019 2:18pm
RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 2:01pm
casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:46pm
RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 1:06pm
I saw some posts about only buying the 850C display from a specific vendor because they have the "correct one" (can be hacked & has the required memory), but the final recommendation was not clear to me. How do I specify or know that I am ordering the correct version (hackable)? Or is there a specific store that only sells the correct -hackable version?
You should ask the seller, that will be the safe way.
OK thanks. What do I need to ask? Is there a specific version# or some other ID that will help both the vendor and myself be sure I get the correct one?
Not that I am aware of. The information I have is the one that is on the wiki.
Sorry to be such a clueless user.

Can you please point me (links) to the page(s) where I can find the information on the proper model number(s) for the 850c , flashing process, and controller & display hex files?
Rick Seattle WA

casainho   1.21 GW

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Re: 850C display?

Post by casainho » Jul 30 2019 3:04pm

RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 2:58pm
Sorry to be such a clueless user.

Can you please point me (links) to the page(s) where I can find the information on the proper model number(s) for the 850c , flashing process, and controller & display hex files?
Follow the manual how to install the firmware, all the information is there.
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

RicMcK   1 W

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Joined: Jun 19 2019 9:12am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 10:14pm

Is there a way to have the light circuit on all the time, then by doing the long press + to change the display brightness? I am asking because I would like have the ability to have my headlight flashing all the time (there is a separate power button on the light - off, flashing, high&low). Then when it is dark change the display brightness.
Thanks
Last edited by RicMcK on Jul 30 2019 11:44pm, edited 1 time in total.
Rick Seattle WA

dameri   100 W

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Re: 850C display?

Post by dameri » Jul 30 2019 11:38pm

RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 2:58pm


Can you please point me (links) to the page(s) where I can find the information on the proper model number(s) for the 850c , flashing process, and controller & display hex files?
Look here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... r-LCD-850C
and here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... g-850C-LCD

RicMcK   1 W

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Re: 850C display?

Post by RicMcK » Jul 30 2019 11:45pm

dameri wrote:
Jul 30 2019 11:38pm
RicMcK wrote:
Jul 30 2019 2:58pm


Can you please point me (links) to the page(s) where I can find the information on the proper model number(s) for the 850c , flashing process, and controller & display hex files?
Look here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... r-LCD-850C
and here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... g-850C-LCD
Thanks a bunch 😁
Rick Seattle WA

cnrd   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by cnrd » Jul 31 2019 1:40am

Hey

Anyone who can help me over here: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=101549 I'm trying to figure out how to take the spider off my bike, but it simply won't come off (pics and videos in that thread).

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feketehegyi   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by feketehegyi » Jul 31 2019 3:31am

Hello, do you know if this big gear in my TSDZ2 the spur one? Do you have maybe good pictures how the spur and helical TSDZ2 big gears look like?

Image

casainho   1.21 GW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by casainho » Jul 31 2019 3:39am

feketehegyi wrote:
Jul 31 2019 3:31am
Hello, do you know if this big gear in my TSDZ2 the spur one? Do you have maybe good pictures how the spur and helical TSDZ2 big gears look like?

Image
See on wiki FAQ, there are pictures comparing them: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... i/wiki/FAQ
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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feketehegyi   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by feketehegyi » Jul 31 2019 3:59am

casainho wrote:
Jul 31 2019 3:39am
feketehegyi wrote:
Jul 31 2019 3:31am
Hello, do you know if this big gear in my TSDZ2 the spur one? Do you have maybe good pictures how the spur and helical TSDZ2 big gears look like?

Image
See on wiki FAQ, there are pictures comparing them: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... i/wiki/FAQ
Thanks a lot! Then mine is spur one.

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feketehegyi   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by feketehegyi » Jul 31 2019 4:01am

cnrd wrote:
Jul 31 2019 1:40am
Hey

Anyone who can help me over here: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=101549 I'm trying to figure out how to take the spider off my bike, but it simply won't come off (pics and videos in that thread).
Strange indeed. I'm on the same opinion like Casainho.

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