New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

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el_proletario   10 mW

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Re: TSDZ2 and chainstay clearance

Post by el_proletario » Mar 06 2019 6:20am

hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 4:44am
I'm not sure if TSDZ2 will fit my frame because of the chainstay clearance.
At the moment i have 38T (19T at back) with hebie changlider and TSDZ with 42T chainring on the way.
Couldn't find gear reduction housing diameter. Any info is welcome.

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Hard to say just like that. But I have the exact same setup, 38-19, and the 42 teeth fits nicely, still far from my frame, and the chain line is straight. I'll try to double check the side of my frame to see if it's similar to yours.
Which version of the motor did you order ?

raylo32   10 W

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Re: TSDZ2 and chainstay clearance

Post by raylo32 » Mar 06 2019 6:22am

I think it will fit. I went through this question when I did the build on my Canondale F1000. The gear housing was tight, but plenty of room for the 42T ring. The gear casing is 130mm diameter or 65mm radius. It has a beveled edge that would give more clearance if the housing bolt flange doesn't line up the stay. I needed a 1mm drive side spacer on my bike to add a little clearance. If you want to check the measurement here is the TSDZ2 manual. It doesn't show that measurement but the drawing should be to scale and you can interpolate.

https://files.i4wifi.cz/inc/_doc/attach ... r%20EN.pdf
hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 4:44am
I'm not sure if TSDZ2 will fit my frame because of the chainstay clearance.
At the moment i have 38T (19T at back) with hebie changlider and TSDZ with 42T chainring on the way.
Couldn't find gear reduction housing diameter. Any info is welcome.

hefest   10 W

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Re: TSDZ2 and chainstay clearance

Post by hefest » Mar 06 2019 7:52am

el_proletario wrote:
Mar 06 2019 6:20am
hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 4:44am
I'm not sure if TSDZ2 will fit my frame because of the chainstay clearance.
At the moment i have 38T (19T at back) with hebie changlider and TSDZ with 42T chainring on the way.
Couldn't find gear reduction housing diameter. Any info is welcome.

Image

Image

Image

Image
Hard to say just like that. But I have the exact same setup, 38-19, and the 42 teeth fits nicely, still far from my frame, and the chain line is straight. I'll try to double check the side of my frame to see if it's similar to yours.
Which version of the motor did you order ?
48V 750W and I'm coupling it with Shimano Nexus 8 IGH.
From calculations I picked up 42-19 is not going to make much difference compared to 38-19. Highest gear (1st) is going to sit between the current (39-19) 1st and 2nd gears. Should be enough to tackle the steep hills I encounter on my daily commute.
Bummer is that I'll need to replace the chain to accommodate 42-19.
raylo32 wrote:
Mar 06 2019 6:22am
I think it will fit. I went through this question when I did the build on my Canondale F1000. The gear housing was tight, but plenty of room for the 42T ring. The gear casing is 130mm diameter or 65mm radius. It has a beveled edge that would give more clearance if the housing bolt flange doesn't line up the stay. I needed a 1mm drive side spacer on my bike to add a little clearance. If you want to check the measurement here is the TSDZ2 manual. It doesn't show that measurement but the drawing should be to scale and you can interpolate.

https://files.i4wifi.cz/inc/_doc/attach ... r%20EN.pdf
I ordered pack of 35mm aluminium spacers just in case, but that would mean my chainline is going to be off. Not sure how well Nexus 8 IGH is going to like it. Thanks for the info on diameter of the housing.

I'm also really sad that I will not be able to fit easily Hebie Chainglider, that thing is really nice.

raylo32   10 W

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Re: TSDZ2 and chainstay clearance

Post by raylo32 » Mar 06 2019 8:30am

35mm spacers?? Or 35 spacers of various mm's? If you need any BB spacer at all it'll only be a very few mm and won't push the chainline too much. My chainline is essentially perfect. The standard TSDZ2 chainline with the stock 42T ring is 51mm and I have a 1mm spacer so 2mm out from the standard 50mm on my 68mm BB. Not even noticeable.
hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 7:52am

I ordered pack of 35mm aluminium spacers just in case, but that would mean my chainline is going to be off. Not sure how well Nexus 8 IGH is going to like it. Thanks for the info on diameter of the housing.

I'm also really sad that I will not be able to fit easily Hebie Chainglider, that thing is really nice.

Aeron   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Aeron » Mar 06 2019 10:15am

I've read the last 20 pages or so of this thread and I'm more and more interested in this drive for my next build. ATM, I only have a few questions, maybe I missed the answer, or maybe it's in the 165 pages I didn't read :oops:

I'm planning to buy a 48V version with VLCD6, because I'm looking for a small a display, and I don't need a throttle. I will use brake sensors which I believe I can add afterwards, even with the 6pin connector coming with the VLCD6 version of the drive (even if it requires splicing, no problemo). I will also install a temp sensor, because I want to make sure I won't cook the motor. But to make my choice, I need to understand a few things:

Can the VLCD6 (controller flashed with OS firmware from qmarco) display the temp info ?
How is the temperature information used ? Be it in the KT-LCD3 or in the VLCD6 if it can display it.
I mean, can I set a max temp (with reduced power once attained) or is it just a indicator (and I do have to manually manage the heat by reducing the use of the drive) ?

casainho   1 GW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by casainho » Mar 06 2019 10:40am

Aeron wrote:
Mar 06 2019 10:15am
I've read the last 20 pages or so of this thread and I'm more and more interested in this drive for my next build. ATM, I only have a few questions, maybe I missed the answer, or maybe it's in the 165 pages I didn't read :oops:

I'm planning to buy a 48V version with VLCD6, because I'm looking for a small a display, and I don't need a throttle. I will use brake sensors which I believe I can add afterwards, even with the 6pin connector coming with the VLCD6 version of the drive (even if it requires splicing, no problemo). I will also install a temp sensor, because I want to make sure I won't cook the motor. But to make my choice, I need to understand a few things:

Can the VLCD6 (controller flashed with OS firmware from qmarco) display the temp info ?
How is the temperature information used ? Be it in the KT-LCD3 or in the VLCD6 if it can display it.
I mean, can I set a max temp (with reduced power once attained) or is it just a indicator (and I do have to manually manage the heat by reducing the use of the drive) ?
You should read the OpenSource firmware wiki pages as the answer is clearly there.
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

hefest   10 W

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Re: TSDZ2 and chainstay clearance

Post by hefest » Mar 06 2019 1:44pm

raylo32 wrote:
Mar 06 2019 8:30am
35mm spacers?? Or 35 spacers of various mm's? If you need any BB spacer at all it'll only be a very few mm and won't push the chainline too much. My chainline is essentially perfect. The standard TSDZ2 chainline with the stock 42T ring is 51mm and I have a 1mm spacer so 2mm out from the standard 50mm on my 68mm BB. Not even noticeable.
hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 7:52am

I ordered pack of 35mm aluminium spacers just in case, but that would mean my chainline is going to be off. Not sure how well Nexus 8 IGH is going to like it. Thanks for the info on diameter of the housing.

I'm also really sad that I will not be able to fit easily Hebie Chainglider, that thing is really nice.
Spacer is 35mm internal diameter 1mm thick. I guess i won't need more than 5 of those since that's how much I ordered.

Aeron   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Aeron » Mar 06 2019 2:37pm

casainho wrote:
Mar 06 2019 10:40am
You should read the OpenSource firmware wiki pages as the answer is clearly there.
Thanks, I didn't see the wiki before (I'm not really familiar with github). I now have my answer for the KT display, but I wasn't able to find the same for the VLCD6 display (with Qmarco firmware flashed on controller). I guess it's because it's not possible to display temp on it.

raylo32   10 W

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Re: TSDZ2 and chainstay clearance

Post by raylo32 » Mar 06 2019 2:56pm

Ah, that makes sense. You will also need some small diameter washers the same thickness on the non-drive side to take up the extra space this move creates on the mounting plate.

hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 1:44pm
hefest wrote:
Mar 06 2019 7:52am

I ordered pack of 35mm aluminium spacers just in case, but that would mean my chainline is going to be off. Not sure how well Nexus 8 IGH is going to like it. Thanks for the info on diameter of the housing.

I'm also really sad that I will not be able to fit easily Hebie Chainglider, that thing is really nice.
Spacer is 35mm internal diameter 1mm thick. I guess i won't need more than 5 of those since that's how much I ordered.
[/quote]

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itsallwhite   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by itsallwhite » Mar 07 2019 6:15pm

I tried to fit a 34t tooth chainring to my TSDZ2 but I'm not sure if its supposed to go on the inside of the 'spider' that holds the chainring (where original chainring was) or on the outside (where chainring guard was previously).

When I fit to the inside of the 'spider' the chain rubs against the sprag clutch dust cover, but when on the outside the chainline is bad (65mm and lining up gear 7, the smallest cog on back).

Do you know where its supposed to fit?

Image

(sorry for poor photo!)
Bike 1: Giant Hybrid Steel Frame (old) with TSDZ2 48v 500w.
Bike 2: GT Sensor 2 full suspension mountain bike. Work in Progress - ready to 'electrify'!
House: 100% off grid - 5.6kw solar array with selectronics inverter and 24 Volt 1450 Ah BAE Gel battery Bank

ri53hu   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ri53hu » Mar 08 2019 11:58am

itsallwhite
Hello, I have a 34 / 38T x9- 11-36 cassette I'm handing over when I need it.R
Attachments
IMG_20190308_161006.jpg
IMG_20190308_161024.jpg
Last edited by ri53hu on Mar 09 2019 1:32am, edited 1 time in total.

Mike-P   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Mike-P » Mar 08 2019 4:12pm

itsallwhite wrote:
Mar 07 2019 6:15pm
When I fit to the inside of the 'spider' the chain rubs against the sprag clutch dust cover
Is it a recently bought 48v model as that sounds like the part I am trying to source - mine has no "dust cover" to hinder a chainwheel. Suggest fitting washers/spacers to offset the chainwheel sufficiently to clear it with the spider on the outside of the chainwheel.

ri53hu   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ri53hu » Mar 09 2019 2:30am

Spider under the spider.
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itsallwhite   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by itsallwhite » Mar 09 2019 4:32am

ri53hu wrote:
Mar 09 2019 2:30am
Spider under the spider.
Is this something you made or can you purchase it?
Bike 1: Giant Hybrid Steel Frame (old) with TSDZ2 48v 500w.
Bike 2: GT Sensor 2 full suspension mountain bike. Work in Progress - ready to 'electrify'!
House: 100% off grid - 5.6kw solar array with selectronics inverter and 24 Volt 1450 Ah BAE Gel battery Bank

Mike-P   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Mike-P » Mar 09 2019 4:50am

ri53hu wrote:
Mar 09 2019 2:30am
Spider under the spider.
Where did you get it from and how thick is it?
I take it the holes are M5 for the spider bolts.
I have found fitting the spider on the outside of a chainwheel (or between a pair of chainwheels) requires care in tightening up the five spider bolts as if one or two are tightened too much the whole mechanism locks up hence my use of spacers/washers in such circumstances of a depth equivalent to the thickness of the (inner) chainwheel that is being fitted. With the dust cover referenced above it would therefore need to be the thickness of the chainwheel plus the necessary clearance of the dust cover.

In terms of sourcing a dust cover I have emailed the German service centre and await their reply.

ri53hu   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ri53hu » Mar 09 2019 5:17am

Hi,
I have made it according to the interior of the spider thickness is 1mm because I caught the lock on the plastic motor cover coming from the engine side.
I use the translator, R.

Retrorockit   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Retrorockit » Mar 09 2019 11:21am

If the chainring isn't counterbored on the inside it may be that it's just the nuts that are hitting the cover ( I see that your outer ones aren't counterbored either) TS used a thin steel chainring and thin chainguard. Aftermarket aluminum chainrings are thicker. It may be cheaper to buy chainrings already counterbored than to pay someone to do this. But you will need to allow room for the chain plates inside the cog also. If you use the shim as shown apply some sealer to it because the O ring on the face of the hub won't be touching anymore. If you use washers then get an O ring thicker than the washers to seal up the bearing area. I also notice that you have a narrow wide chainring. These are only for 1x drivetrains. With a front derailer there is no way to be sure they will engage the proper narrow chain links (unless you just switch them manually to avoid this).
I got a Wippermann 1E8 single speed e bike chain and installed it on my 44T inset chainring @47MM centerline. Unlike their multispeed chains which are normal thickness, the 1 speed E bike chain is very thick. All of the clearance I gained with 1.5mm washers went away. I have about .010" clearance to the custom thin metal wiring cover I made. Also some chain breakers won't push the pin far enough to split a chain this thick (too much German precision Rohloff). My bike is off at the LBS getting new internal cbale housings installed. I added a hole on top of the downtube on the drive side so the cable can go above the BB. On the left I installed a flat head countersunk bolt in the front hole so the cable can pass there. This removes a lot of metal from the bracket there. I only did the front hole due to this, a button head bolt would be a safer solution. Trek crossed the cables in front of the headtube,then crossed them again inside the frame, then again under the BB shell. Maybe they don't rattle inside the frame that way?

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itsallwhite   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by itsallwhite » Mar 10 2019 4:29am

ri53hu wrote:
Mar 08 2019 11:58am
itsallwhite
Hello, I have a 34 / 38T x9- 11-36 cassette I'm handing over when I need it.R
And does it rub against the dust cover housing? Did you do anything to space it out?
Bike 1: Giant Hybrid Steel Frame (old) with TSDZ2 48v 500w.
Bike 2: GT Sensor 2 full suspension mountain bike. Work in Progress - ready to 'electrify'!
House: 100% off grid - 5.6kw solar array with selectronics inverter and 24 Volt 1450 Ah BAE Gel battery Bank

ri53hu   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ri53hu » Mar 10 2019 8:16am

Hello, I do not handle the dust cover.

ri53hu   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ri53hu » Mar 10 2019 8:34am

eybyesickle

Please what is the difference between
48vdatamemory.hex and 48vdatamemory.s19 :?:

raylo32   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by raylo32 » Mar 10 2019 8:54am

Just different file formats. Some older PCs only work with hex but my Windows 10 notebook worked with the newer S19 when I flashed my TSDZ2.
ri53hu wrote:
Mar 10 2019 8:34am
eybyesickle

Please what is the difference between
48vdatamemory.hex and 48vdatamemory.s19 :?:

ri53hu   10 mW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ri53hu » Mar 10 2019 12:13pm

Raylo32
Thank you, I already have my TSDZ2 48v flash s19 and is much better than the original firmwre. :bigthumb:

mctubster   100 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by mctubster » Mar 10 2019 10:09pm

Hi,

Any thoughts on an aftermarket chain guard for the TSDZ2? Anyone using one?

Cheers

casainho   1 GW

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by casainho » Mar 11 2019 8:23am

Time to time I get some donations, which I am being using to buy resources for my investigations and developments. I have not been grateful publicly or privately the donations because I have so little time that is not enough for the developments that are needed to be done.

This days I got a donnation with the following message:
Sold a few FOS firmware products on my Website http://www.electrifybike.com/store/c37/ ... ducts.html I will be contributing 10% of sales to the developers for a period of time.
I am spreading this because this shop because other than being friendly for the developent of our OpenSource firmware for TSDZ2 (that can be applied for other ebike motor controllers, or any BLDC motor controller), this shops sells the needed TSDZ2 and LCD3 already programmed with our firmware and connections!!!
I will link to this shop on wiki as this may be very important for some users!!

Image

https://www.electrifybike.com/store/c37 ... ducts.html#/
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

sysrq   10 W

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Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by sysrq » Mar 11 2019 1:20pm

Does anybody know how the tsdz2 torque sensor rotary transformer can work only with two wires?
https://www.omega.com/literature/transa ... orce3.html
http://www.sensorland.com/HowPage075.html

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