BBSHD - Creaking Sound

automan25

100 mW
Joined
Feb 5, 2017
Messages
44
My new (and only) BBSHD build had developed a creaking sound down by the bottom bracket. It only happens when I am pedaling and gets stronger when I begin putting more effort into it. I've checked every nut and bolt I can get to without removing the BBSHD and all seem secure. One thing I noticed is that the bottom bracket shaft has a slight lateral movement to it as you can see in this video:

https://goo.gl/photos/cvLBiFFrLi4v5bVR6

Is this movement normal? My wife's bike has the BBS02 and it doesn't have this movement in the shaft. Any help on resolving this issue would be most appreciated.

Thanks.
 
Luna tech support suggests it might be a bad thrust bearing. How can this be after only 200 miles. Has anyone else had issues with the thrust bearing?
 
automan25 said:
Luna tech support suggests it might be a bad thrust bearing. How can this be after only 200 miles. Has anyone else had issues with the thrust bearing?

Have you removed the crank arm and checked the bottom bracket lock nut? Edit: I believe there are two on the non-drive side, one secures the motor while the other helps to reatin the first.

Looks pretty dirty down there, a cleaning wouldn't hurt and may eliminate the creaking. I would take it off the bike, clean/wipe down everything and re-assemble. The lateral movement does seem strange though, my buddy doesn't have his BBSHD on right now or i would check. I guess i could see if it does that same thing without being on the bike too, i'll check when i get home.
 
Thanks for the reply m4k3r. I checked both bottom bracket lock nuts and both are as tight as they need to be. I plan on removing the spindle this evening to examine the thrust bearing. I suspect that is the culprit. I definitely would appreciate it if you could report back on the lateral movement on your friend's bbshd.
 
I broke into the BBSHD this evening to examine the thrust bearing for damage. I don't see anything, but I also don't really know what I'm looking for. The bearing is very small, so the damage could be small as well. Or the bearing could just be a bit out of specification, something that would be impossible to visualize. Anyway, here are the photos I took of it. Anyone else have any observations?

https://goo.gl/photos/35LdaFd6S6BpjbJa8
 
That's a lot of end float in the video of you moving the crank. Looks to me like the thrust bearing wasn't adjusted correctly to begin with. Now you have taken it apart, when you put it back together if you set the thrust bearing clearance correctly you might find the creaking disappears along with the end float.
 
Hi guys,
First time post. Just wondering whether you fixed the creaking sound? My wife had a creaking sound on her BBSHD, I took a look and found the pedal was working loose, tightened it and no longer creaking.
Apologies if it is no longer an issue.
 
I don't know if it's fixed yet. I haven't ridden the bike since I reassembled the bearing. I live in Seattle and it's been raining a bunch. I'll try tightening the pedals down as much as I can. Would you mind checking your wife's bike to see how much lateral movement there is in the crank shaft? I'd like to get an idea of what is considered "normal".
 
I was able to check my buddies BBSHD and didn't notice any lateral movement, mind you the drive is off the bike so not sure if that would make a difference but thought I'd mention it.

Now that you've re-assembled the drive is the movement still there?
 
I just checked the lateral movement again, post reassembly. It sort of seems like their might be less, but I'm not really sure. It would be fractions of a millimeter if anything. It's still there, but is well within the 3mm tolerance limit Luna is suggesting. I don't see any real way to adjust for the movement, short of inserting a spacer that would take up the extra space. I still haven't had a chance to ride it since I've reassembled it, again, because of this crummy Seattle weather. I've really gotta move out of Puget Sound. The weather is just so bad 9 months of the year.
 
automan25 said:
Luna tech support suggests it might be a bad thrust bearing. How can this be after only 200 miles. Has anyone else had issues with the thrust bearing?
I'd seen several do this early on. How? A build problem. 3, I was aware of got worse, and were replaced. See what Matt at Empowered thinks, or Bruno the fellow that produced the BBSHD videos. I poked them and biktrix. I dont remember what they did.
 
Well it turns out as I told my wife how amazing I was to help someone out on my first post to endless-sphere, she informed me her BBSHD was still creaking during her latest ride, so I then checked the crank arms were tight enough and it seems to have fixed the problem and I took it for a ride myself. I hope it helps!
 
There is another version of this site on Facebook, Sevral dealer pals hang out and I reached out to them. I couldn't find my old notes..Here's what I was reminded of by Bruno, quoted here and I believe the best advise. Confirmed by a second dealer. And subsequently found in my notes, along with mention of a single case of a badly seated clutch. Bafang doesn't seen to be ever willing to admit they let bad builds get out. This is why we buy from dealers with good warranty policies. Not direct from China. With one or two exceptions, like EM3ev. I found one incident in my notes up in Canada where it did get worse. I imagine due to odd wear patterns with the movement. Neither of mine had any noticeable movement.

Bruno said:
"Check the little ball bearing that goes between the PAS magnetic disc and the motor casing, that little bearing is the only thing stopping the shaft from going towards the non drive side and the freewheel is stopping from going towards the drive side.
There are also machining tolerances, when you combine multiple parts these tolerances can be more than desired.
Spoke to Bafang in person recently, tried to tell them about some other common issues... they won't listen to anyone... they reeeeally believe their motors are perfect and their business is so successful... and blablabla...
Maybe try to add a washer before the bearing to compensate any machining tolerance gap? I haven't tried but I think it would do the trick =]"
 
My BBSHD on a Marin Muirwoods started creaking a week after I fitted it so I retightened the bb nuts and its sorted.
It must have been settling in.
 
Think I have developed the same problem with mine, crank lateral movement and the creaking noise under both pedal and throttle load.

Have you been able to fix it yet and was it a difficult job
 
I haven't fixed it yet. Luna sent me a replacement bearing. Hopefully I can find the time this evening to put it in and see if that solves the issue. I'll report back soon.
 
Here's an update.

Last night I installed the new bearing from Luna. It didn't fix the lateral movement and I didn't test for the creaking noise since it was raining, again.

Today I went to the hardware store and picked up a stainless steel washer that was the same outside diameter as the outside thrust bearing race. The inside diameter of the washer was too small, so I used my Dremel tool to grind it down until it just fit over the shaft. I smoothed out the rough edges and installed it on the shaft behind the race as suggested by Bruno's quote above. I put the shaft back in and tightened down the cover. At this point it was extremely difficult to rotate the shaft backward as you might do when pedaling backward. Obviously this meant that the bearing was too tight. I removed the cover and shaft and used my Dremel to grind down one side of the washer to reduce the thickness. Since the Dremel is not a very precise machining tool I also put a glove on and rubbed (in a swirl pattern) the same side of the washer on the cement floor of my garage to even things out. I reinstalled everything. This time the shaft would rotate, but there was still more resistance than I was comfortable with. I repeated the process and reduced the thickness of the washer a bit more. This time everything felt just right. The shaft moves freely and there is no more lateral play. I haven't had a chance to test to see if the creaking noise is gone since, (yes, you guessed it) it's raining again. All in all, I'm pretty happy I was able to get rid of the lateral movement and the total cost was only 35 cents for the washer and 1.5 hours of my time.

Here's a photo of the washer on the shaft:

https://goo.gl/photos/c5sQj1Gox55KJs2n7
 
Another Update:

The bike seems to work fine and as mentioned before, the lateral movement on the shaft is gone. There is still some creaking noise, but it's a lot less than before. I'm not sure if I can attribute this the bearing spacer I installed, or the fact that I just tightened the hell out of the bolt that holds on the crank arms.
 
It's been about a hundred miles since my last post. The creaking sound is virtually gone now. I'm calling this one successful.
 
Nicely done! My bbshd has the exact problem. Thanks for the washer tip.
 
This post saved me a lot of time and stress! Thank you automan25.

The only thing I'd add is that in my case a washer was too thick, and sanding it down to the correct thickness (about 1/3 - 1/2 the original thickness) proved to be too difficult. I ended up buying a 26-gauge metal sheet from Home Depot (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-24-in-x-36-in-26-Gauge-Zinc-Metal-Sheet-801437/204225786) and used the Dremel and a step bit to cut a new washer from it. It took ~20 minutes and ended up completely fixing my problem.
 
Excellent! I'm so glad my work helped you out. That's the beauty of these online forums.
 
California eBikes will be putting up some shims that can be used for taking up the space!
BBSHD shaft shims lateral movement fix
https://california-ebike.com/product/bafanf-bbshd-pedal-shaft-bearing-spacers-set-3/
 
The creaking in the bottom bracket is back. Probably due to changes in the weather. I decided to remove the BbsHD from the bottom bracket to check for any play between the shaft and the bottom bracket shell. It turns out there is quite a bit. I'm pretty sure this the source of the noise. I think the noise would go away if the shaft fit in the bottom bracket more snugly. Does anyone know of a sleeve that could take up the extra space?
 
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