Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

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brumbrum   100 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by brumbrum » Apr 07 2018 3:19am

mr.electric wrote:
Apr 07 2018 3:02am
Basically John Holmes sounds like a bumbling idiot who has been running an ebike business for years and somehow does not have an amp hour gauge or even a multi meter to give us real numbers. But he got instant fame by doing a sur ron review on his you tube channel with no real data. The ebike business has been filled with people for years exaggerating numbers and the Sur Ron comes in for real with a 2000 watt hour pack which is equal to about 4x any typical ebike pack. Sur ron has real performance and at an affordable price. Do you guys really wish that Luna specs a $2000 fox fork with it and doubles the price of the bike? Who really cares what cheap fork the bike comes with? The dnm that hyena mentions ..dnm stand for do not move and luna has had that exact 8 inch fork on their website for years. Sur ron has real performance at an affordable price something we have been waiting for in a production ebike. What is sad is most of the people in this thread are dealers and they should be clear about that. Jay Hyena probably did not have a choice when he got his bikes with Fast Ace forks. He should also be clear he is not selling the latest version of Sur Ron bikes which no one is arguing Luna has the latest and greatest Sur Ron has to offer. A lot of sour grapes dealers in this thread.
A bit harsh on JH, but yeah, it seems like Luna has the monopoly.
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by mr.electric » Apr 07 2018 3:26am

I have known the owner of Luna for years (although I see him very infrequently these days) and trust me he is one of us. A true ebike lover with real ideals and when I knew him he was dirt poor (as far as i know still dirt poor now). As far as I know he has done no one wrong but i wouldnt want to compete with him in his game. I am trying to get a deal on a Sur Ron bike right now and have not gotten a return email. Whatever call it poor customer service or maybe he just cant keep up with the demand. I for one am rooting for him. Luna came out of a shitty garage in a shitty house in Hawthorne and are growing really fast and should be an inspiration to all of us. I was there when eric started his first ebike store in san francisco 10 years ago and i was there when he bankrupted it a few years later.Nobody who has met eric or rode with him will ever doubt his intentions.
Last edited by mr.electric on Apr 07 2018 3:59am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by NoFanBoiz » Apr 07 2018 3:53am

johnrobholmes wrote:
Apr 06 2018 10:25pm

At this point it's my responsibility to hook up a CA and drain the bike down until LVC or limp mode, and the owner wants me to take the pack apart and look for the bum string. Either way I'm out time and money to investigate an issue that should not be mine to bear, and then they could easily turn around and refuse a warranty because I took it apart. Fantastic position to be in. :roll:
FFS. The goods were not as described, simply do a CC chargeback.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by johnrobholmes » Apr 07 2018 7:14am

Instant fame on YouTube :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

What I don’t have is a lot of spare time. My own hobbies have been on hold since having kids, that includes wrenching and riding bikes as much as I would like.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Gloert16 » Apr 07 2018 5:17pm

mr.electric wrote:
Apr 07 2018 3:02am
Basically John Holmes sounds like a bumbling idiot who has been running an ebike business for years and somehow does not have an amp hour gauge or even a multi meter to give us real numbers. But he got instant fame by doing a sur ron review on his you tube channel with no real data. The ebike business has been filled with people for years exaggerating numbers and the Sur Ron comes in for real with a 2000 watt hour pack which is equal to about 4x any typical ebike pack. Sur ron has real performance and at an affordable price. Do you guys really wish that Luna specs a $2000 fox fork with it and doubles the price of the bike? Who really cares what cheap fork the bike comes with? The dnm that hyena mentions ..dnm stand for do not move and luna has had that exact 8 inch fork on their website for years. Sur ron has real performance at an affordable price something we have been waiting for in a production ebike. What is sad is most of the people in this thread are dealers and they should be clear about that. Jay Hyena probably did not have a choice when he got his bikes with Fast Ace forks. He should also be clear he is not selling the latest version of Sur Ron bikes which no one is arguing Luna has the latest and greatest Sur Ron has to offer. A lot of sour grapes dealers in this thread.
You missed the whole point of the complaints being discussed here. It's less about what fork came on the bike, or the battery, etc, as it is about the approach of customer service at Luna when a complaint is logged. I think Hyena, Homes, and everyone else on here are pretty stoked about this bike and no one disagrees with you that it's an incredible value with excellent performance. That said, world class customer service is about assuming the customer is right up front and digging into the issue, not telling them they are wrong every step of the way or dismissing their complaint/concern with a one sentence reply. The end solution for the customer may be the same in either case, but its the approach which defines a business' customer service.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by stonezone » Apr 07 2018 5:23pm

brumbrum wrote:
Apr 07 2018 3:19am
mr.electric wrote:
Apr 07 2018 3:02am
Basically John Holmes sounds like a bumbling idiot who has been running an ebike business for years and somehow does not have an amp hour gauge or even a multi meter to give us real numbers. But he got instant fame by doing a sur ron review on his you tube channel with no real data. The ebike business has been filled with people for years exaggerating numbers and the Sur Ron comes in for real with a 2000 watt hour pack which is equal to about 4x any typical ebike pack. Sur ron has real performance and at an affordable price. Do you guys really wish that Luna specs a $2000 fox fork with it and doubles the price of the bike? Who really cares what cheap fork the bike comes with? The dnm that hyena mentions ..dnm stand for do not move and luna has had that exact 8 inch fork on their website for years. Sur ron has real performance at an affordable price something we have been waiting for in a production ebike. What is sad is most of the people in this thread are dealers and they should be clear about that. Jay Hyena probably did not have a choice when he got his bikes with Fast Ace forks. He should also be clear he is not selling the latest version of Sur Ron bikes which no one is arguing Luna has the latest and greatest Sur Ron has to offer. A lot of sour grapes dealers in this thread.
A bit harsh on JH, but yeah, it seems like Luna has the monopoly.
I agree with what you are saying except regarding JH. He seems like a good guy, puts out informative vids which have plenty of value for myself and others. You might want to settle down or go shove your head back up where the sun don’t shine eh? Thanks for coming, now don’t forget to leave.

Regarding Luna, I’ve gotten great support from them with the only two issues I had. Shipping was initially confusing between us but understandable with their obvious growing pains. We all have something special in common, try putting yourself in the others shoes and save the shit talking for the ebike hating suffer cycles.
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by dirkdiggler » Apr 07 2018 6:08pm

I know it sucks to have bad customer support. Been there too many times myself. Just bought a quadcopter with a broken motor. Support gave me $20 back. I still get to spend that much to replace the motor and waiting a week or two for the part. Then I get the privilege of fixings it myself. I buy too much stuff for China and it's hit or miss. I am glad that I was able to deal with Luna on this bike as I don't feel I'd have any support from the factory. Plus, it'd take weeks or months to get parts from China. I have ordered a few things from Luna and had good luck. I also know that trying to run a slim margin business is tough. I don't think they make much per bike, I got basically the same quote from Sur-ron. I imagine one issue and their goes any profit from a sale. Hopefully things get worked out. Next time you could order from Australia, I guess.
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by artisanstone » Apr 07 2018 6:21pm

Fun thing I did today. Brake indeed cuts off throttle either front or back. From a standstill you can use it like a trans brake on a dragster. Hold brake, pin throttle, release brake. Good times.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Marksteamnz » Apr 07 2018 7:02pm

artisanstone wrote:
Apr 07 2018 6:21pm
Fun thing I did today. Brake indeed cuts off throttle either front or back. From a standstill you can use it like a trans brake on a dragster. Hold brake, pin throttle, release brake. Good times.
:-) I did that by accident because I am a pretty crap rider and hadn't thought through the logic of the e brake system. "Why is it not going, wind on more throttle, why is it not going, wind on more throttle, oh I have the brake lever pulled in a bit as I am on a slope, release brake, $$#@#!" A bit of a surprise to put it mildly. That may be how the Sur-Ron pro in the video can loft the front wheel so effortlessly and no I am not exploring that idea. Old fragile bones mumble mumble

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by johnrobholmes » Apr 07 2018 8:23pm

That sounds fun! Mine only has a cutout on the rear brake, not front. I’ll have to try a hard launch now :)


All in all I’m certainly still loving my bike. It’s tough to put many miles on it between the weather and only living 2 miles from the shop, but I ride it to work every day possible.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by DanGT86 » Apr 07 2018 9:54pm

The brake handle throttle override has actually caused 2 people to wreck on my ebikes. Both were non motorcycle riders who had never used a twist throttle before. They claimed the bike took off by itself. Both times it was during a low speed turn where they released the brake and didnt realize they had the throttle twisted. I switched to a button for regen after the 2nd wreck. If the throttle ever gets stuck I like having a way to override it but I think brake levers should be brakes only. Also gets tricky to modulate on slippery surfaces when the brake is also regen. Suspensions also act differently when loaded against the brakes. It might be minor but its amazing the subtleties a brain can get used to while riding.

I do wonder sometimes if a simulated clutch lever would help some motorcycle converts get used to electric. Basically the idea would be to setup a clutch lever thats opposite of the throttle such that the throttle signal to the controller decreases as you pull the "clutch" lever. Probably a discussion for another thread.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by jph3 » Apr 07 2018 11:00pm

Quick question, don’t have a manual so I’m going off the documentation link from LC’s website.

Removed both batteries and charged them. First bike, first battery. Air switch off, plug it in, air switch on, nothing. Air switch off, remove battery, put it in second bike. Same procedure, everything works on the second bike.

Go back to first bike, put the second battery in... air switch on, key on... nothing. There is a small humming coming from the controller. I’ve checked the kickstand... not sure what else to look for from here? Any ideas what I might be dealing with?

I have zero time on either bike... forks were mailed back about 90 minutes after getting the Bikes in.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by m3t » Apr 07 2018 11:59pm

jph3 wrote:
Apr 07 2018 11:00pm
Quick question, don’t have a manual so I’m going off the documentation link from LC’s website.

Removed both batteries and charged them. First bike, first battery. Air switch off, plug it in, air switch on, nothing. Air switch off, remove battery, put it in second bike. Same procedure, everything works on the second bike.

Go back to first bike, put the second battery in... air switch on, key on... nothing. There is a small humming coming from the controller. I’ve checked the kickstand... not sure what else to look for from here? Any ideas what I might be dealing with?

I have zero time on either bike... forks were mailed back about 90 minutes after getting the Bikes in.
That is definitely very weird. Try unplugging battery and doing it all again? Otherwise, sounds like you have a faulty controller. I don't hear any humming it's on.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fechter » Apr 08 2018 12:04am

Check the brake switches. I think the brake light would come on if either was active.

Another test would be to raise the rear wheel, apply throttle and if it doesn't move, try moving it by hand and see if the resistance is different than with no throttle.
"One test is worth a thousand opinions"

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by jph3 » Apr 08 2018 12:37am

Been messing around with it... wiggling through wires coming out of the frame and I did get intermittent power. I could get it to stay on without any movement, but as soon as I moved, it went out again. Must be a loose connection in the bunch.

Good sign I guess that it’s not the controller, but looks like I’m going to have to dig a bit to find the culprit.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rodney64 » Apr 08 2018 1:07am

jph3 wrote:
Apr 08 2018 12:37am
Been messing around with it... wiggling through wires coming out of the frame and I did get intermittent power. I could get it to stay on without any movement, but as soon as I moved, it went out again. Must be a loose connection in the bunch.

Good sign I guess that it’s not the controller, but looks like I’m going to have to dig a bit to find the culprit.
It maybe a blown fuse. if you open the battery compartment and pull out the battery then open the fuse box which is located in front of the air switch. There will be a spare fuse stored in the lid

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by artisanstone » Apr 08 2018 6:57am

fechter wrote:
Apr 08 2018 12:04am
Check the brake switches. I think the brake light would come on if either was active.
Is there rear light supposed to be brake activated? Mine is always on if bike is on.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by m3t » Apr 08 2018 5:35pm

artisanstone wrote:
Apr 08 2018 6:57am
fechter wrote:
Apr 08 2018 12:04am
Check the brake switches. I think the brake light would come on if either was active.
Is there rear light supposed to be brake activated? Mine is always on if bike is on.
No. It’s not a brake light, just a tail light, which is kinda weird cuz they went through the trouble of installing proximity switches on our brake handles so it has all the hardware necessary...

Short answer: Don’t worry about it, that’s normal. Mine is always on, as is my headlight which I actually wish I could turn off.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by m3t » Apr 08 2018 5:36pm

jph3 wrote:
Apr 08 2018 12:37am
Been messing around with it... wiggling through wires coming out of the frame and I did get intermittent power. I could get it to stay on without any movement, but as soon as I moved, it went out again. Must be a loose connection in the bunch.

Good sign I guess that it’s not the controller, but looks like I’m going to have to dig a bit to find the culprit.
That’s good to hear. It’s really easy to access all the wiring. Just remove the front skid plate (4 stainless screws coming in from the sides) and the plastic covers, the two mounting screws on the bottom, and you’re there.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Marksteamnz » Apr 08 2018 7:49pm

Rodney64 wrote:
Apr 08 2018 1:07am
jph3 wrote:
Apr 08 2018 12:37am
Been messing around with it... wiggling through wires coming out of the frame and I did get intermittent power. I could get it to stay on without any movement, but as soon as I moved, it went out again. Must be a loose connection in the bunch.

Good sign I guess that it’s not the controller, but looks like I’m going to have to dig a bit to find the culprit.
It maybe a blown fuse. if you open the battery compartment and pull out the battery then open the fuse box which is located in front of the air switch. There will be a spare fuse stored in the lid
Can we clarify what an air switch is?
In my 60V there is a circuit breaker in front of the battery visible when the lid is lifted. That was off when the bike arrived. Turn that on and it was all go. The battery was at 30% charged out of the crate.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rodney64 » Apr 08 2018 9:40pm

The circuit breaker is the air switch

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Marksteamnz » Apr 08 2018 10:39pm

Rodney64 wrote:
Apr 08 2018 9:40pm
The circuit breaker is the air switch
Thanks, not heard them called that before. I learnt something, miracles are not over! :-)

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rodney64 » Apr 08 2018 11:43pm

Marksteamnz wrote:
Apr 08 2018 10:39pm
Rodney64 wrote:
Apr 08 2018 9:40pm
The circuit breaker is the air switch
Thanks, not heard them called that before. I learnt something, miracles are not over! :-)
Its called this in the Sur Ron manual

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fechter » Apr 09 2018 12:18am

It's funny since it has nothing to do with air. Something that was lost in the translation, sort of like light bee.
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Hyena » Apr 09 2018 1:18am

I thought the same fechter but I googled it and apparently there is an "air type" circuit breaker, meaning to creates a physical air gap between the contacts when the breaker is open (vs a solid state type?) https://www.elprocus.com/air-circuit-br ... plication/

Still, it's likely a translation of a term not really in use. How are ya'll liking the 32ah lithium ion accumulator ? :P
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