Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
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3DTOPO   1 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Apr 30 2018 5:48pm

First video shot on my Sur-Ron. Hope you enjoy!


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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by artisanstone » Apr 30 2018 6:17pm

That's awesome. Does he ever try to yank you off to the side?

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Apr 30 2018 6:49pm

artisanstone wrote:
Apr 30 2018 6:17pm
That's awesome. Does he ever try to yank you off to the side?
Thank you!!!

Not really. There is one yank evident in the whole video when I am forced to go slower than him going through some deep mud (8:42). But that is coming from straight ahead. I have his leash mounted in the center of the headset. So when he does pull from off center, its the best place for the force to be applied.

He literally grew up doing the same thing only attached to my mountain bike instead of the Sur-Ron. We have rode practically every day of his life so far. Also, depending on what I feel like, sometimes he just runs free. :wink:

That said, I have been pulled off center a few times on my mountain bike. Usually not a problem but I have crashed a couple times on ice. The weight of the Sur-Ron is much harder for him to pull it as the mountain bike (which makes it less forgiving to his harness).

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by artisanstone » Apr 30 2018 7:14pm

It's an awesome video. Good opportunity with both location and companion. In my mind I just immediately saw him seeing a squirrel or something off to the side. Shades of walking a dog by bike in my childhood probably.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Apr 30 2018 7:30pm

artisanstone wrote:
Apr 30 2018 7:14pm
It's an awesome video. Good opportunity with both location and companion. In my mind I just immediately saw him seeing a squirrel or something off to the side. Shades of walking a dog by bike in my childhood probably.
Thanks!

Oh yeah, it has certainly happened on my bike. But he learned whenever the cord gets pulled he can get hurt just as easily as me getting hurt. So whenever he is connected he is aware that he is on-leash and behaves differently than when not on-leash. When he gets scent off to the side, I always see his head watching the side (instead of straight ahead) and he sees me coming full speed behind him in his periphery and decides against trying to run off - usually. :wink:

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3DTOPO   1 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Apr 30 2018 7:38pm

artisanstone wrote:
Apr 30 2018 3:40pm
Can you just modify your spring holder? That's what looks to be rubbing. Seems like you could cut it off shorter and grind a new area for spring to mount. Or possibly a different one would bolt on?
Yeah, like I said that would be the most elegant fix - but also take considerably more time and effort. For instance just getting the spring off by hand proved impossible.

But in literally less than five minutes I got it fixed by adding 3 washers to each of the two bolts. Seems like plenty of meat in the threads still, though I would prefer to get bolts 5mm longer to make up for the washers. Anyone know what size the stock ones are?

Image

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 30 2018 11:43pm

3DTOPO wrote:
Apr 30 2018 5:48pm
First video shot on my Sur-Ron. Hope you enjoy!

[y
Was that road you were riding part of the old willow creek trail access road? Do you ever ride over towards Boiling Springs? Watching your video made me home sick. Thanks for posting it.

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3DTOPO   1 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Apr 30 2018 11:58pm

Rix wrote:
Apr 30 2018 11:43pm
3DTOPO wrote:
Apr 30 2018 5:48pm
First video shot on my Sur-Ron. Hope you enjoy!
Was that road you were riding part of the old willow creek trail access road? Do you ever ride over towards Boiling Springs? Watching your video made me home sick. Thanks for posting it.
Thank you! Hopefully it is a good kind of home sickness. :wink:

I'm not sure where old willow creek trail is, but the place we turned around in the video was at the Left Fork Scriver Creek.

I have been up the middle fork road and been to Boiling Springs but that was in my Subaru Outback. Mostly been exploring more of the local neighborhood so far. But I have only had the Sur-Ron now for less than two weeks so I imagine I'll be headed that way sooner than later.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by liveforphysics » May 01 2018 12:12am

The stock motor and reduction is capable of lots more power than stock, and still doesn't seem to have thermal issues. This bike has incredible hotrod potential.
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by motomoto » May 01 2018 12:46am

The stock motor and reduction is capable of lots more power than stock, and still doesn't seem to have thermal issues. This bike has incredible hotrod potential.
I contacted ASI to see if they can send me a controller. Does the Battery BMS need to be adjusted for more output amps?

By the way, I decided to go to the track today and test out the 58 tooth sprocket and ended up riding with a pretty competent
450 rider. He pulls me out of the turns and down the straights but I made up for it everywhere else. He was impressed. I would be
impressed if didn't get pulled and could spank everyone on that track except a pro. Show us the way Luke.

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liveforphysics   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by liveforphysics » May 01 2018 1:14am

You are going to fly passed them everywhere when it's hacked to full potential.

The BMS shunt resistance stock is 0.31mOhm and its now halfed to 0.155mOhm. That let's it pull double power on the stock pack to feed a big controller.
Each carcinogen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for cancer.

Each mutagen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for reproductive genetic defects in your children.

Each engine start sprays them into a shared atmosphere which includes beings not offered an opportunity to consent accepting these cancer experiences and defective genetics life experiences.

Every post is a free gift to the collective of minds composing the living bleeding edge of LEV development on our spaceship.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by JuiceMeUp » May 01 2018 3:22am

A hard and heavy rock strike today took off one of the foot-pegs.
The mounts that the peg attaches into seem like a specialised part as I can't find one online.
Does anybody know if it can be sourced off-the-shelf? or just get this one repaired.
BrokenPEG.png

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by JuiceMeUp » May 01 2018 3:25am

In the mean time, I was pretty happy to find out that pedals can be screwed in it's place.
I know the Adventure Moto guys pay through the nose for wide, pivoting pegs :)
pedal2.png

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by liveforphysics » May 01 2018 3:29am

Nice fix!
Each carcinogen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for cancer.

Each mutagen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for reproductive genetic defects in your children.

Each engine start sprays them into a shared atmosphere which includes beings not offered an opportunity to consent accepting these cancer experiences and defective genetics life experiences.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by skeetab5780 » May 01 2018 6:47am

Ya i like the look with the bike pedals! Im sure it will break and bend even easier but now you can do it in style!

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » May 01 2018 7:28am

artisanstone wrote:
Apr 30 2018 3:41pm
Also, thank you Rix. Good doing business with you. Received my sprocket super fast and waiting on new chain now.
Glad it arrived so quick. Im sure you will like it better.

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fechter » May 01 2018 8:07am

JuiceMeUp wrote:
May 01 2018 3:25am
In the mean time, I was pretty happy to find out that pedals can be screwed in it's place.
I know the Adventure Moto guys pay through the nose for wide, pivoting pegs :)
Wow, that looks great. Now it has "pedals". Did you use a nut or is the hole threaded?

It looks like the original one could be welded or brazed back together.
"One test is worth a thousand opinions"

beefcake_ground pigeon   1 mW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by beefcake_ground pigeon » May 01 2018 12:42pm

wow what a cool video
amazing dog can run so far and fast so cool to see, smart u can see he knows what's happen and loves it, loved his pool break , would be a different ride for sure XD
looks like ur chasing a rabbit in high speed hehe
also video awesome for showing what the surron is really capable design for quiter long trail riding this bike is amazing and I love these long ride videos that's what I like getting lost in the bush but finding new stuff even better when u have someone to share this with that enjoys it to.
like ur tool bag pack looks like good deflector from mud towards ur batt pack, I have to pull mine after such rides and clean out everywhere mud between batt and casing enclosure and electrical tray motor area catches a bit of debri little work for a lot of fun

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by SlowCo » May 01 2018 1:32pm

3DTOPO wrote:
Apr 30 2018 5:48pm
First video shot on my Sur-Ron. Hope you enjoy!
That looks like a dog assisted electric bike. So your dog is the range extender... :lol:

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by artisanstone » May 01 2018 2:54pm

Rix wrote:
May 01 2018 7:28am
artisanstone wrote:
Apr 30 2018 3:41pm
Also, thank you Rix. Good doing business with you. Received my sprocket super fast and waiting on new chain now.
Glad it arrived so quick. Im sure you will like it better.
Got it put together. Whoah!

Exactly what I wanted it to be. I highly recommend this mod.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by stonezone » May 01 2018 2:56pm

so i've gone through about every mod discussed here except for electronics upgrade. here a few experiences with some recent topics:

the peg/tire clearance - probably just remove the kickstand... once you upgrade the wheels/tires it becomes too short and prone to tipping if you're not careful. This bends the peg bracket and eventually will snap. I've welded mine back together and it's holding but you could probably grind off the end of the spring to increase clearance a bit but just lay the thing over if you cant find something to lean it on, its not going to leak gas or flood...

pedals/pegs - I loved the pedals until i had a few strikes which almost bucked me off and did bend the bracket a little. I like the pivot of using pedals but the loss of the folding up/back action is a deal breaker for me. I was tempted to mill down some pedals to fit the mounts but i would have run into obvious issues with the pin/spring. I ended up getting these from ebay and liked them so much i'm buying more:
https://goo.gl/MYYCLP

I also like these guards:
https://goo.gl/4E3wrL

I am running the 58t and would even go up another 10t if someone wants to make one for me... 38mph is still too fast for the trails, and i'd say that 25-30mph is plenty fast enough.

I've also experimented with the 42t and stock tires, It's actually decent as it tames the power down and allows for more traction when climbing (i miss a clutch) but once you get used to the bike, you'll want to ditch that for a bigger one. I put on and removed the primary chain kit. it's a super slick bolt on, really easy to swap out and damn nice overall. I didn't let the chain/sprocket break in long enough to really make a decision, but it was much louder and I decided to swap back until i needed something stronger than the belt (or i had more issues with the belt not shedding dirt/mud like the chain would).

i'm running a 27.5x3 tire up front on some manitou 27.5 forks, stock sherco trials bars (that i want to swap out with some raga bars, i love that bend), oh yeah and this front fender (i had to shim and trim to not rub the large diameter wheel):
https://goo.gl/ubGkZj

Luke: What would you do if you were in my shoes for the controller upgrade options i have (GM VEC3000 or Lyen 18f)? It sounds like the stock upgrade may not be available.

Aloha!

SZ
LR-BB on 2014 Glory
Sur-Ron
B B S-HD on some sort of DH Kona frame
2017 GG GP 300 <3

RIP Bobarella

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by motomoto » May 01 2018 4:28pm

Luke
The BMS shunt resistance stock is 0.31mOhm and its now halfed to 0.155mOhm. That let's it pull double power on the stock pack to feed a big controller.
I ordered a BAC8000. I will have to change the resistor. A photo would be cool so that I know which one. I can see a CNC mount
for the ASI controller in my future for me and for everyone else.

I also see the possibility of drilling some holes in the motor and pumping in clean cool air with a good air filter and air pump
and pushing out hot gasses making sure nothing gets in the motor with tubing and a one way air valve.

I also see packs made with 180 samsung 25r batteries for racing

Help me there are too many visions !!! :?

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by motomoto » May 01 2018 4:38pm

I will just mention this once because I don't want to start a thread. There are sprockets available finally at www.sur-ronusa.com

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by liveforphysics » May 01 2018 4:44pm

Stock BMS has 16 x 5mOhm surface mount resistors composing the shunt (0.31mOhm combined). We just doubled up each resistor and it's enough to get everything the OEM pack can deliver to a hotrod controller, and still has functional over voltage, under voltage, and over-temp protection. Soldering work looks awful because it's an aluminum PCB and our iron's weren't high enough power.

Image

Image
Each carcinogen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for cancer.

Each mutagen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for reproductive genetic defects in your children.

Each engine start sprays them into a shared atmosphere which includes beings not offered an opportunity to consent accepting these cancer experiences and defective genetics life experiences.

Every post is a free gift to the collective of minds composing the living bleeding edge of LEV development on our spaceship.

artisanstone   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by artisanstone » May 01 2018 8:35pm

motomoto wrote:
May 01 2018 4:28pm
Luke
The BMS shunt resistance stock is 0.31mOhm and its now halfed to 0.155mOhm. That let's it pull double power on the stock pack to feed a big controller.
I ordered a BAC8000. I will have to change the resistor. A photo would be cool so that I know which one. I can see a CNC mount
for the ASI controller in my future for me and for everyone else.

I also see the possibility of drilling some holes in the motor and pumping in clean cool air with a good air filter and air pump
and pushing out hot gasses making sure nothing gets in the motor with tubing and a one way air valve.

I also see packs made with 180 samsung 25r batteries for racing

Help me there are too many visions !!! :?
Can someone point to where I can learn about how BMS, Controller etc. work and what they do? Would help for understanding these conversations as well as understanding my bike. I have looked casually through the battery and motor side of the forum. I didn't see a basic primer, but I may well have missed it.

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