Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
User avatar
johnrobholmes   1.21 GW

1.21 GW
Posts: 3955
Joined: Jul 07 2008 2:19pm
Location: Missouri
Contact:

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by johnrobholmes » Aug 04 2018 2:22pm

I got sick of the first gen air shock needing constant work.


User avatar
3DTOPO   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 361
Joined: Apr 11 2018 2:21am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Aug 04 2018 3:39pm

Rix wrote:
Aug 03 2018 11:26am
Oh YAH! I want the new controller, but I don't really care for the regen option.
I'm kind of surprised to hear that. I think it will be super helpful depending steep grades versus free-wheeling down them. Pretty much anything steep I go down I am riding the breaks, and the regen should alleviate a lot of that (while pumping electrons back into my pack) - and keep the pads from getting spongy so they will work better when needed (not to mention last much longer).

When you want regen off - to coast - just flip it in EP mode.

I'm curious; what don't you like about regen?

User avatar
3DTOPO   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 361
Joined: Apr 11 2018 2:21am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Aug 04 2018 3:41pm

Yester-evening's ride charging up the backyard mountains.


racingame   100 W

100 W
Posts: 114
Joined: Jan 26 2018 9:40am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by racingame » Aug 04 2018 3:42pm

New controller looks great, I'm just disappointed the regen activates when you release the throttle instead of when you use the breaks.
3DTOPO wrote:
Aug 04 2018 3:41pm
Yester-evening's ride charging up the backyard mountains.
Best way I've seen to walk the dog. :lol:

User avatar
3DTOPO   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 361
Joined: Apr 11 2018 2:21am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Aug 04 2018 3:51pm

racingame wrote:
Aug 04 2018 3:42pm
New controller looks great, I'm just disappointed the regen activates when you release the throttle instead of when you use the breaks.
Personally, I think it's perfect. If I'm not giving it juice, usually that means I want to slow it down. Can be flipped off with EP mode when there is the need to coast.
racingame wrote:
Aug 04 2018 3:42pm
3DTOPO wrote:
Aug 04 2018 3:41pm
Yester-evening's ride charging up the backyard mountains.
Best way I've seen to walk the dog. :lol:
Hahaha, thanks! He totally approves of my purchase! :wink:

Joachim   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 434
Joined: Jul 30 2015 1:02pm
Contact:

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Joachim » Aug 04 2018 5:31pm

https://www.braking.nl/default/achtertandwiel-blind-420

420 aluminium 35T up to 70T

how can i make this sur ron bike quiet??? danm this thing make a lot sound :shock:

User avatar
3DTOPO   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 361
Joined: Apr 11 2018 2:21am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Aug 04 2018 5:35pm

Joachim wrote:
Aug 04 2018 5:31pm
https://www.braking.nl/default/achtertandwiel-blind-420

420 aluminium 35T up to 70T

how can i make this sur ron bike quiet??? danm this thing make a lot sound :shock:
Upgrade to the sine-wave controller. Personally, even stock, I think its insanely quiet for a motorbike as capable as it is. I come right up on elk, deer, foxes, etc - almost too quiet.

User avatar
madin88   100 MW

100 MW
Posts: 2998
Joined: May 27 2013 2:02am
Location: Austria

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by madin88 » Aug 05 2018 2:13am

Joachim wrote:
Aug 04 2018 5:31pm
how can i make this sur ron bike quiet??? danm this thing make a lot sound :shock:
Aside from the sine wave controller, the noise on the Surron could be reduced further by using a belt drive on the second reduction stage as well.

Has anybody ever thought about doing so?
- 10kW belt drive with Neumotor 8057: [url]viewtopic.php?
- KTM Hardtail Pedelec / eZee V2 6T / 27,5" / Kelly KBSX @ 1,5kW / Torque PAS / CA-V3 / 13s4p Sanyo GA in Shark case

User avatar
Rix   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 6687
Joined: Mar 29 2012 11:26am
Location: Fallon NV USA

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Aug 05 2018 11:18am

3DTOPO wrote:
Aug 04 2018 3:39pm
Rix wrote:
Aug 03 2018 11:26am
Oh YAH! I want the new controller, but I don't really care for the regen option.
I'm kind of surprised to hear that. I think it will be super helpful depending steep grades versus free-wheeling down them. Pretty much anything steep I go down I am riding the breaks, and the regen should alleviate a lot of that (while pumping electrons back into my pack) - and keep the pads from getting spongy so they will work better when needed (not to mention last much longer).

When you want regen off - to coast - just flip it in EP mode.

I'm curious; what don't you like about regen?
I don't care for regen from the stand point how little the amount of current that is put back into the battery, from Bogus Basin (6000 feet) down to the Hill Road intersection (2600 feet) is about 16 miles or so, and I may put 50 watts back into the battery on my old Stealth Bomber. More importantly though, in mountainous riding conditions where there is a lot of ascending and descending, motors get hot, they also get the chance to cool down with going down hill, however, with regen, the motor tends to stay warm when going down hill and not have a chance to cool.

User avatar
Allex   1 GW

1 GW
Posts: 3217
Joined: Dec 05 2011 8:46am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Allex » Aug 05 2018 12:22pm

The regen activated by brakes or by releasing the the throttle is the most stupid thing.
A rider should decide when to activate it, because in most conditions you actually lose too much momentum and thus, lose even more battery energy.

So I prefer a button for this function.

User avatar
Allex   1 GW

1 GW
Posts: 3217
Joined: Dec 05 2011 8:46am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Allex » Aug 05 2018 12:23pm

madin88 wrote:
Aug 05 2018 2:13am
Joachim wrote:
Aug 04 2018 5:31pm
how can i make this sur ron bike quiet??? danm this thing make a lot sound :shock:
Aside from the sine wave controller, the noise on the Surron could be reduced further by using a belt drive on the second reduction stage as well.

Has anybody ever thought about doing so?
I mentioned this to the factory(does not mean they will do it), we need the belt, especially for the road version.

Check your seats btw =)
Here is the stock GPS tracker on modelX
Attachments
Image-1.jpg
Image-4.jpg

Joachim   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 434
Joined: Jul 30 2015 1:02pm
Contact:

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Joachim » Aug 05 2018 1:40pm

nice 8) i check on the sur ron display max speed 75kmh and the gps shows me 71.2kmh
after the first 125km the chain gets loose....hits the swingarm :twisted:
51km al good and today i ride the bike 2 times long to the total 125km and now the chain hits the swingarm.

The bike needs more power for me(not top speed) the rest perform very wel and is fun to ride :mrgreen:
Image

kitaoka   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 13
Joined: Jul 07 2018 1:36pm

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by kitaoka » Aug 06 2018 1:54am

n2mb wrote:
Aug 03 2018 8:09am
fechter wrote:
Aug 03 2018 7:53am
n2mb wrote:
Aug 02 2018 7:49am
Does anyone know if the serial number on the box matches the one on the head tube of the bike? Should be 15 digits long. I'm trying to see if I can buy the Sur Ron from Luna, but have them hold off on shipping it and send me the serial number. Then I'll try to register it at my DMV following the instructions posted on the Facebook page. Hopefully I'll know for sure if it goes through before having it ship to me...
Thanks!
Can you post a link to that page?
Here's the link:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... ater&ifg=1

In case it doesn't work:
I followed the California moped registration path that we have used for a dozen mopeds from the 1970s.

This is the link to the CA form:
https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/wcm/conne ... OD=AJPERES

Basically, the only main thing you need to justify to yourself is that you will not put your sur-ron into sport mode on the streets because the moped route is limited to 30 mph. If you can agree with this and or disable the switch then you can sign the doc and feel okay.

Second caveat, you should send in a $25 check with your application. The actual listed fee is lower but if you believe in magic, send in the $25 because they pass it along with no issues.

The whole process takes about a month and then you will be plated with a permanent plate. This means that once you register there is nothing else you need to do ever. When you sell the sur-ron just transfer the title like you would any other vehicle.

Last, people can not hear you, riding this on the road is a risk. We have upgraded our head light and are adding break lights. You should really think about doing the same thing.

Attached is the picture of a form with the info.

Good luck and welcome to the fun and exciting world of mopeds!

Image
20180804_163435-Edit-800x600.jpg
20180804_163435-Edit-800x600.jpg (113.32 KiB) Viewed 1847 times
Received my plate in 12 days. Sent in the 21.00 as specified on the CA DMV site for mopeds. I am now able to legally ride on the street and at all CA OHV parks which is huge. Lifetime plate since there are no annual registration fees. Insurance/M1 or M2/Helmet is required. Now I can ride to off road areas I frequent. Just follow what he's posted above. This makes my Sur Ron even more valuable to me than before.
Last edited by kitaoka on Aug 06 2018 2:47am, edited 1 time in total.

Dext3r   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 20
Joined: Jun 05 2018 11:30am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Dext3r » Aug 06 2018 2:27am

Kitaoka, Do you like the pedals?
Are they practical? At what speed?
Ore was it a legal thing?

kitaoka   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 13
Joined: Jul 07 2018 1:36pm

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by kitaoka » Aug 06 2018 2:41am

Dext3r wrote:
Aug 06 2018 2:27am
Kitaoka, Do you like the pedals?
Are they practical? At what speed?
Ore was it a legal thing?
I would NOT have purchased a Sur Ron had it not been for the pedal option. The reason is I like to ride on bike paths in my area and I keep my speed around 15-20 MPH when I ride on them. Just like when I'm on my eMTB. It's just being considerate. So the ability to 'pedal' or make the appearance of pedaling on bike paths makes others not notice me, which is want I wanted. Keep in mind that the reality is the pedals don't do anything. I know there are some who 'want' them to function, but I knew they were only for appearance. I keep a small kit I bought off of Amazon which has a 14mm socket and a crank puller. Once I get to an off road area I simply remove the crank arms/pedals and put the pegs on and have at it. It takes about 90 seconds to do that. Now that I have a valid CA Moped plate I really don't 'need' to be on a bike path to get to my off road access points, but I still like to ride on those paths. They follow a beautiful part of the Bay and are devoid of any car traffic of course. I have my plate so it's easy to remove by two wing nuts when I'm on a bike path too. What I find so great about this bike is it's a chameleon, it can be an 'ebike' an electric dirt bike or a moped for the street.

Everyone here uses the Sur Ron for different reasons and for me it fills so many of my fun activities I can hardly believe it! I've owned and raced motocross and on course liter bikes all of my life and I cannot name a more fun bike I've owned than the Sur Ron.

Here is a link to the kit I mentioned above: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0716 ... UTF8&psc=1
Capture.JPG
Capture.JPG (41.81 KiB) Viewed 1836 times

User avatar
fechter   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 14388
Joined: Dec 31 2006 3:23pm
Location: California Bay Area, USA

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fechter » Aug 06 2018 8:21am

kitaoka wrote:
Aug 06 2018 1:54am

Received my plate in 12 days. Sent in the 21.00 as specified on the CA DMV site for mopeds. I am now able to legally ride on the street and at all CA OHV parks which is huge. Lifetime plate since there are no annual registration fees. Insurance/M1 or M2/Helmet is required. Now I can ride to off road areas I frequent. Just follow what he's posted above. This makes my Sur Ron even more valuable to me than before.
That's awesome! Thanks for posting this. Being able to ride around the neighborhood legally is huge. The speed limit on all the residential streets is 25mph anyway so I would be OK with 30mph.
"One test is worth a thousand opinions"

fasjohnny   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 11
Joined: May 03 2018 6:12am

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fasjohnny » Aug 06 2018 6:05pm

Had some fun today!


User avatar
Rix   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 6687
Joined: Mar 29 2012 11:26am
Location: Fallon NV USA

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Aug 06 2018 7:42pm

fasjohnny wrote:
Aug 06 2018 6:05pm
Had some fun today!

Neat short video BRRAAAPPPP!!!!

User avatar
fechter   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 14388
Joined: Dec 31 2006 3:23pm
Location: California Bay Area, USA

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fechter » Aug 07 2018 8:28am

kitaoka wrote:
Aug 06 2018 1:54am

Received my plate in 12 days. Sent in the 21.00 as specified on the CA DMV site for mopeds. I am now able to legally ride on the street and at all CA OHV parks which is huge. Lifetime plate since there are no annual registration fees. Insurance/M1 or M2/Helmet is required. Now I can ride to off road areas I frequent. Just follow what he's posted above. This makes my Sur Ron even more valuable to me than before.
One more question:

On the form did you just enter the bike's serial number in the line for the VIN? It's a few digits shorter.
"One test is worth a thousand opinions"

User avatar
jph3   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 21
Joined: Mar 27 2018 11:46pm
Location: colorado

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by jph3 » Aug 07 2018 9:56am

I’m selling both of my bikes, I’m in Colorado and would prefer not to ship... send me a PM for more info... $3200 each. Both black, upgraded handlebars, LED light, and brake pads.

User avatar
skyungjae   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 820
Joined: Nov 30 2012 12:57pm
Location: Southern California
Contact:

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by skyungjae » Aug 07 2018 2:35pm

fechter wrote:
Aug 07 2018 8:28am
kitaoka wrote:
Aug 06 2018 1:54am

Received my plate in 12 days. Sent in the 21.00 as specified on the CA DMV site for mopeds. I am now able to legally ride on the street and at all CA OHV parks which is huge. Lifetime plate since there are no annual registration fees. Insurance/M1 or M2/Helmet is required. Now I can ride to off road areas I frequent. Just follow what he's posted above. This makes my Sur Ron even more valuable to me than before.
One more question:

On the form did you just enter the bike's serial number in the line for the VIN? It's a few digits shorter.
I'm also curious what he put down for the motor serial number.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

n2mb   100 W

100 W
Posts: 208
Joined: May 25 2018 1:37pm

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by n2mb » Aug 07 2018 2:41pm

skyungjae wrote:
Aug 07 2018 2:35pm
I'm also curious what he put down for the motor serial number.
It's on the facebook page. He used the second number on the motor. I think the one starting in 2018

Uran93   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 30
Joined: Apr 10 2018 5:26pm

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Uran93 » Aug 07 2018 4:11pm

Joachim wrote:
Aug 05 2018 1:40pm
nice 8) i check on the sur ron display max speed 75kmh and the gps shows me 71.2kmh
after the first 125km the chain gets loose....hits the swingarm :twisted:
51km al good and today i ride the bike 2 times long to the total 125km and now the chain hits the swingarm.

The bike needs more power for me(not top speed) the rest perform very wel and is fun to ride :mrgreen:
Image
Then all you need - just replace your sprocket for 58 or 60 teeth. Then you can drive uphill easly even on EP mode.

Joachim   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 434
Joined: Jul 30 2015 1:02pm
Contact:

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Joachim » Aug 08 2018 1:39am

Uran93 wrote:
Aug 07 2018 4:11pm
Joachim wrote:
Aug 05 2018 1:40pm
nice 8) i check on the sur ron display max speed 75kmh and the gps shows me 71.2kmh
after the first 125km the chain gets loose....hits the swingarm :twisted:
51km al good and today i ride the bike 2 times long to the total 125km and now the chain hits the swingarm.

The bike needs more power for me(not top speed) the rest perform very wel and is fun to ride :mrgreen:
Image
Then all you need - just replace your sprocket for 58 or 60 teeth. Then you can drive uphill easly even on EP mode.
60 teeth topspeed 45kmh is to slow(60kmh is perfect for me),i am not a heavy rider so the bike wil wheelie too fast with the 60th. will try 54 rear sprocket first.

User avatar
Rix   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 6687
Joined: Mar 29 2012 11:26am
Location: Fallon NV USA

Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Aug 08 2018 11:24am

Joachim wrote:
Aug 08 2018 1:39am
[q

Then all you need - just replace your sprocket for 58 or 60 teeth. Then you can drive uphill easly even on EP mode.
60 teeth topspeed 45kmh is to slow(60kmh is perfect for me),i am not a heavy rider so the bike wil wheelie too fast with the 60th. will try 54 rear sprocket first.
[/quote]

Where you getting the 54T from? I have done back to back testing between the 52T and 58T, I concluded that a 54T or maybe even a 55T would yield maximum performance. Even being as heavy as I am, the 58T (maybe because of inductance load) doesn't feel like its pulling max current and isn't much faster off the line, and the 52T is good for 40MPH where as the 58T is good for about 36MPH. The 58T maybe faster by less than a second from 0-15MPH, maybe even 20MPH, but from 20MPH to 36MPH, the 52T is noticeably quicker and doesn't sign off. I really think the only advantage a 58T or 60T would have is if all I did was climb steep stuff, I would have a little more range and less heat. As it stands, I prefer running the 52T way more than the 58T, and I am 245 pounds.

Post Reply