Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Sep 26 2019 5:27am

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 26 2019 5:14am
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 26 2019 5:07am
fechter wrote:
Sep 25 2019 7:59am
Cheburator wrote:
Sep 25 2019 12:05am

Do you mean 3kWh? If yes, the stock Sur-Ron must have 120 km range, which it doesn`t :wink:
Maybe at 15kph bicycle speed.

I'm still trying to figure out if this is for real or a joke. Fiber-grass frame? Like the truck from "Up in Smoke"


Alexander Logie CFO Teznic
Mr. Logie has 30 years of experience in the financial services sector was most recently interim
CFO, acting COO and SVP Business Development at Natura Naturals Inc., a privately held
Licensed Produced of cannabis that was acquired by Tilray Inc. (NASDAQ: TLRY) in February
in a transaction valued at $82 million in cash and stock. Alex was responsible for developing the
financial model for Natura and for managing their $20 million equity and convertible debt
financings. In addition, Alex managed the completion of Natura’s greenhouse retrofit and the
commissioning, growing and harvesting at the facility. Alex has recently joined the team of charlottesweb.com with a market cap of $1.8 billion.
Alex was a Founding Director, Interim CFO and SVP Business Development at San Diego, CA
based Tsunami VR, Inc., a global leader in virtual and augmented reality collaboration software
Mr. Logie has been a long-term consultant to Faryx Energy Inc., working on their wind, solar,
pipeline and agri-business projects in various parts of the USA.
Mr. Logie was Co-Founder and CFO of Crane Capital Group which was acquired by Bear
Stearns Asset Management in 2007. Additionally, Alex was the founder and CEO of Mercury
Capital, a TSE Venture Exchange listed capital pool corporation acquired by Canada Coal, and
he served as CEO of Hong Kong based Baron Asset Management. After graduating from
Queen’s University’s B.Comm. program, Alex spent 12 years as Executive Vice President of
Citibank Canada where he was the head trader in the Global Debt Derivative group.

FiberGrass van.jpg
Last edited by ebikeguy123 on Sep 26 2019 5:55am, edited 3 times in total.

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Sep 26 2019 5:31am

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 26 2019 5:27am
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 26 2019 5:14am
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 26 2019 5:07am
fechter wrote:
Sep 25 2019 7:59am


Maybe at 15kph bicycle speed.

I'm still trying to figure out if this is for real or a joke. Fiber-grass frame? Like the truck from "Up in Smoke"

Yes... lol. It will come in Rastafarian colors. Bob Marley and Chech and Chongs kids will be our spokes persons.

The Hempire strikes back! May the Hemp Bee with you. The Hempocrisy is over.

Yes this is very real . Darren McKeage VP of Design Motive Industries was an automotive design / engineering firm that ran from 2007 to 2013 doing projects for OEM concept cars and smaller start up EV projects. Keage Concepts found its roots at Motive Industries design firm focussing on ideation, styling, 3D surfacing and photorealistic visualization of vehicles and products. Magnovate Technologies, West Coast Customs, Fusion Motorsports and Zero to 60 Designs. Masters with Distinction in Automotive Design from Coventry University in the UK and Bachelor of Design Degree from the Alberta College of Art and Design. designed many notable vehicles from scratch ranging. Some more notable projects include the Hemp bodied Bio-Composite EV Motive Kestrel, a Tesla supercar for Will.i.am, Bison EV Pickup truck and the GTT for Zero to 60 Designs:

Alexander Logie
Mr. Logie has 30 years of experience in the financial services sector was most recently interim
CFO, acting COO and SVP Business Development at Natura Naturals Inc., a privately held
Licensed Produced of cannabis that was acquired by Tilray Inc. (NASDAQ: TLRY) in February
in a transaction valued at $82 million in cash and stock. Alex was responsible for developing the
financial model for Natura and for managing their $20 million equity and convertible debt
financings. In addition, Alex managed the completion of Natura’s greenhouse retrofit and the
commissioning, growing and harvesting at the facility. Alex has recently joined the team of charlottesweb.com with a market cap of $1.8 Billion.
Alex was a Founding Director, Interim CFO and SVP Business Development at San Diego, CA
based Tsunami VR, Inc., a global leader in virtual and augmented reality collaboration software
Mr. Logie has been a long-term consultant to Faryx Energy Inc., working on their wind, solar,
pipeline and agri-business projects in various parts of the USA.
Mr. Logie was Co-Founder and CFO of Crane Capital Group which was acquired by Bear
Stearns Asset Management in 2007. Additionally, Alex was the founder and CEO of Mercury
Capital, a TSE Venture Exchange listed capital pool corporation acquired by Canada Coal, and
he served as CEO of Hong Kong based Baron Asset Management. After graduating from
Queen’s University’s B.Comm. program, Alex spent 12 years as Executive Vice President of
Citibank Canada where he was the head trader in the Global Debt Derivative group.

FiberGrass van.jpg

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Cheburator   100 mW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Cheburator » Sep 26 2019 1:32pm

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
35 min rapid charger.
Awesome feature! What cells are used in this battery?

Lelandjt   100 mW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Lelandjt » Sep 29 2019 9:32pm

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
Webp.net-resizeimage (1).jpgsur-ron-electric-motor.jpgDOPE GTe XXX

Greta Thunberg edition

Hemp your ride!

Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame.. seat etc. Motor moved back the the pivot point to make more room for larger battery. High C 3kWh battery. ASI 8000 with different user modes available on a menu via Android phone used as display. Being designed by www.darrenmckeage.com

Darren was part of designing will.i.am Tesla roadster

35 min rapid charger. 180 Km range. 130 kph top speed. https://hubsink.com/products/sketchbrak ... 7997382536. M820 Saint brakes. Ceramic bearings. Castle lock nuts.

Shipping spring 2020

$6900 USD estimated retail. $250 refundable deposit to order.
This is nothing more than a drawing. The definition of vaporware. It'll be 50 years before they perfect the physics that allow the motor and lower half of the shock and linkage to occupy the same space. Even if the drawing was better thought out no one wants motor weight on their suspension. If the frame had a longer reach for better fit and handling it would make room for a bigger battery. With the right designer and test rider Sur-ron could so easily make a big brother to the Light Bee with better geo, more range, better suspension, tires, and brakes at 120lbs and $5,500.

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Sep 30 2019 8:06pm

Lelandjt wrote:
Sep 29 2019 9:32pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
Webp.net-resizeimage (1).jpgsur-ron-electric-motor.jpgDOPE GTe XXX

Greta Thunberg edition

Hemp your ride!

Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame.. seat etc. Motor moved back the the pivot point to make more room for larger battery. High C 3kWh battery. ASI 8000 with different user modes available on a menu via Android phone used as display. Being designed by www.darrenmckeage.com

Darren was part of designing will.i.am Tesla roadster

35 min rapid charger. 180 Km range. 130 kph top speed. https://hubsink.com/products/sketchbrak ... 7997382536. M820 Saint brakes. Ceramic bearings. Castle lock nuts.

Shipping spring 2020

$6900 USD estimated retail. $250 refundable deposit to order.
This is nothing more than a drawing. The definition of vaporware. It'll be 50 years before they perfect the physics that allow the motor and lower half of the shock and linkage to occupy the same space. Even if the drawing was better thought out no one wants motor weight on their suspension. If the frame had a longer reach for better fit and handling it would make room for a bigger battery. With the right designer and test rider Sur-ron could so easily make a big brother to the Light Bee with better geo, more range, better suspension, tires, and brakes at 120lbs and $5,500.
Attachments
10524198_866704043349115_3358458773660285754_o.jpg
10524198_866704043349115_3358458773660285754_o.jpg (274.03 KiB) Viewed 1961 times
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pasted image 0.png (369.48 KiB) Viewed 1961 times

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Sep 30 2019 8:08pm

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 30 2019 8:06pm
Lelandjt wrote:
Sep 29 2019 9:32pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
Webp.net-resizeimage (1).jpgsur-ron-electric-motor.jpgDOPE GTe XXX

Greta Thunberg edition

Hemp your ride!

Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame.. seat etc. Motor moved back the the pivot point to make more room for larger battery. High C 3kWh battery. ASI 8000 with different user modes available on a menu via Android phone used as display. Being designed by www.darrenmckeage.com

Darren was part of designing will.i.am Tesla roadster

35 min rapid charger. 180 Km range. 130 kph top speed. https://hubsink.com/products/sketchbrak ... 7997382536. M820 Saint brakes. Ceramic bearings. Castle lock nuts.

Shipping spring 2020

$6900 USD estimated retail. $250 refundable deposit to order.
This is nothing more than a drawing. The definition of vaporware. It'll be 50 years before they perfect the physics that allow the motor and lower half of the shock and linkage to occupy the same space. Even if the drawing was better thought out no one wants motor weight on their suspension. If the frame had a longer reach for better fit and handling it would make room for a bigger battery. With the right designer and test rider Sur-ron could so easily make a big brother to the Light Bee with better geo, more range, better suspension, tires, and brakes at 120lbs and $5,500.
Thank you for your feedback and opinion. Yes its just a drawing and has a long way to go. But the pics her now show that 50 years can go by in a blink. lol. it adds no unsprung weight.
Last edited by ebikeguy123 on Sep 30 2019 8:38pm, edited 1 time in total.

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Sep 30 2019 8:16pm

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 30 2019 8:08pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 30 2019 8:06pm
Lelandjt wrote:
Sep 29 2019 9:32pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
Webp.net-resizeimage (1).jpgsur-ron-electric-motor.jpgDOPE GTe XXX

Greta Thunberg edition

Hemp your ride!

Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame.. seat etc. Motor moved back the the pivot point to make more room for larger battery. High C 3kWh battery. ASI 8000 with different user modes available on a menu via Android phone used as display. Being designed by www.darrenmckeage.com

Darren was part of designing will.i.am Tesla roadster

35 min rapid charger. 180 Km range. 130 kph top speed. https://hubsink.com/products/sketchbrak ... 7997382536. M820 Saint brakes. Ceramic bearings. Castle lock nuts.

Shipping spring 2020

$6900 USD estimated retail. $250 refundable deposit to order.
This is nothing more than a drawing. The definition of vaporware. It'll be 50 years before they perfect the physics that allow the motor and lower half of the shock and linkage to occupy the same space. Even if the drawing was better thought out no one wants motor weight on their suspension. If the frame had a longer reach for better fit and handling it would make room for a bigger battery. With the right designer and test rider Sur-ron could so easily make a big brother to the Light Bee with better geo, more range, better suspension, tires, and brakes at 120lbs and $5,500.
Yes its just a drawing and has a long way to go. But the pics her now show that 50 years can go by in a blink. lol. it adds no unsprung weight.


Nathan Armstrong is the lead product development... https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanarmst ... bdomain=ca
nathan and Darren etc seem to have a track record of delivering many many many times.

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Sep 30 2019 8:20pm

Cheburator wrote:
Sep 26 2019 1:32pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
35 min rapid charger.
Awesome feature! What cells are used in this battery?
Thanks. Trying a few but we like https://www.maxwell.com/products/

They were acquired by Tesla

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Offroader   100 MW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Offroader » Oct 01 2019 7:35am

Why are they saying "Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame" are they not going to use the standard sur ron aluminum frame?

Lelandjt   100 mW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Lelandjt » Oct 01 2019 11:23pm

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 30 2019 8:08pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 30 2019 8:06pm
Lelandjt wrote:
Sep 29 2019 9:32pm
ebikeguy123 wrote:
Sep 24 2019 12:14pm
Webp.net-resizeimage (1).jpgsur-ron-electric-motor.jpgDOPE GTe XXX

Greta Thunberg edition

Hemp your ride!

Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame.. seat etc. Motor moved back the the pivot point to make more room for larger battery. High C 3kWh battery. ASI 8000 with different user modes available on a menu via Android phone used as display. Being designed by www.darrenmckeage.com

Darren was part of designing will.i.am Tesla roadster

35 min rapid charger. 180 Km range. 130 kph top speed. https://hubsink.com/products/sketchbrak ... 7997382536. M820 Saint brakes. Ceramic bearings. Castle lock nuts.

Shipping spring 2020

$6900 USD estimated retail. $250 refundable deposit to order.
This is nothing more than a drawing. The definition of vaporware. It'll be 50 years before they perfect the physics that allow the motor and lower half of the shock and linkage to occupy the same space. Even if the drawing was better thought out no one wants motor weight on their suspension. If the frame had a longer reach for better fit and handling it would make room for a bigger battery. With the right designer and test rider Sur-ron could so easily make a big brother to the Light Bee with better geo, more range, better suspension, tires, and brakes at 120lbs and $5,500.
Thank you for your feedback and opinion. Yes its just a drawing and has a long way to go. But the pics her now show that 50 years can go by in a blink. lol. it adds no unsprung weight.
That's because those pictures are an entirely different bike that doesn't have a linkage occupying the same space as a motor, nor a motor mounted on the swingarm.
Edit: Actually those are photos of two different bikes, both different than the digital "photo" I commented on. If you wanna make some money focus on developement and release nothing until your bike is ready to ship. Make it like a Sur-ron except with better geo, suspension, brakes, and front wheel.

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3DTOPO   1 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Oct 02 2019 12:04am

Lelandjt wrote:
Oct 01 2019 11:23pm
Make it like a Sur-ron except with better geo, suspension, brakes, and front wheel.
And to me, most importantly, room for a proper rear tire.

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efMX Trials Electric Freeride   1 MW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Oct 02 2019 12:43am

Lelandjt wrote:
Oct 01 2019 11:23pm

That's because those pictures are an entirely different bike that doesn't have a linkage occupying the same space as a motor, nor a motor mounted on the swingarm.
Edit: Actually those are photos of two different bikes, both different than the digital "photo" I commented on. If you wanna make some money focus on developement and release nothing until your bike is ready to ship. Make it like a Sur-ron except with better geo, suspension, brakes, and front wheel.
the hemp fiber surron design pictured above does have a concentric motor / swingarm pivot .. and the motor is mounted to the mainframe, not the swingarm.. it uses the storm bee motor and gearbox reduction with the output sprocket concentric with the swingarm pivot (look closely;) .. that's why the other two bikes are pictured, for example and comparison..
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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madin88   1 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by madin88 » Oct 02 2019 4:09am

efMX Trials Electric Freeride wrote:
Oct 02 2019 12:43am
the hemp fiber surron design pictured above does have a concentric motor / swingarm pivot .. and the motor is mounted to the mainframe, not the swingarm.. it uses the storm bee motor and gearbox reduction with the output sprocket concentric with the swingarm pivot (look closely;) .. that's why the other two bikes are pictured, for example and comparison..
From what i can see the output sprocket is not in the swingarm pivot (look at the chainline) so the entire drive unit (motor + gearbox) is for sure mounted to the swingarm and not to the mainframe.
But even if it adds a bit to unsprung mass it will not effect supsension that much since the mass is mostly placed around the pivot point where it's inertia is quite low.

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efMX Trials Electric Freeride   1 MW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Oct 02 2019 4:14am

I agree about the chain line, but the motor is definitely mounted to the mainframe and concentric with the pivot, while the reduction extends rearward to the chain line, afaict .. would like to see the swing removed, bit harder to discern some details without seeing the other side etc?? either way the design elements are not outside the realm of possibility.. ok had another closer look myself;) motor is concentric to the pivot, reduction in mounted to swingarm. motor mounted from and at the pivot actually rotates, moves with suspension movement.. so motor weight, mass is located on the frame yet pivots with the suspension.. very interesting:) :flame:
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Oct 03 2019 4:18pm

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efMX Trials Electric Freeride wrote:
Oct 02 2019 4:14am
I agree about the chain line, but the motor is definitely mounted to the mainframe and concentric with the pivot, while the reduction extends rearward to the chain line, afaict .. would like to see the swing removed, bit harder to discern some details without seeing the other side etc?? either way the design elements are not outside the realm of possibility.. ok had another closer look myself;) motor is concentric to the pivot, reduction in mounted to swingarm. motor mounted from and at the pivot actually rotates, moves with suspension movement.. so motor weight, mass is located on the frame yet pivots with the suspension.. very interesting:) :flame:
The final product will look like a combo of the GT Fury carbon and the Sur Ron.
Attachments
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Last edited by ebikeguy123 on Oct 03 2019 4:24pm, edited 2 times in total.

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Oct 03 2019 4:20pm

ebikeguy123 wrote:
Oct 03 2019 4:18pm
Webp.net-compress-image (2).jpg
efMX Trials Electric Freeride wrote:
Oct 02 2019 4:14am
I agree about the chain line, but the motor is definitely mounted to the mainframe and concentric with the pivot, while the reduction extends rearward to the chain line, afaict .. would like to see the swing removed, bit harder to discern some details without seeing the other side etc?? either way the design elements are not outside the realm of possibility.. ok had another closer look myself;) motor is concentric to the pivot, reduction in mounted to swingarm. motor mounted from and at the pivot actually rotates, moves with suspension movement.. so motor weight, mass is located on the frame yet pivots with the suspension.. very interesting:) :flame:
Thank you for your comments. 3D rendering underway with a prototype over the next 60 days

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Oct 03 2019 4:26pm

3DTOPO wrote:
Oct 02 2019 12:04am
Lelandjt wrote:
Oct 01 2019 11:23pm
Make it like a Sur-ron except with better geo, suspension, brakes, and front wheel.
And to me, most importantly, room for a proper rear tire.
Yes. I agree. Will be similar to this.
Attachments
sur_ron-dirt-bike_article.jpg
sur_ron-dirt-bike_article.jpg (105.22 KiB) Viewed 1658 times
sur-ron-light-bee-custom-frame.2jpg.jpg
sur-ron-light-bee-custom-frame.2jpg.jpg (218.42 KiB) Viewed 1658 times

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Oct 03 2019 5:55pm

Offroader wrote:
Oct 01 2019 7:35am
Why are they saying "Carbon fiber like hemp monocoque frame" are they not going to use the standard sur ron aluminum frame?
Hemp is less expensive, lighter and cradle to cradle better fort he environment.

crazy_dave   10 mW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by crazy_dave » Oct 04 2019 12:01pm

My fear would be how to fix something if it broke. If I crack my Sur-Ron frame or swingarm I can fix it.
I have no idea how I would fix hemp. Smoke it and say goodbye? :flame: :)
It’s better to apologize than it is to ask permission.

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Oct 04 2019 1:41pm

:lol: :lol:
crazy_dave wrote:
Oct 04 2019 12:01pm
My fear would be how to fix something if it broke. If I crack my Sur-Ron frame or swingarm I can fix it.
I have no idea how I would fix hemp. Smoke it and say goodbye? :flame: :)

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efMX Trials Electric Freeride   1 MW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Oct 04 2019 3:59pm

since its made from stem fibers and not flowers that would just give you a headache to burn;) don't ask me how I know).. good news is, as a raw material hemp is cheap and with many other possible industrial uses and products beyond frames.. did you know that henry ford used hemp in early production..
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by fechter » Oct 04 2019 4:26pm

A quick search shows hemp is not that great of a fiber for strength. Flax is quite a bit better. Fiberglass is more than 3x stronger.

The BS alarm is going off....
Fiber strengths.JPG
Fiber strengths.JPG (41.88 KiB) Viewed 1527 times
"One test is worth a thousand opinions"

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3DTOPO   1 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by 3DTOPO » Oct 04 2019 4:37pm

fechter wrote:
Oct 04 2019 4:26pm
A quick search shows hemp is not that great of a fiber for strength. Flax is quite a bit better. Fiberglass is more than 3x stronger.
And CF at 4127 MPa is about 4.5x stronger using the most optimistic hemp MPa on your chart, and it's 7.5x using the lower value. The hemp angle seems more like a marketing gimmick than anything.

ebikeguy123   10 W

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by ebikeguy123 » Oct 05 2019 8:27am

3DTOPO wrote:
Oct 04 2019 4:37pm
fechter wrote:
Oct 04 2019 4:26pm
A quick search shows hemp is not that great of a fiber for strength. Flax is quite a bit better. Fiberglass is more than 3x stronger.
And CF at 4127 MPa is about 4.5x stronger using the most optimistic hemp MPa on your chart, and it's 7.5x using the lower value. The hemp angle seems more like a marketing gimmick than anything.
Moving the motor back to make more room for battery for more power and greater range is the goal... hemp is to reduce price and cradle to cradle better for environment. Carbon credits and many other incentives greatly reduce the final price. The magic is in the weave and resins as well as some metal in headtube as well as pivot point. stronger material to take the high-load points.

2 be.e or not 2 bee's.. thats the question

Already exists.. hemp Be.e electric scooter

we take the bullshit and use it as fertilizer to grow the hemp.

www.vaneko.com
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Grantmac   10 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Grantmac » Oct 05 2019 11:02am

It appears that you are getting the required strength by adding bulk (legitimate strategy), do you think that will work with the much more contact chassis required on a dirt bike? That scooter is anything but svelte.

Personally I like composites, they are easier to repair than aluminum provided you are willing to add a little weight and the resins are compatible.

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