Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 21 2018 6:32am

I cant wait to see videos of you clowns pedalling this moto :lol:

Please post vids asap :P

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by RemoteRoad » Feb 21 2018 6:52am

Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 21 2018 6:32am
I cant wait to see videos of you clowns pedalling this moto :lol:

Please post vids asap :P
Makes it more widely usable. :-). Can always swap pedals for pegs. I'd love some kind of kit that would allow for peddling a generator (not mounted to swingarm) to pump power back into the battery. That or retrofitting that same sort of gearing system that the Stealth Bomber's use.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 21 2018 7:12am

RemoteRoad wrote:
Feb 21 2018 6:52am
Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 21 2018 6:32am
I cant wait to see videos of you clowns pedalling this moto :lol:

Please post vids asap :P
Makes it more widely usable. :-). Can always swap pedals for pegs. I'd love some kind of kit that would allow for peddling a generator (not mounted to swingarm) to pump power back into the battery. That or retrofitting that same sort of gearing system that the Stealth Bomber's use.
Its a motorbike with some novelty pedals attached in an awkward location!
Cant wait to hear/see how usable they arent! :lol:

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Rix » Feb 21 2018 8:17am

Hyena wrote:
Jan 02 2018 8:29pm
Further more, I shot this video a few days ago :mrgreen:

I cant wait to see videos of you clowns pedalling this moto :lol:

Please post vids asap :P
Makes it more widely usable. :-). Can always swap pedals for pegs. I'd love some kind of kit that would allow for peddling a generator (not mounted to swingarm) to pump power back into the battery. That or retrofitting that same sort of gearing system that the Stealth Bomber's use.
These machine can be pedaled no problems, just check out this video by Hyena.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by motomoto » Feb 21 2018 8:19am

I rode the bike around with pedals. Clown pedals describes them perfectly. It's the most stupid awkward thing I have ever
experienced. But there are clowns out there that want to play that game. I know....laws.

It's not a bicycle it's a small electric motorcycle. I ride it like a bicycle around town when I am around cars. I rode to my parents
house where there is a long stretch of 10 miles which I road at 44 mph wide open. The entire trip was 18 miles total. Used half
the pack.

I can't wait to finish getting it street legal with a plate. I have a motorcycle license which is not hard to get.

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efMX Trials Electric Freeride   100 kW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Feb 21 2018 11:40am

Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 21 2018 5:24am
Another mod that will need to be done is a better shroud for the primary gear on the reduction shaft.

After one day at a mx track i found the belt begin to get noisy, and after a thorough clean i noticed this wear on the gear.

I would recommend anyone contemplating a secondary belt drive to steer clear of coarse dirt/sand or enclose the drive completely.
looks like another good reason to convert the primary drive from belt to chain.. more durable and easier serviceability.. wear on parts from one ride in adverse conditions doesn't bode well for long term maintenance free riding off road with the stock belt primary drive..
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Feb 21 2018 11:54am

Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 21 2018 6:32am
I cant wait to see videos of you clowns pedalling this moto :lol:

Please post vids asap :P
I don't think people intend to actually pedal the bike (after all it has ~8hp on tap).. the pedals are so that you CAN pedal the bike if you HAVE TO (such as a belt failure;) or low battery.. or through town.. I agree the stock pedal kit and location is crap.. bomber has pedals and no-one seems to think that's goofy.. many state laws require mopeds to have pedals, but no one actually uses them (much)..

edit : here is another compelling reason of why some may want to have a pedal option on this "dirt bike.. :

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 1#p1266451
some ride & sk8 videos:
metacafe.com/channels/NATAS666DAMIEN
http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 21 2018 6:26pm

I understand the idea of wanting pedals, but was never intended to be an e-bike it was always an e-moto.

The pedal kit is a slap on afterthought,and will be hilarious to see a full size american pedal this thing. I doubt anyone will be comfortable trying to ride it like a bicycle.
Have you seen the video of the 5foot asian guy struggle to ride it? He looks like a clown!

The bomber is an e-bike and has pedals located where they should be, and you use them because they are conveniently placed.
Once travelling over 20kph the pedals are a nuisance but it also feels weird having one foot forward of the other so i pedal anyway!

Having owned and ridden the bikes for months now i know everyone will love the bike, i just dont think the pedal kit is attractive or useful.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by DanGT86 » Feb 21 2018 8:48pm

Sorry if I missed the answer but does the pedal kit come with parts to re-gear the primary drive or does it really just reduce the rear sprocket size without correcting for it elsewhere?

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by AMM118 » Feb 21 2018 9:55pm


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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Rix » Feb 21 2018 10:31pm

AMM118 wrote:
Feb 21 2018 9:55pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uD6FLyB_BU

Fender on this one
A green one just like the one I got coming.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Rix » Feb 21 2018 10:33pm

DanGT86 wrote:
Feb 21 2018 8:48pm
Sorry if I missed the answer but does the pedal kit come with parts to re-gear the primary drive or does it really just reduce the rear sprocket size without correcting for it elsewhere?
One of the conversion vids I saw changed out the rear sprocket from a 48T to a 25T. Yah, the top speed would be over 60MPH if the rider had a down hill run with a tail wind. But the pedal conversion went the wrong way.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by DanGT86 » Feb 21 2018 10:43pm

That must be the one I saw too. Makes no sense if the pedals are only there as a legality because the bike performance will suffer and the compliance speed limiter is going to be wrong with the tiny sprocket. I figured I accidentally fast forwarded through the jackshaft re-gearing.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by JuiceMeUp » Feb 22 2018 12:42am

Hi Guys - Personal thoughts on the belt conversion ideas being tossed around... Ummm...WHY?

From an engineering perspective, its more complicated and less reliable; with the benefit being a few D.B of noise reduction (not enough to warrant). I mean, there's a good reason Zero offered their FX with an off-road modification of a chain drive.

I believe there are more value added mods to look at first (see prior comments). My only caveat being that it is for on-road use only if considering belt drive. And if it is for on-road only, a Stealth / Alpha / Beta style Hubby would be a lot more appropriate.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by RemoteRoad » Feb 22 2018 1:32am

Rix wrote:
Feb 21 2018 10:33pm
DanGT86 wrote:
Feb 21 2018 8:48pm
Sorry if I missed the answer but does the pedal kit come with parts to re-gear the primary drive or does it really just reduce the rear sprocket size without correcting for it elsewhere?
One of the conversion vids I saw changed out the rear sprocket from a 48T to a 25T. Yah, the top speed would be over 60MPH if the rider had a down hill run with a tail wind. But the pedal conversion went the wrong way.
Luna's retaining the stock rear sprocket, not swapping in the tiny one.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by macribs » Feb 22 2018 3:14pm

Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 21 2018 6:26pm
I understand the idea of wanting pedals, but was never intended to be an e-bike it was always an e-moto.

The pedal kit is a slap on afterthought,and will be hilarious to see a full size american pedal this thing. I doubt anyone will be comfortable trying to ride it like a bicycle.
Have you seen the video of the 5foot asian guy struggle to ride it? He looks like a clown!
Even as an e-moto one would expect Sur Ron to keep up the great work that they have done from the ground up. I mean even if I was not a Sur Ron fan in start due to bad communication with them via email, I got turned around by seing people post pics, ride reports and videos. The Sur Ron is fantastic and so is the price.

However what they did with the pedals was left hand work at the best. Its like they didn't even take 5 minutes to think things through, they just threw some ideas together probably while getting drunk and the next day they executed those ideas as quick as possible and presented Sur Ron pedalac. Sur Ron din not even noticing that by adding the pedal kit they actually ruined the whole idea of bike being a light weight mid drive in the process. If anything, they should have put an even bigger rear sprocket on rather the the smaller one.

In fact they should have left the drive train alone, and shouldn't have done any changes to it at all. They should rather find a way to make pedal works without ruining the bike. Maybe left side pedals. Or taken the motoped approach and done an additional jackshaft sprocket for crank chain with crank freewheel, having just one chain from jacshaft to rear wheel. Pedals could be mounted with a bb attached way forward with so short crank arms that the pedals would not interfere with the foot pegs.

Now actually riding by pedals might be uncomfy, might not be possible to do for a long stretch at time, might look sad stupid and some people would despite such a bike. Then there would be others that would happily swipe their credit card to get an the e-moto (w/pedals) of 2018 that legally could be ridden in town, up and down city streets, in single tracks in state parks, ridden where mtb and dh riders go, or even explore the outdoor riding along foot paths and hike trails without risking to get the bike impounded. That would be a clever way of slapping on pedals. That would leave the Sur Ron intact handling and running as it was designed to from the start.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Allex » Feb 22 2018 3:27pm

First ride today. I like this bike a lot, thing is a torque monster, any hill I throw it just eat it without hesitation, where my hubbie would overheat in 30 seconds.
Nice with a headlight, overall this is a great bike out of the box. I got another bike setup with RST front fork. Now lets see how it handles...
Overall, It's a BUY!
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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 22 2018 7:36pm

macribs wrote:
Feb 22 2018 3:14pm
Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 21 2018 6:26pm
I understand the idea of wanting pedals, but was never intended to be an e-bike it was always an e-moto.

The pedal kit is a slap on afterthought,and will be hilarious to see a full size american pedal this thing. I doubt anyone will be comfortable trying to ride it like a bicycle.
Have you seen the video of the 5foot asian guy struggle to ride it? He looks like a clown!
Even as an e-moto one would expect Sur Ron to keep up the great work that they have done from the ground up. I mean even if I was not a Sur Ron fan in start due to bad communication with them via email, I got turned around by seing people post pics, ride reports and videos. The Sur Ron is fantastic and so is the price.

However what they did with the pedals was left hand work at the best. Its like they didn't even take 5 minutes to think things through, they just threw some ideas together probably while getting drunk and the next day they executed those ideas as quick as possible and presented Sur Ron pedalac. Sur Ron din not even noticing that by adding the pedal kit they actually ruined the whole idea of bike being a light weight mid drive in the process. If anything, they should have put an even bigger rear sprocket on rather the the smaller one.

In fact they should have left the drive train alone, and shouldn't have done any changes to it at all. They should rather find a way to make pedal works without ruining the bike. Maybe left side pedals. Or taken the motoped approach and done an additional jackshaft sprocket for crank chain with crank freewheel, having just one chain from jacshaft to rear wheel. Pedals could be mounted with a bb attached way forward with so short crank arms that the pedals would not interfere with the foot pegs.

Now actually riding by pedals might be uncomfy, might not be possible to do for a long stretch at time, might look sad stupid and some people would despite such a bike. Then there would be others that would happily swipe their credit card to get an the e-moto (w/pedals) of 2018 that legally could be ridden in town, up and down city streets, in single tracks in state parks, ridden where mtb and dh riders go, or even explore the outdoor riding along foot paths and hike trails without risking to get the bike impounded. That would be a clever way of slapping on pedals. That would leave the Sur Ron intact handling and running as it was designed to from the start.
Has anyone considered the possibly that Sur-ron just wants to produce e-moto and not e-bikes!
Has anyone considered the fact that these bikes are built in the hub of worldwide e-bike manufacturing.
Has anyone asked Elon Musk to do a petrol model Tesla?

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by RemoteRoad » Feb 22 2018 8:05pm

Now Aebrennan, you really do know the answer here.

The fact is the Sur-Ron isn't fundamentally different from other higher capacity e-bikes. It's not so different from a Stealth Bomber, or Raptor, etc...

Battery, motor, controller, bike components.

And it is offering a value that MAJORLY exceeds these other offerings or what can be built (by most at least) in component form on this value front.

So of course its going to be looked at and modified in a variety of ways to take advantage of this major value advantage.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 22 2018 8:27pm

RemoteRoad wrote:
Feb 22 2018 8:05pm
Now Aebrennan, you really do know the answer here.

The fact is the Sur-Ron isn't fundamentally different from other higher capacity e-bikes. It's not so different from a Stealth Bomber, or Raptor, etc...

Battery, motor, controller, bike components.

And it is offering a value that MAJORLY exceeds these other offerings or what can be built (by most at least) in component form on this value front.

So of course its going to be looked at and modified in a variety of ways to take advantage of this major value advantage.
They are totally different.
They are motorbikes not bicycles.
They are designed by engineers that want to produce modern motorcycles.
I want them to build physically bigger and more powerful off road and road motorbikes, not go backwards and get into the overpowered bicycle market. I think their effort at a pedal kit should serve as a clear message. DILLIGAF

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Rix » Feb 23 2018 12:23am

Has anyone considered the possibly that Sur-ron just wants to produce e-moto and not e-bikes!
Has anyone considered the fact that these bikes are built in the hub of worldwide e-bike manufacturing.
Has anyone asked Elon Musk to do a petrol model Tesla?
Has anyone considered the possibly that Sur-ron just wants to produce e-moto and not e-bikes! A: It very briefly crossed my mind, but I concluded "yes" as the answer.

Has anyone considered the fact that these bikes are built in the hub of worldwide e-bike manufacturing. A: Yes, I concluded this as well.

Has anyone asked Elon Musk to do a petrol model A: Tesla? No not likely.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Rix » Feb 23 2018 12:27am

Allex wrote:
Feb 22 2018 3:27pm
First ride today. I like this bike a lot, thing is a torque monster, any hill I throw it just eat it without hesitation, where my hubbie would overheat in 30 seconds.
Nice with a headlight, overall this is a great bike out of the box. I got another bike setup with RST front fork. Now lets see how it handles...
Overall, It's a BUY!
As if Hyena' s findings weren't solid enough, now we got your opinion/findings as well. These machines must be great. Thanks for the quick review.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by competitions » Feb 23 2018 1:30am

Rix wrote:
Feb 23 2018 12:23am
Has anyone considered the possibly that Sur-ron just wants to produce e-moto and not e-bikes! A: It very briefly crossed my mind, but I concluded "yes" as the answer.
Has anyone considered the fact that these bikes are built in the hub of worldwide e-bike manufacturing. A: Yes, I concluded this as well.
Seems everyone agrees the sur-ron is a great offering specification and price wise - nothing seems to come close, so given people are asking about an e-bike, maybe the question should be:
Has anyone considered how many units sur-ron would sell if they did make an e-bike with similar specs and pricing to their existing offering?
A: it would kill all competitors such as qulbix, stealth etc.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by LeftieBiker » Feb 23 2018 1:35am

Does the pedal kit already have the potential to work just as a fake pedal setup? I assume it has a freewheel mechanism to let the bike move faster than you can pedal, so can the freewheel be disconnected from the rest of the kit, leaving pedals that turn without doing anything else? Better still would be a freewheel that can be engaged or disengaged at will (although not necessarily while riding) so you can stand on the pedals to ride (or on folding or quick-remove footpegs) and then pedal the bike if it's disabled...

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike from China

Post by Rix » Feb 23 2018 8:03am

LeftieBiker wrote:
Feb 23 2018 1:35am
Does the pedal kit already have the potential to work just as a fake pedal setup? I assume it has a freewheel mechanism to let the bike move faster than you can pedal, so can the freewheel be disconnected from the rest of the kit, leaving pedals that turn without doing anything else? Better still would be a freewheel that can be engaged or disengaged at will (although not necessarily while riding) so you can stand on the pedals to ride (or on folding or quick-remove footpegs) and then pedal the bike if it's disabled...
The problem I see with the pedal kit is not so much its functionality, but where they are placed. Too far back, its a band aid fix for the people that want or need to pedals. Imagine riding a dirt bike with passenger pegs. It would be like riding with one foot on the passenger foot peg.

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