Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

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Aebrennan
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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 01, 2018 4:30 pm

I have 10 vids on YouTube under A e-bikes
Have over 500kms of testing completed
Never hear a “loud cry“only chain noise.

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skeetab5780
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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by skeetab5780 » Feb 01, 2018 6:16 pm

Aebrennan wrote:
Feb 01, 2018 4:30 pm
I have 10 vids on YouTube under A e-bikes
Have over 500kms of testing completed
Never hear a “loud cry“only chain noise.
500kms of downhill? Link to a vid of a actual hill climb please?

Just because you rode 500kms now that means it can climb hills good??

Every video of the sur ron sounds very loud and whiny, that again is my opinion based off youtube video sound.

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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by Aebrennan » Feb 01, 2018 8:20 pm

The thread is about your build not the Sur-ron.
My videos are linked on the appropriate threads and YouTube as mentioned.
My comment was regarding your “opinions” based on videos, but no links to the mentioned videos.
Thanks for your opinions.

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skeetab5780
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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by skeetab5780 » Feb 02, 2018 5:11 pm

Well either way ive watched your vids and the bike looks like lots of fun. I just call it like i see it

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Re: Kuberg Freerider Project

Post by skeetab5780 » Feb 07, 2018 1:06 pm

jonnydrive wrote:
Jan 18, 2018 11:13 am
Is not my idea :-) I read it somewhere in Cyclone 3k mega-thread.
For combination Kelly Controller + Cyclone, it is suggested to use 12volt for power the hall sensors instead of a traditional 5v.

Revolt use SS411/41F that from datasheet support this power: 5V/9V/ 12V/15V/18V/24V.

My bet: more voltage in hall sensors is equivalent to a widest signal range, maybe it can overhang the white noise, parassite currents, etc....
In fact, my controller faults only when high amperage is required, that match with a stronger magnetic field generated by the engine. Can be this interference the cause of fault in the sensors? I am no sure.

It can worth a try....as soon I can get my hands on my motorcycle I will do it.

I'm going to keep you updated.
Does anyone know if the ground on the hall sensors has to be common with the controller battery input ground? Or can you run your hall sensors off a 9volt battery completely separate and be fine with the signal they output?

Thanks in advance, still pondering this 12v to halls things

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madin88
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Re: Kuberg Freerider Project

Post by madin88 » Feb 07, 2018 5:23 pm

skeetab5780 wrote:
Feb 07, 2018 1:06 pm

Does anyone know if the ground on the hall sensors has to be common with the controller battery input ground? Or can you run your hall sensors off a 9volt battery completely separate and be fine with the signal they output?

Thanks in advance, still pondering this 12v to halls things
Each signal needs a reference, so you must connect the ground. I am not sure if the ground from the hall wires is same as battery -, but i believe so (if your multimeter beeps than it is same).

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Re: Kuberg Freerider Project

Post by skeetab5780 » Feb 08, 2018 11:39 am

madin88 wrote:
Feb 07, 2018 5:23 pm
skeetab5780 wrote:
Feb 07, 2018 1:06 pm

Does anyone know if the ground on the hall sensors has to be common with the controller battery input ground? Or can you run your hall sensors off a 9volt battery completely separate and be fine with the signal they output?

Thanks in advance, still pondering this 12v to halls things
Each signal needs a reference, so you must connect the ground. I am not sure if the ground from the hall wires is same as battery -, but i believe so (if your multimeter beeps than it is same).
Yes they have continuity unfortunately, just tested batt ground to hall ground

so I will have to attempt running it off the 12vdc output from the controller. I wanted to try and run it off a small separate battery pack at like 8 or 9v but not going to happen.

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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by Drum » Feb 08, 2018 2:31 pm

Hi Skeet,
If there is continuity between battery negative and hall sensor negative, that is good.. connect the negative of the 9V battery to either the battery negative or the hall negative, and the +9V of the battery to the hall sensor supply Positive. (You will have to disconnect the hall sensor + from the controller before connecting the battery +.)

I don't know the max voltage your hall sensors are rated to, but if it is higher than 9V they should be ok.

I also do not know what the effect of the raised voltage of the hall signal will be on the controller, but I doubt 9V will fry anything..

There has been a bit of evidence scattered around a few different threads on ES that faulty or missing signals from hall sensors are known to occur, and some problems have been solved by relocating hall sensors, replacing with new ones or changing to a different type.

If you know anyone with an oscilloscope (preferably with 3 or more channels) and you can rotate the motor at a steady speed (using a big, slow drill or lathe etc) you could apply + and - power to the halls and connect the oscilloscope to the hall outputs and see whether:
- the output voltages are regular or variable;
- the switching occurs quickly (steep leading edge to the signal on the screen) every time; and
- the spacing between the hall output signals is regular (wave forms spaced evenly across the screen).

Any irregularity would indicate poor performance of the hall sensors.. the wave forms must be even height, regularly spaced and fast switching every time. Missing or irregular signals would make it very hard for the controller to do its job well.

You could test at 5V and at 9V and see if there is any difference (other than the output voltage of course).

There are others here on ES with a lot more knowledge and experience than me who might like to comment here...

I believe that accumulating more knowledge about Hall sensor performance, testing methods, problems and solutions would be useful. Maybe a thread dedicated to Hall sensors would be good. (Thinks to self.. maybe I should have looked in other sections of ES.. there may already be a thread somewhere??)

Definitely interested to see what you come up with. Good luck.

Dave

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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by jonnydrive » Feb 09, 2018 2:35 am

Hi guys,
I contacted Kelly (Fany) for other problems with the controller, but..the interesting thinks is what I am quoting:

"We need to use pin11 (12v) to power hall sensors of Cyclone motor instead of pin5 (5v)."
and
"As of KBS-X controller,it is better to use pin11 to power hall sensors of Cyclone motor."

Sincerely I do not know if it is worth also for other troubled hall sensor engine.

I made a lot of tries with home-made oscilloscope try to understand if the halls are good, but when you put a lot of kw in the engine thinks is quite different compared to a work bench testing.

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Re: Kuberg Freerider Extended Swingarm Project

Post by skeetab5780 » Feb 09, 2018 7:45 am

Thats wierd they are saying to use 12v pin out on both kbs and kls series...my motor only has this issue with the kls.

Makes me wonder if its the same issue...afterall im not using a cyclone motor. Im still going to have to try it. Im just going to be mad if i ruin my halls on my fav motor

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