GNG / CYC X1 Pro 3000w

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Andrewol   10 W

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Andrewol » Jan 16 2019 12:56pm

Another reason of the similar torque values of X1 and BBSHD could be that BBSHD torque is not correct. I think 160 N-M for 1KW motor is overestimated for sure. In other words, it's 64kg of downforce on a 30.5cm lever. X1 should be more than twice powerfull against the stock BBSHD in side-by-side comparison with the same PSU.

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izeman   10 GW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by izeman » Jan 16 2019 1:13pm

crossbreak wrote:
Jan 16 2019 11:31am
Merlin finally got his LMX 161 in December, i met him yesterday and we plan to meet again for a ride as soon as my X1 bike with dual chain setup is done
Damn. I wish i lived somewhere near to you, i would have liked to join you.
I am in contact with Adam about buying on of his LMX64 and i will install a Sempu T4 in my Kona mid drive. I'm really excited to see true torque control of my bike. Good thing is, that because of your "invention" of the MAC conversion i can adjust the gearing to my likings, so i can pedal along even at very high speed. I may need to remove FOC again, as my bike revs up REALLY high now ;)

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by crossbreak » Jan 16 2019 4:59pm

yep, this is really the best thing of the "crossbreak" style jackshaft :? still hassling how i do it on this one...a hammerschmidt is quite heavy, but with the right torque sensing BB and a lathe i think hammerschmidt and ISIS torque sensing BB could be married. But that comes last, first i need to get this to work and second i need to build a new battery, 20s is a must for this drive

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izeman   10 GW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by izeman » Jan 17 2019 3:07am

crossbreak wrote:
Jan 16 2019 4:59pm
yep, this is really the best thing of the "crossbreak" style jackshaft :? still hassling how i do it on this one...a hammerschmidt is quite heavy, but with the right torque sensing BB and a lathe i think hammerschmidt and ISIS torque sensing BB could be married. But that comes last, first i need to get this to work and second i need to build a new battery, 20s is a must for this drive
If you don't have access to a lathe let me know. I can help out!

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by crossbreak » Jan 17 2019 3:39am

all fine, i've got one in the basement, a small one but for aluminium it is ok. for steel i can use the two bigger ones at work

DarrenSD   1 µW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by DarrenSD » Jan 19 2019 11:23am

Very interested to hear if anyone has either received a X-1 Pro unit or been notified they shipped yet? The 2 systems looks great, the option of the chain model like a tangent ascent ( $2800 ) Or the compact direct drive like the Paradox Kinetics ( $3000 ) cover most applications I can see.
Please post photos of parts, connectors etc. when received. Thanks
Turner DHR, BBSHD, 48V

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by crossbreak » Jan 22 2019 5:29am

finally got a tracking ID for the pre-production X1 pro, it was shipped today but w/o motor controller which is not ready yet. When it arrives we can at least have a look at the drive unit, measure motor constants and most important for me, since I want to replace the sprocket: Measure shaft dimensions.

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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by neptronix » Jan 22 2019 10:59am

crossbreak wrote:
Jan 22 2019 5:29am
finally got a tracking ID for the pre-production X1 pro, it was shipped today but w/o motor controller which is not ready yet. When it arrives we can at least have a look at the drive unit, measure motor constants and most important for me, since I want to replace the sprocket: Measure shaft dimensions.
Thanks for the update, and glad to hear that they finally shipped something.
I was starting to think i accidentally helped rope some people into some kind of scheme... the last thing i'd like associated with my position as a keeper of the sphere. :oops:

Looking forward to seeing what you find out.
Efficiency is everything :bolt:

My first major build: 1.6kW 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w @ 4kW on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The monster scooter: 20" eZee on a Cannondale Semi Recumbent.
Whipper-snapper: ? on a lightweight BikeE Semi Recumbent


Grantmac   10 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Grantmac » Jan 22 2019 1:33pm

I wonder if the controller mount on the bottom adds significant torsional rigidity? It seems like it would.

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by ScooterMan101 » Jan 23 2019 2:48am

Crossbreak,

Those side plates look to be very short. That would work for a bike with a straight down tube like a Hard Tail bike , However , most every Full Suspension Bike these days have a down tube that has a
" dog leg " curve to it down near the Bottom Bracket.

Riding on a bike that has a 3k motor means that a Good Full Suspension Bike is very much Advisable .
So
That motor is going to hang low when installed on most every F.S. MTB . ( which means not much clearance when riding on trails ).

It looks like one more thing for you to design and make and sell is a set of longer side plates , even angled up some to conform to the typical " dog leg " down tube on most all of our F.S. MTB's .
My first conversion ... Sold

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=71378&p=1077497&hil ... 1#p1077497

It's 2018 already, ( now 2019 ) lets get some real , improved e-bike / e-velomobile / e-motorcycle designs .

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by crossbreak » Jan 23 2019 3:27am

sorry but with longer plates the gears wont even touch each other anymore. this is simply not possible, you agree? if you have problems fitting the gear version please stick to the chain version
Anyway, my frame has a dog leg, we will see how it fits, i dont think it will look too bad. With a straight Downtube the motor is a good bit higher from the ground than the bottom bracket

Image

Grantmac wrote:
Jan 22 2019 1:33pm
I wonder if the controller mount on the bottom adds significant torsional rigidity? It seems like it would.
definitely! You'll have to put something in there, i think i'll insert an 8mm aluminum sheet or something like this, bolted to the controller screw holes.

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Lenk42602   10 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Lenk42602 » Jan 26 2019 6:43pm

new video up on their site. Looking pretty sweet. the video indicates that the handlebar display shown will not be the display used on the units that ship with 36-72v controllers (which I assume all the early orders are shipping with). Sent an inquiry to Jon regarding this.
Very cool indeed.

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by crossbreak » Jan 27 2019 1:24pm

there is no new video on their site, but one on failbook
https://www.facebook.com/CYCMOTORLTD/vi ... 530448065/

unfortunately my motor is on hold at the customs and the authorities want me to personally pick it up :cry:

Andrewol   10 W

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Andrewol » Jan 29 2019 7:33pm

they want you personally to declare the value and pay a tax for imported goods. You should say it's a sample or gift to avoid it if motor comes with the same supporting documents :)
Waiting for your first impressions btw.

Fastwanabe   100 mW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Fastwanabe » Jan 30 2019 5:52pm

After looking at these videos I noticed Im just spoiled with how quiet the bafangs are.

SlowCo   100 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by SlowCo » Jan 31 2019 8:05am

Fastwanabe wrote:
Jan 30 2019 5:52pm
After looking at these videos I noticed Im just spoiled with how quiet the bafangs are.
I bet that if you use this X1-pro at just 1000W or less like the BBSHD/02 deliver, it will not be much louder... :wink:

n2mb   100 W

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by n2mb » Jan 31 2019 9:11am

SlowCo wrote:
Jan 31 2019 8:05am
Fastwanabe wrote:
Jan 30 2019 5:52pm
After looking at these videos I noticed Im just spoiled with how quiet the bafangs are.
I bet that if you use this X1-pro at just 1000W or less like the BBSHD/02 deliver, it will not be much louder... :wink:
I think the X1 motor spins much faster than the BBSHD motor, which is likely why it is noisier. Similar to the tangent motor. But, that is also why it can deliver twice as much power and still be 2 lbs lighter than the BBSHD.

SlowCo   100 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by SlowCo » Jan 31 2019 9:53am

n2mb wrote:
Jan 31 2019 9:11am
I think the X1 motor spins much faster than the BBSHD motor, which is likely why it is noisier. Similar to the tangent motor. But, that is also why it can deliver twice as much power and still be 2 lbs lighter than the BBSHD.
Three times as the BBSHD is rated at 1000W vs the X1-pro at 3000W.

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by n2mb » Jan 31 2019 9:56am

SlowCo wrote:
Jan 31 2019 9:53am
n2mb wrote:
Jan 31 2019 9:11am
I think the X1 motor spins much faster than the BBSHD motor, which is likely why it is noisier. Similar to the tangent motor. But, that is also why it can deliver twice as much power and still be 2 lbs lighter than the BBSHD.
Three times as the BBSHD is rated at 1000W vs the X1-pro at 3000W.
True, although most people are running them at 30A, 52V - 1500W. We don't yet know how much beyond 3000W the X1 will go. The controller specs say 65A, up to 72V, which would be 4680W. But, I imagine it will need to dial back the amps at 72V to keep from overheating the tiny motor... :-)

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Lenk42602   10 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Lenk42602 » Jan 31 2019 10:05am

Lenk42602 wrote:
Jan 26 2019 6:43pm
.... video indicates that the handlebar display shown will not be the display used on the units that ship with 36-72v controllers (which I assume all the early orders are shipping with). Sent an inquiry to Jon regarding this.
Follow up on this. Jon has indicated that the 36-72v controller will have a handlebar display similar in size and shape as shown on the video, but will be black and white, rather than color, that will ship only with the 36-72v controller equipped units. Color versions will be available later for the 72v units.

Asked about the display incompatibility between different rated controllers, they are developing two separate controller /boards by two different manufacturers in parallel - one standard (up to 14s), the other a higher voltage version that has been requested here. He conveyed that the boards will be completely different designs as a result.

When the kits are ready to ship the controller options will be available for either.

My bike is all ready to go with 14s. I may (gasp!) get the standard unit and run it (gasp!) as intended.

SlowCo   100 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by SlowCo » Jan 31 2019 10:54am

n2mb wrote:
Jan 31 2019 9:56am
We don't yet know how much beyond 3000W the X1 will go. The controller specs say 65A, up to 72V, which would be 4680W. But, I imagine it will need to dial back the amps at 72V to keep from overheating the tiny motor... :-)
And at that wattage the bicycle drive train should be of very high /strong quality to last any decent time. Or just go to a left hand drive set up: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=97479

Fastwanabe   100 mW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Fastwanabe » Jan 31 2019 11:44am

SlowCo wrote:
Jan 31 2019 8:05am
Fastwanabe wrote:
Jan 30 2019 5:52pm
After looking at these videos I noticed Im just spoiled with how quiet the bafangs are.
I bet that if you use this X1-pro at just 1000W or less like the BBSHD/02 deliver, it will not be much louder... :wink:
I wonder if there's a video floating around to show this.

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Ecyclist   1 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by Ecyclist » Feb 01 2019 11:53am

Give yourself a favor and don't buy gear driven version of this drive. I'm not saying that chain drive is going to work well, but I'm saying that geared type will not for sure. You need very solid structure to use gear drive and you will never have that much rigidity on the bike. That's why everyone is using chains and belts. Trust me on that one. You can thank me later. :)
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SlowCo   100 kW

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Re: GNG X1-pro 3000w

Post by SlowCo » Feb 01 2019 12:16pm

Ecyclist wrote:
Feb 01 2019 11:53am
Give yourself a favor and don't buy gear driven version of this drive. I'm not saying that chain drive is going to work well, but I'm saying that geared type will not for sure. You need very solid structure to use gear drive and you will never have that much rigidity on the bike. That's why everyone is using chains and belts. Trust me on that one. You can thank me later. :)
How can you predict that? The unit itself with the controller bolted between the brackets/ mounting plates makes everything very stiff/rigid. And the coarse and wide tooth profile makes sure that a little misalignment with the low rpm's at the crank doesn't matter too much. At least that is how I view the design.

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