Holy Mother-of-Revelation, Troy! This might be the best definition of what an ebike must be capable of (compared to an unpowered bike) that I've ever seen, anywhere. I could not agree more.
grindz145 wrote:The only problem that I have with ebike touring is that I can do 100 miles in a day on an ordinary pedal bike without issue. So in order to justify ebiking, I want to go faster, and I want to go farther, and with more junk. 22mph, 150 mile days with full camping gear is worthwhile. Not to mention I could do it for 30 days in a row. Efficiency is relative. My pedal only range is infinite wh/mile...
Dunno if any of you have seen my Long Distance Ebike Design
thread, but I groped for this kind of definition and never got comfortable with the ideas I was coming up with. We mainly talked about 100, 200 and 300 mile ranges and the batteries needed to achieve that. Lots of back and forth about calculations and Wh/mi and the details. That's useful conversation, but it's just design work without a GOAL.
Your remarks define a GOAL: the comparison to the capabilities of an unpowered bike is the genius part, and the part none of us really thought of.
I'm personally able to do a 100 mile ride, unpowered, in a day. Maybe even with cargo. But that's ALL I'll do that day and it'll take me a full 12-15 hours and I promise you, I won't get up the next morning on time to do the same thing all over again. (Not that it's impossible. Plenty of very good cyclists can do that. But your average cyclist can't and more importantly, won't.)
Your thought seems to answer the question of that thread perfectly without getting mired in the details:
An ebike with 22mph average speed and 150 mile range "in a day" would definitely raise the capability of a bicycle to the next level, between a bike and a car or a bike and a motorcycle.
I have the phrase "in a day" in double-quotes because I'm willing to allow the notion, that said-ebike would stop at noon for a recharge. But allowing a lunchtime recharge definitely puts an outer limit on how long you might allocate for that. 1 hour would be best. 2 hours, probably the longest allowable, and 3 hours would be no good.
Let me offer this added point to your definition: That the 150 miles should be "honest miles" to 80% depth-of-discharge, across flat terrain with 5mph or less headwind. (And, I'm inviting you to argue if you disagree. You the one with the 4600 miles experience here, not me.
Now, it's not lost on me that there's almost no stock, commercially produced ebike out there today that can achieve those numbers. No one is building an ebike to that spec, so I don't want to debate that. But what I DO want to do is ensure that my own ebike can meet that spec!!!
Troy, with your permission, I'd like to update my "Long Distance ... " bike thread with your comment, and adopt your thought as an important benchmark spec to be achieved.
Oh also, I can get over 100 miles range without issue. 40 miles was just an average stop during the 4500 mile trip, not to downplay the success of the wattwagon
IMHO, you don't disparage the wattwagon - in fact, your earlier comment about "with more junk" kinda reinforces that the idea of the Wattwagon is sound and good.
However: PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE post more information like that here in this thread. Or better yet, do a podcast. I'm having the DTs for more NFO on your AWESOME RIDE man. There's a lot of information like this that you've not had a chance to get out.
I was pretty sure you had at least a 100 mile range on your machine, but that you were doing 40 mile legs between charges to eliminate the possibility that your 100 mile range could end out in the middle of nowhere?