I currently have a 1500watt bbshd on a hybrid bike and I want to sell the entire package and make a new ebike. This time around I'm thinking about using a 3000 watt hub motor that will take me to the mid 40 mph range. I know I'll need a 72v battery pack and will see if a custom pack could be made to fit the bike I want. What kind of controller do you recommend that will allow me to use a display that I can use at night?
What are some good 3000W hub motors for 26 inch rims?
- Thread starter papabless
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hypertoric_amplituhedron
100 W
First off, does that sweet mtb have a 9mm QR , or a 12x142 thru axle? A 9mm QR with vertical dropouts is what you need, using two torque arms on each side. Be careful of going big on the phase amps on a 3000w motor. The frame will not like it at all, unless you engineer clamping dropouts like this build.
Secondly, any decent 18 fet controller, paired with a Cycle Analyst 2.4 or 3.0 will give you all of the phase amps and night riding ability that you want. However, we now have a new generation of controllers out there, the field oriented type (FOC) , which means you can use a 12 fet on that design. They are about twice the price, from being twice as nice. Do not confuse the two, if you're trying to pull big amps at 20s. The non-FOC 12 fet won't pull the battery amps nor produce the appropriate phase amps that make a 3000w hubmotor worth using, over the 1500w hubs.
Thirdly, a 3000w hub motor needs to have a minimum 45mm magnet width. There are many available, like MXUS and their clones, QS Motor (can take crazy high power levels beyond your comfort zone), etc. You can safely run 3000w on a 1500w hub motor if you use Statorade and Hubsinks. Those 2 cooling mods can shed up to 1300-1400 watts of waste heat, which adds that much more to your continuous rating of 1500w on a 26" rim.
Secondly, any decent 18 fet controller, paired with a Cycle Analyst 2.4 or 3.0 will give you all of the phase amps and night riding ability that you want. However, we now have a new generation of controllers out there, the field oriented type (FOC) , which means you can use a 12 fet on that design. They are about twice the price, from being twice as nice. Do not confuse the two, if you're trying to pull big amps at 20s. The non-FOC 12 fet won't pull the battery amps nor produce the appropriate phase amps that make a 3000w hubmotor worth using, over the 1500w hubs.
Thirdly, a 3000w hub motor needs to have a minimum 45mm magnet width. There are many available, like MXUS and their clones, QS Motor (can take crazy high power levels beyond your comfort zone), etc. You can safely run 3000w on a 1500w hub motor if you use Statorade and Hubsinks. Those 2 cooling mods can shed up to 1300-1400 watts of waste heat, which adds that much more to your continuous rating of 1500w on a 26" rim.
I loved my QS205 v3 50H in a 26" wheel. The QS 3kw motors can do 10+kw easy. You will see 60 mph no problem.
You need custom dropouts and or swingarm for a hub with any power and torque, certainly anything with "3kw" in the name.
The bike's handling will suck ass with a 20-30lb disc at the end of the rear swingarm pivot. Not too much of an issue on smooth streets, where you can concentrate on the saving grace of being able to effortlessly power wheelie up to 40+ mph.
Brakes, even 4 piston on 203mm rotors will be inadequate to panic stop.
Whatever controller you get make sure it does torque control mode, not speed control. 1000% better and smoother throttle. ASI is good example of a brand whose controllers do this and more. Do your research on that front because one of their most popular venders really sucks.
You need custom dropouts and or swingarm for a hub with any power and torque, certainly anything with "3kw" in the name.
The bike's handling will suck ass with a 20-30lb disc at the end of the rear swingarm pivot. Not too much of an issue on smooth streets, where you can concentrate on the saving grace of being able to effortlessly power wheelie up to 40+ mph.
Brakes, even 4 piston on 203mm rotors will be inadequate to panic stop.
Whatever controller you get make sure it does torque control mode, not speed control. 1000% better and smoother throttle. ASI is good example of a brand whose controllers do this and more. Do your research on that front because one of their most popular venders really sucks.
"their" referencing who please? Or even better, just name the sucky controller brand, why not?flat tire said:
> I loved my QS205 v3 50H in a 26" wheel. The QS 3kw motors can do 10+kw easy. You will see 60 mph no problem.
Personally I do not care about speed, top end can be 20mph no problem.
But for a very heavy weight cargo bike climbing tall mountain roads, I want all possible torque, at say 10-12mph climbing speed, get up to 15-17mph on the less steep bits?
So low Kv winding, 52V rather than 72V?
Thinking I still need to go to the QS 273 v3 4000W, 205 just not enough.
Is there a way to make use of both a hub motor **and** a Rohloff SPEEDHUB 500/14 ?
Maybe a cargo trike design with hub motors on each of the parallel wheels and the gearbox in the middle?
Or use the gearing with as powerful a mid motor as possible, and the hub motors mainly used for flatter roads?
harmonist
10 W
I was using the edge 1500w on a mountain bike which did the job nicely, closer to 50mph top speed with a 72v battery (with ferro fluid and hubsinks), the 12fet controller didn't last long so went 18fet, I'm still using the edge motor and controller 2000 miles later but on an EEB frame now.
Sorry for being unclear. ASI is the brand of controller that is awesome and unfortunately their most popular community vender ERT has had a lot of issues. You can purchase from ASI themselves for inflated price, and gain programming and support, but not for the weak of wallet. Still under $1k. Worth it.
markz
100 TW
MXUS 3000W which is 45H model (the height of the stator) they are on Alibaba at https://mxus.en.alibaba.com/
QS 3000W they are here http://www.qs-motor.com/products/
Controller wise could be Kelly Controller - https://www.kellycontroller.com/
QS 3000W they are here http://www.qs-motor.com/products/
Controller wise could be Kelly Controller - https://www.kellycontroller.com/
markz
100 TW
You'd need to lace a 3kw or 5kw, MXUS sells a 5kw hub motor, lace it into a smaller diameter motor for a direct drive hub motor.
For hills and cargo, going mid drive, like the Cyclone 3kw or their 4kw mid drive is a good option.
CycloneTW is their website. Taiwan. I just ordered a 68-120 BB and some crank arms from them a few days ago. I cant remember how long my 4kw came in shipping time. Its going on a Costco Fatty for the winter.
You could use a hub motor driving a rolhoff, but they arent meant for that so dont bother. Buy a BBSHD or Cyclone for more power. You will be wearing out your drive train quicker using mid drive.
For hills and cargo, going mid drive, like the Cyclone 3kw or their 4kw mid drive is a good option.
CycloneTW is their website. Taiwan. I just ordered a 68-120 BB and some crank arms from them a few days ago. I cant remember how long my 4kw came in shipping time. Its going on a Costco Fatty for the winter.
You could use a hub motor driving a rolhoff, but they arent meant for that so dont bother. Buy a BBSHD or Cyclone for more power. You will be wearing out your drive train quicker using mid drive.
john61ct said:
I had no idea 3kw hub motors could become that powerful. All I'm looking for is something that will allow me to go up to 45 mph without doing unexpected wheelies and allow me to do panic stops. Anything faster and I know I might get myself into some serious injury as I will mostly use this for commuting.
On a torque control throttle wheelies will only come when you want them, and you can directly adjust torque without affecting peak power by modifying the phase current limit.
Also get a domino throttle, it's much better than all the cheap throttles in terms of accuracy precision and build quality. It's only your interface to the bike the ENTIRE time you're riding it.
Also get a domino throttle, it's much better than all the cheap throttles in terms of accuracy precision and build quality. It's only your interface to the bike the ENTIRE time you're riding it.
hypertoric_amplituhedron
100 W
flat tire said:
That does actually sound like a better option than voltage control. You won't have to deathgrip the throttle when going over bumps, as you try to keep it in the same exact position without sending huge power spikes from small adjustments. Seems safer, too, to a newb, who doesn't expect the insane torque delivery of a hub motor at 5kw. It also seems like you have far better control over keeping the amps low, even if it's set to max power. I'm gonna have to look into this.
Current (torque) throttle control is much better than "speed" (voltage / PWM) control (the type most generic controllers have).
There's a number of good controllers that implement it, and more of them are doing so as time goes on. Phaserunner by Grin Tech, etc.
I don't remember for sure but I think the open-source firmware for KT controllers supports this; there are KT controllers that are big enough to run pretty big motors. See Casainho / Stancecoke's threads for more details.
There's a number of good controllers that implement it, and more of them are doing so as time goes on. Phaserunner by Grin Tech, etc.
I don't remember for sure but I think the open-source firmware for KT controllers supports this; there are KT controllers that are big enough to run pretty big motors. See Casainho / Stancecoke's threads for more details.
