Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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cbr shadow   1 kW

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Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by cbr shadow » Jan 20 2021 12:49pm

I've been getting serious about buying or building a fast ebike for my 12 mile commute. I'd want something very fast (40-45mph sustained would be great) on a full suspension mountain bike.

I recently commuted by road bike and was passed FAST by a guy on an electric scooter. I caught up to him at a light and asked some questions about it. $1,600, dual 1000w motors, 40mph top speed, full suspension, and can do some "light off roading". That price and performance is hard to resist.

Another use for this bike/scooter would be that it should be capable of light off-road use. Hard pack gravel, really. There are 2 routes to work and one of them takes me through some gravel sections.

What're the pros vs cons of a scooter for commuting rather than an ebike?

BlueSeas   100 W

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by BlueSeas » Jan 20 2021 8:31pm

Mainly the government imposed ones. An ebike isn't usually regulated in the same fashion as a scooter. The differences vary by state. Most all require scooters (full size, mini motos), to register and have a tag. Sometimes you need insurance and motorcycle drivers license. EBikes skip all of that, but technically only if under 28mph, or 20mph depending on jurisdiction. If you ant to do 40mph, I think all states would require registration and have additional rules over eBikes.

I see you are from CA. There is additional info here:

https://www.chp.ca.gov/programs-service ... r-vehicles

And a search on the internet will find other references.

99t4   100 W

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by 99t4 » Jan 20 2021 10:40pm

Do you like to pedal? Is it important to you?

markz   100 GW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by markz » Jan 21 2021 12:08am

You can carry a stand up e-scooter very easily, not so with a bicycle.

You can also take the stand up e-scooter onto the train or bus very easily even during rush hour when bicycles are banned on trains.

Going 40-45mph on a stand up e-scooter is probably not going to go very well
upon the first pothole you sink the small wheels into
or rail line over road
or bridge gap
or sidewalk wc ramp lip
or roll up the sidewalk curb curvature
or snow
or sand
or mud
or large rocks from gravel alley

an ebicycle can overcome all that even with 2 lazy eyes and glaucoma all while double fisting root beers on the ebike.

donn   10 kW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by donn » Jan 21 2021 12:45am

That word "scooter" - hope I never see it or hear it again.

Scooter: Image

Scooter: Image

Scooter: Image

markz   100 GW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by markz » Jan 21 2021 1:31am

Stand Up Scooter
Mobility Scooter
Moped Scooter

then there are the stand up scooters with a seat on them
theres also the self balancing scooter

JeffTheEbikeLover   1 µW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by JeffTheEbikeLover » Jan 21 2021 2:18pm

99t4 wrote:
Jan 20 2021 10:40pm
Do you like to pedal? Is it important to you?
Pedaling is always nice to get some cardio in so it's definitely important to me. But the features of pedal assist is useful when I happen to come across a hefty hill...I guess this depends on the PAS settings.

Audisport09   10 W

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by Audisport09 » Jan 23 2021 1:28pm

You want to sustain 45mph for 24 miles...? Wow. I bet that scooter doesn't have the battery to do something like that unless you plan on charging at work. Have you ridden an electric scooter before? I chicken out at 20 mph lol. You have to really concentrate on it and watch the road surface carefully. Commuting whilst it's dark would be dangerous imo. It's no from me. E-bike wins my vote. Or best of both world, something I'm working on, a small souped-up 16-14 inch folding bike?

markz   100 GW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by markz » Jan 23 2021 7:06pm

No, I have never ridden a stand up scooter before. I was ready to rent a Lime scooter once but I couldnt find it and never rode, yet Lime decided to still charge me and I lost all appetite because I got ripped off. All I wanted to see was how fast I could go, and what hills I could go up at a decent speed at 375lbs though I think I am heavier now, I feel the gut getting bigger but its like a pot belly, yet I dont drink and its stretched out on a 6'5.5" frame. Another thing to blame covid on I guess. If I was commuting to work, I'd make my own scooter with 2 high powered rc motors, or a 3.5x10" hub motor 2kw but the 4kw is only $50 more, and hefty at 25lbs.

The other thing to worry about with those scooter is other people, and lots of injuries on them scooters. I am 100% sure there are statistics for how many injuries and what kind of injuries. Probably a lot of hands, arms and leg fractures as there is no law required for helmets here for rental scooters. Also people tend to just leave the scooters anywhere they please, middle of sidewalks is classic.

Your right, ebikes wins my vote but everyones different. A folding bike may work, 20" but I'd look into the 26" Paratrooper Montague. 20" would be good for a micro apartment/condo or RV.

I would never want to go 45mph on a scooter, I just want the power to go up some 200m 20% slopes, and some 300m 10-15% slopes and lots of shorter length ones. Its not common but they are out there where I live and it sucks having to walk up them.

Audisport09 wrote:
Jan 23 2021 1:28pm
You want to sustain 45mph for 24 miles...? Wow. I bet that scooter doesn't have the battery to do something like that unless you plan on charging at work. Have you ridden an electric scooter before? I chicken out at 20 mph lol. You have to really concentrate on it and watch the road surface carefully. Commuting whilst it's dark would be dangerous imo. It's no from me. E-bike wins my vote. Or best of both world, something I'm working on, a small souped-up 16-14 inch folding bike?

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Chalo   100 GW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by Chalo » Jan 23 2021 9:45pm

markz wrote:
Jan 23 2021 7:06pm
at 375lbs though I think I am heavier now, I feel the gut getting bigger but its like a pot belly, yet I dont drink and its stretched out on a 6'5.5" frame.
I'm in your weight and height class (6'8" and 360ish before pandemic), but I don't go fast. One of my bikes goes 22 mph max and the other goes 28 mph, but my usual speed range on either bike is under 20 mph. I have lots of pedal bikes too, and I go much slower on those.

Anyway, fast or slow, you need a special ride. Something stronger and more powerful than something for a regular sized person. The smaller the wheels, the fatter your tires should be.

Under no circumstances would it be a good idea to tear around at 40+ on a stand-up scooter. It's inviting disaster. I think you'd be best off with either a suspension mountain bike (not easy or cheap at your size) or a sit down scooter. Which one will get you less static from the law is a function of where you live.
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by PRW » Jan 24 2021 9:47pm

I have a FS mountain bike that will do 40 mph, fairly safely - motorcycle tyres, downhill forks, good quality suspension. I have hit potholes at this speed, without major drama.

I also have a 2000W dual motor scooter (60v). It has suspension, but nothing compared to the bike. Top speed is also around 40mph, but i would only do this if there was absolutely no chance of anything going wrong - no major road surface issues, no possibility for someone to get in your way, no chance a dog would run out... and knowing that the ability to brake very heavily in an emergency is so much safer if I am on a bike.

Practically, I therefore normally only travel on the scooter at around 25mph, because of the above, unless the way is totally clear and smooth. Even then, the scooter takes more focus, because of the smaller wheels.

It depends on how much "excitement" you want. I find the scooter is mentally and physically more tiring, but great fun for short trips.

beetz12   1 µW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by beetz12 » Jan 25 2021 1:37am

As many others have already said, I would personally would not ride an e-scooter over 20mph exactly for the safety risks mentioned.

Here's a good video that explains the pros and cons of using an ebike vs e-scooter for commuting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQWQqqG3xVg

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MadRhino   100 GW

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Re: Commuting and fun: Ebike Vs E-scooter.

Post by MadRhino » Jan 25 2021 2:37am

Some stand up scooters are fast, and cheaper than building a good ebike commuter. Yet those scooters are not making a comfortable commuter, and can be dangerous on rough or dirty streets. I guess some people some places would like them to commute 12 miles everyday, but for most spending the time and money to build a good commuter ebike is much better.
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.

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