brett ebike.biz refunds

I've been asked to put some statement on es forum on what my plans are to solve the supply problems, basically my plan is to refund anyone who has been waiting a rediculous amount of time for kits. I know its caused alot of people huge headaches and angst. What I'll do is refund those people, get all that sorted out, and start again from scratch. I should then be able to try keep on top of things instead of getting such a backlog and disgruntled customers. Its still going to take me some time to be able to do all the refunds, so I just ask for patience in that regard. My apologies to all those who I've caused headaches for, there have been circumstances contributed to the mess beyond my control, but I will endevour to avoid those in the future.

Brett

Please answer my emails and return my LiFeP04 battery!

Why didn’t you send it back to me with my hub or tell me I wouldn’t be receiving it, it cost a lot of money you must know I would notice it missing ?

I don't understand why you continue to run your business in this manner.

Brett I'd appreciate it if you would have the decency to answer my emails also. You claim to have all the components for my P4 kit...then please send it out. I've been waiting 9 months now. Because of your inaction I'm still exactly where I started with eBiking. I'm still driving the old car that should have been effectively retired 6 months ago and the only experience I have to draw on is the absolutely astonishing amount of frustration and stress you've put me though over this order.

For goodness sake, enough is enough - please send my kit!!

marshy said:

Brett I'd appreciate it if you would have the decency to answer my emails also. You claim to have all the components for my P4 kit...then please send it out. I've been waiting 9 months now. Because of your inaction I'm still exactly where I started with eBiking. I'm still driving the old car that should have been effectively retired 6 months ago and the only experience I have to draw on is the absolutely astonishing amount of frustration and stress you've put me though over this order.

For goodness sake, enough is enough - please send my kit!!

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Time to call in the big guns and insist on the return of your money.
It took more than 8 months for me to get the parts from Brett. Many emails, all with "in a couple of weeks", "try to get them to you soon" etc. etc. I only got the rest of the parts after I got Consumer Affairs NSW onto him. I finally got the parts, but ALL were dodgy in some way or another:
1/ The 408 wheel had spokes that were too long so it couldn't be trued up without shortening them a couple of mm and re-threading.
2/ Both controllers looked like they had been kicked around the shop floor for a few months after being removed from operation on a prior vehicle. The first had a short between a phase wire and the gate of a MOSFET. I had to replace 4 shorted MOSFETs to get it going again. The second controller had the same fault but I spotted this in time. It also had a roughly drilled hole over the status LED for observation. It was covered with a bit of sticky tape.
3/ The two 48V 10AH LiFePO4 batteries arrived with no BMS boards. Brett said he'd send them. Ha! (I'll believe that when I see it!) They also looked second hand. On using them, I find that one has a true capacity of 8AH and the other 8.5AH. Once again he has supplied second hand dodgy stuff.
I spent over $1800 on these parts from Brett. The only part that I am currently using from Brett is one of the controllers. I bought another 408 from http://www.thebike.com.au which arrived just two days after the order. (No complaints there! Quick service, amazing!) I am using another battery that I had bought on eBay.

IMHO Do not opt for the supply of the goods. Demand your money back. He'll only offload more shoddy parts that you'll have to rework to get useable.
This blighter should be run out of town on a rail. Just search back through the threads on this forum and you'll find dozens if not hundreds of posts complaining about Brett and his shyster actions. Three people have PMed me to send them my Consumer Affairs case number for reference. Feel free to do the same.
Brett, you only have yourself to blame. Get a real job and earn some money to pay back the people that you have scammed. Then get out of the ebike business. You only give a bad name to it. Leave it to people that can be trusted.

Wow an update from brett. And sounds like things haven't changed much... Lets see if we can get a refund for that controller that never appeared.

-founder of the "Brett - all lies" thread

marshy said:

Brett I'd appreciate it if you would have the decency to answer my emails also. You claim to have all the components for my P4 kit...then please send it out. I've been waiting 9 months now. Because of your inaction I'm still exactly where I started with eBiking. I'm still driving the old car that should have been effectively retired 6 months ago and the only experience I have to draw on is the absolutely astonishing amount of frustration and stress you've put me though over this order.

For goodness sake, enough is enough - please send my kit!!

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Brett has replied, telling me that he doesn't have the correct length spokes, and it may take a while to get them. I'm not sure why he's only doing this now, after so many months. He's had the motors since March, and he told me last November that my 700c rim had come in (although only recently he realised he didn't actually have the correct one)

It never ends, does it Brett?

ElectricEd said:

Time to call in the big guns and insist on the return of your money.

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I still haven't received a commitment from Brett for delivery of my kit - he will not reply to my emails.

So enough is enough. I have been more patient and reasonable than any person should have to be. Brett has been promising imminent delivery of my kit since last November. Today I contacted the NSW Office of Fair Trading (http://www.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/default.html) and asked them to escalate my case (opened in April). They are investigating the various claims against Brett, including mine, for possible consolidated action.

They asked me to submit a CTTT Tribunal Hearing Request (http://www.cttt.nsw.gov.au/default.html?Dcsext.ref=HomePageClick:Quicklinks). The CTTT provides a ruling plus legal enforcement where required. By request, the hearings can be held by telephone for those not in NSW.

For those of you out there in a similar position, I'd encourage you to follow similar steps.

SEND MY BATTERY BACK RIGHT NOW, AS IN TODAY OR REFUND MY MONEY, IT'S OBVIOUS YOU SOLD IT AND IT NEVER BELONGED TO YOU, YOU ARE A JOKE

Maybe I should start a Joshua Goldberg give me my money or headway battery pack, bms, charger and case thread?
Of course reading his emails as to why I don't have my money or batteries is amusing as watching an episode of SOAP.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_JhwUpIjbY&feature=related

EVsolutions wrote:
> Should be able to get you a 48V X 10Ah pack within 2 weeks and then add the
> 2nd pack later if that helps at all?

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EVsolutions wrote:
Friday, July 10, 2009
> still working on it. Sold one hub motor kit (this was good) and then got an order for a 2nd motor kit and used the profit from the 1st sale to buy the motor kit and battery pack for the 2nd sale and it arrived last THursday and the bastard then tells me he changed his mind and bought a BionX kit instead.
>
> So end result is I have a motor kit with battery pack that no one wants that cost the profit from the first sale which was going on the Headway pack.
>
> Still have some hope the TD Canada Trust can get back the $3,500.00 USD from the HSBC in Hong Kong
> joshua goldberg

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Got the news a few hours ago the $3,550.00 is toast so now I have to find another approach. The money still exists but not with the HSBC and now I have to track it down to see where it went.

joshua goldberg

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Gee Lesss I really appreciate you posting my personal emails to you. If you have a business I hope you don't do it with your customer's emails too as it is in really bad taste.

I have explained at length what happened and where the situation stands at the moment. I was going to update you in a few days but after seeing this I guess you'd prefer we trade messages in Public.

I have located the money in China and am contacting Victoria or more correctly I have asked someone else to contact her on my behalf since they have the money.

Seems my problems with the Headway Order got even worse when one of the Americans informed me Rob never sent him his pack even though Rob told me he did. Also a chap in B.C. who had his 2 packs arrive in Miami never received his, again Rob was supposed to send them and didn't. Rob also never sent me the 45 Headway cases he said he'd send.

As for Rob I can only assume he was pissed off that someone else in the States wanted to become the U.S. Distributor and he was left out and turned on me and the people in the Group but it is just a guess since he hasn't contacted me since March 05th.
I ended up losing what is now $7K on that Group Order and in hindsight I should have built in a Profit to cover boo boos like this one but there was no way to see Paypal converting the payments in American Dollars to Canadian Dollars just as the Canadian Dollar fell off a cliff dropping 25% in value so fast. They admitted their mistake but the Fine Print says they are not responsible for their stupidity.
Everyone in Canada has been remarkably understanding and patient except you which I guess says something about your nature.
Some of the Canadians who like myself are under water from all this neverending rain and cold weather said they are willing to wait till next Spring, others said they can wait till the problems are cleared away.
What I have not done (in case you have not noticed) is wash my hands of the whole mess and refuse to take responsibility for what happened and that would be easy to do but I'm not wired that way.

P.S. sorry to see Brett is having problems.

Everyone in Canada has been remarkably understanding and patient except you which I guess says something about your nature.

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I've waited a YEAR for my money or my batteries and have heard nothing but sob story after sob story, after business scheme after scheme go awry.

I did not insist upon payment by paypal, you did. I did not approve a split into a Cdn/US order. I did not approve a delay until after winter( I ride through the winter). These were your unilateral decisions and thus your responsibility.

I do run a business. I don't sell items I don't have in stock. If special ordering something and the time delivery changes significantly I inform my customer and offer them the option to cancel or agree to the new time frame.

Most of the other Canadians were under the impression that the second part of the order was submitted for MONTHS until I started informing them that no it wasn't, only the initial deposit was and that Victoria was waiting on YOU.

I asked for you to direct headway to release my share of the deposit to me so I could use that to order direct from them - no response from you. If your were really working on getting me my batteries you could have combined the deposits already in headway's hands to get at least a couple packs of the 6 sent over to reduce number of people waiting. You could have borrowed money from family/friends/the bank or put it on credit card.

I just want my batteries, bms, charger, and case.

You could have borrowed money from family/friends/the bank or put it on credit card.

Well I think I explained the Credit Card problem but will do it again. Because of the Recession Banks are not increasing Credit Card Limits. I had requested an Increase to my Visa and MC and they refused citing the Recession. People are walking away from their credit cards in such large numbers that the Banks are not willing to risk giving increases.

From Friends

You are assuming I have friends, hey Tyler wanna lend me some cash?

My Friends have been hit by the Recession too

Family, hmmmm lets see how many relatives do you think I have who are still alive considering I am already considered a Senior Citizen.

As explained before I derive my sole and meager income from selling e-motor kits to mostly Americans and a funny thing happened last year you may have read about. It was called a Recession and during Recessions people who would normally buy e-motor kits decided it would be better to buy food and pay their rent and so sales took a major hit. We are now heading into Winter shortly and traditionally I sell almost nothing in Winter unless Oil Prices hit the roof which has not happened---> I wish.

as for how many people still have not got what they ordered it goes like this.
BC = 1
Manitoba = 1 (Hi Robert)
Ontario = 3
NB = 1

But the chap in BC and one in CA were supposed to be covered but their orders seem to be in Miami.

Two in Ontario are willing to wait till next Spring. one of the two I sent AGM Bricks to to tide him over as per his request.

I sold off my own Ni-CD pack and had my e-bike stolen as well as had 2 motor kits and Li-Mn pack stolen. Its been an interesting past few months.

One Point you raised

THis thing about splitting the order into Canada and the USA and how you never agreed to that.

I kept everyone's emails and you did NOT voice an objection at the time.

I took a Poll of all Members because of the 45 Members 39 lived in the USA and they would be dinged with added Import Duties and Taxes if their packs came to Canada and I got Zero objections about splitting the Order.

The first 40% Payment went in just fine and it was still in USD.

The 2nd 60% Payment was the mess because that was the one that switched into Canadian Currency just as the Canadian Dollar dropped 25%. Had Members moved faster in sending in their 60% none of this would have happened. It was the delays that set off the problems. But you cannot predict something like a Currency taking a nose dive.

am on a roll here

The Delays in that one order came about because there were 54 (count-em 54) order changes that Victoria had to do before the final order was put on the boat. Every change delayed the shipment. The shipping date was moved 5 times because of the changes and had everyone gone with what they originally wanted the boat would have arrived 3 months sooner back when the Canadian Dollar was still close to the US Dollar.

THe whole order was done with imput from everyone all the way along and in hindsight that was a mistake. What Travis did was set a deadline for the cash and no order changes and everything went as planned. Had I rejected the changes and set firm deadlines likely none of this would have happened.

I gave out $9K in Refunds because originally the order was for 65 Packs not 45 but as the Recession worsened Members pulled out to buy food and keep their homes.

By the way you (Lesss) said you've waited a Year. Not sure what you refer to since the Order did not get completed for shipping until December 05th and well that is 8 months not 12.

This whole thing has been a Millstone around my neck that I wish would go away but I'm still working on correcting the situation but it just isn't happening as fast as I would like it to happen and I can understand your impatience even though I think your approach to all this is pretty moronic.

see receipts of payment
you were paid when asked
The economy tanked after you were paid.

Since the first deposit is in headways hands how about refundung that and work on the rest of it?
Since you have that conversion kit with no buyer I would accept that as part of the payment for the remaining amount.

Either way I just want my money or my batteries.

Bump
Although i have never dealt with Brett White [ nearly did over a year ago].
I dont like it when people take your hard earned cash and don't come up with the goods, think there is a few names for this.

Sorry I argued with others here over these outstanding orders.

I honestly thought I could help everyone by acting as a diplomat.

I am choking on eating my own words now.

ElectricEd said:

Time to call in the big guns and insist on the return of your money.

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Done. I have lodged an application for a telephone hearing with the NSW Consumer, Trader and Tenancy Tribunal. http://www.cttt.nsw.gov.au/default.html?Dcsext.ref=HomePageClick:Quicklinks

The NSW Office of Fair Trading has been very helpful. They visited Brett last week - they are indeed following up.

Thank you Brett. What a complete waste of time this last 10 months has been.

too bad they don't have some agency like that in china so brett could have got his stuff back when the people he hired there ripped him off. you guys would never have had to take actions against him in that case.

is there some way to provide some sort of character witness or support for brett to the state agency from those outside? can other people who he helped before send a written statement or character witness if they had done business with him before his troubles started?

I would be one of those folks, dnmun! I have only had appropriate and well handled dealings with Brett White and he has always been extremely helpful and stood behind his products. I have followed this series of unfortunate events with some horror as suddenly the situation has created a different person from the one that I know. I will help in any way that I can.
otherDoc

This is a reason why it's a good idea to not be too dependent on your suppliers. *Especially* if they're in China since they're less legally vulnerable.

the people in china that ripped off brett were not suppliers. he had tried to start a small chinese based export business to ship directly from china but the people he hired stole his inventory and used it to go into business themselves. he tried to get the authorities to help him but that is china and that is the way they do business. the gang that stole his stuff may well have been able to pay off any investigators as well.

you may recall last year when he asked people not to buy ebike stuff from them since they were selling stuff they stole from him on the net.

anyway, to follow up on what otherdoc said, i don't think brett changed any, just too broke now to help out the people who still have outstanding orders he could not deliver.

of course i understand that those who are short are not happy about it, and not dismissing their claims, but going broke or bankrupt is not a criminal act. it may be how oz was originally populated with 'convicts' from britain's debtor prisons, but i think now we have a different perspective.

it just doesn't feel right to have the guvment be able to file a lien on your property just because you go broke. but its happening to me too so i am more sympathetic than mosta these guys.

This is the second time that brett says he has been ripped off by people in china, he has a warning about it on his web site.
If i were a business person i would not take anyones money unless i had the goods in hand to ship out,I think brett white accepted the money, hoping the stuff will be sent out from china, but it wasn't to be. I can see why those whom are owed get upset when brett posts about some new project he is undertaking, whilst others are waiting for their batteries , motors etc.
When i first decided to go ebiking, i decided to go elation aus, when i first enquired i was told he was out of stock and to call back in two weeks, which i did and then placed the order, but he could have taken my order the first time and hoped for the best.
Btw, i am glad i went elation, not cyclone, buts that another story.

Dnum,
If you have a small business and it has gone bad, I sincerely hope it works out for you,
I am a train driver[ loco engineer in your part of the world],I am thankful that with the GFC at least i get my pay each fortnight.
A business can be great if it works out, but a head ache if things go bad.
Trev.

I too have been "broke" at one time. It really sucks! If one works hard and has some skills, one comes out the other side somewhat smarter and much more prepared for the "real world". I hope the same occurs to Brett! Good luck to better destinys.
otherDoc