Building E-bike with E-backpack

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
Karl   100 W

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 1:58pm

I have a problem with the build....

Karl   100 W

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Finished ebike and it wont move....???

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 2:01pm

I finished my ebike and it wont move... well CA lights up....

when I touch throttle nothing is fonctioning...

So I decided to change the wires of the throttle since colors didnt match lyen's controller

motor starts to spin really fast not listening to the throttle...... wtf?

thanks,
Karl

John in CR   100 GW

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Re: Finished ebike and it wont move....???

Post by John in CR » Sep 22 2011 2:14pm

You sent the +5V supply for the throttle up the throttle sense wire to the controller, so it thought you wanted WOT. You can try swapping the other 2 wires if you think that's the issue. FWIW, when first getting an ebike going I like to only connect the minimum components needed to run, throttle, controller, battery and motor. Then add CA, ebrakes, etc one at a time. Improperly set CA's or ebrakes or whatever else can prevent a bike from running, so start with the minimum and add. It keeps trouble shooting easy.

Karl   100 W

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Re: Finished ebike and it wont move....???

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 2:21pm

HUUUGHHE FIRE BALL I MADE!! I burned my hands OMG it hurts

ok ill try that

thanks

mike662   10 W

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by mike662 » Sep 22 2011 2:42pm

Karl wrote:I have a problem with the build....
Uh oh. Batt's don't fit in the bag?

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by mike662 » Sep 22 2011 2:44pm

Ooohh damn, I just read your other thread. How'd you manage to blow the lipos up? Hope there isn't too much damage and that you're ok :shock:

Karl   100 W

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 3:00pm

no

the throttle is not connected and the wheel turns......

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by mike662 » Sep 22 2011 3:14pm

Karl wrote:no

the throttle is not connected and the wheel turns......
Oh phew, I thought you said they caught on fire

Karl   100 W

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 3:52pm

I burned my fingers and blew 2 connector plug and they melted into a big fire ball spark... in my hands. I checked all my batteries with my Hyperion Sentry and 1 pack was not showing results... I have no idea why but it seems to be ok now... I changed the plugs but my fingers hurts like a b!tch...

thats what you get short cutting a 84v pack lol

Anyways I took controller apart just to make sure I had the correct wires for the throttle... I tried all the combinations possible and the throttle just does not work...

and sometimes it suddently go full power without touching the throttle! CA is recording 3800watts phase wires get really hot. But I am really trying to fix this throttle issue

what could it be? A defective throttle?

I need to get this thing going I cant wait to ride this thing :(

Karl   100 W

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 7:30pm

ok it was the throttle that was defective!

now back to assembly

be right back

Karl   100 W

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by Karl » Sep 22 2011 11:54pm

Finaly drove my ebike on my street

its really nice!

but I think I broke it

the wheel is really really stiff now.... What could it be? it also has a grinding noise

I thought I would be going faster too... 84v pushing 3100-4000watts and only going 40km/h.....

feedback would be appreciated

Karl   100 W

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I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by Karl » Sep 23 2011 12:07am

this was my 1st run and I think I burned my motorwheel.... It was cool to the touch outside (after 5 minutes) after that 5th minute I was pulling so much amps to move very slow so I stoped... and it seems like its too late... looks like its seized it is very hard to pedal now... and when I touch it now its so hot I cant keep my hand on it... any ideas?

Karl   100 W

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SOLVED THANKS Finished ebike and it wont move....???

Post by Karl » Sep 23 2011 12:09am

SOLVED THANKS

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AussieJester   100 GW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by AussieJester » Sep 23 2011 12:18am

Karl wrote: ... any ideas?
Haha, yes a couple but I don't think you would like em lol :-P

Best of luck getting it sorted matey :-)

KiM

Karl   100 W

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by Karl » Sep 23 2011 12:22am

thats wierd because it was so slow when i was giving less than 2000watts

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by amberwolf » Sep 23 2011 12:31am

Sounds like you had the wrong phase/hall combination between controller and motor.

Is the motor hard to turn even with the controller unplugged from it?

If yes, the motor is probably damaged. If no, the controller probably has shorted FETs.

Also, since you had a fireball you did not explain anything about in your other thread:
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... 88#p465888
Karl wrote:HUUUGHHE FIRE BALL I MADE!! I burned my hands OMG it hurts
I'd suspect damage from that to have caused problems, too.

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Building E-bike with E-backpack

Post by amberwolf » Sep 23 2011 12:36am

Which thread do you want the help in? This one or the other one?
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... =2&t=32174
;)

Karl   100 W

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by Karl » Sep 23 2011 7:43am

the fire ball problem is solved I just shortcutted the battery wires and gladly everything is fixed

time to take appart the motor :?

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by amberwolf » Sep 23 2011 7:51am

So the motor is hard to turn even with the controller unplugged from it?

theRealFury   10 kW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by theRealFury » Sep 23 2011 8:11am

The thing with a motor is if your feeding it 2000w to go 5MPH when its max speed on your battery is something line 30MPH means that the motor will only be able to put about 15-20% of that 2000w into useable power and the rest will go into heating the windings.... so you basically have a 1600w space heater in your wheel at slow speeds. As a rule if you can not maintain more than 50% of the max speed of your motor going up a hill then you need to back off the throttle to only a few hundred watts and pedal assist or get off and push im afraid.

If the motor is hard to turn with the controller disconnected then there is a short between the phases of the motor, be it in the windings itself if they are cooked or in the phase wires around the axle if they got too hot and the insulation melted.

If it turns fine with the controller not plugged into the motor then its as Amberwolf has already indicated.
Fury

current bike

GT frame dual disk - Crystalyte HS3540- Rear (1600 miles of running) - 12s2P 10AH lipo.
Lyen 12FET Extreme MKII controller (awesome controller) - CA-DP.

Top speed - 32MPH
http://www.flickr.com/photos/63335907@N ... 869504840/ (New build pics now added)

Post licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 License

Karl   100 W

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by Karl » Sep 23 2011 8:36am

I need to unplug controller to test it out even if battery is not hooked on?

I took the hubmotor apart and the wiring looks fine

and the 3 small fets (or wtv what you call them) seems to be ok

the copper windings is very dark at some places and the paper under the fets has melted...

there is fiberglass peices between the core magnet and they seemed to have moved out... well 1/4 of an inch out

I will post pictures of that but im not sure if it was like that already

anyways if its a fets/ hall problem how do I fix it?

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Philistine   1 MW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by Philistine » Sep 23 2011 8:47am

The Fets (mosfets) are in your controller, not your wheel. It is either that you have damaged your controller (ie blown the fets) or you have melted the varnish on the windings (the copper wiring that loops around the stator). If its the former you need to have your controller repaired (with new fets), if its the later, your motor is f*cked. I suspect that you may have melted the varnish on your windings and ruined your motor, from you saying that the papers is burnt out. But post photos and people will offer opinions. Cheers, Phil.

The Mighty Volt   10 MW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by The Mighty Volt » Sep 23 2011 9:06am

This sounds like me two years ago.

At OP: at no-load speeds {free-wheeling} no hub motor should be drawing any more than an amp.

The revolution of the hub should be clean as a whistle. Smooth as you like.

You more than likely had a the wrong phase wire combo.

Hugues   1 kW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by Hugues » Sep 23 2011 9:19am

theRealFury wrote:... As a rule if you can not maintain more than 50% of the max speed of your motor going up a hill then you need to back off the throttle to only a few hundred watts and pedal assist or get off and push im afraid......
sorry to hijack the thread here , but your comment made me think about something:

Couldn't a decent controller+CA+hub with all sensors be programmed to reduce the amps automatically ?
Hugues
Switzerland
http://zvexx.com

theRealFury   10 kW

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Re: I think I toasted my hubmotor

Post by theRealFury » Sep 23 2011 10:07am

Karl wrote:I need to unplug controller to test it out even if battery is not hooked on?
Hey Karl,

Yes, disconnect everything from the motor so the motor is not plugged into anything at all and then see if it still coggs hard or if it will turn smoothly. If your phase wires or motor windings are shorted then the harder you try to turn the wheel the more resistance you will get and therefore the stiffer it will feel.
Hugues wrote:Couldn't a decent controller+CA+hub with all sensors be programmed to reduce the amps automatically ?
Well, i seem to remember reading a post from Justin about the CA now (or soon?) incorporating a temperature sensor pad on the board so that it could be programmed to limit power based on temperature... cant seem to find the link at the minute though im afraid. This would be one way of stopping yourself from cooking the windings i guess... other than that you would need some kind of algorithm that would reduce the power after a certain time spent at a high wattage but with no increase in speed while being below a set speed point. I would think it would be fairly easy to do if you had the skill to design such a circuit.
Fury

current bike

GT frame dual disk - Crystalyte HS3540- Rear (1600 miles of running) - 12s2P 10AH lipo.
Lyen 12FET Extreme MKII controller (awesome controller) - CA-DP.

Top speed - 32MPH
http://www.flickr.com/photos/63335907@N ... 869504840/ (New build pics now added)

Post licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 License

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