nuvinci hub warranty

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kriskros   10 kW

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nuvinci hub warranty

Post by kriskros » Nov 26 2010 1:40pm

using a nuvinci hub with a motor voids the warranty.... quote from nuvinci support on the nuvinci forum

Electric Rider   10 mW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by Electric Rider » Nov 27 2010 1:24am

That's freaking hilarious because that's what Optibikes uses on their 11 thousand dollar e-bikes. They only warrant the product for 90 days.. That should be a crime. Oh well now I guess we know why they have such a terrible warranty.

i could see them getting sued royally over that.

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MitchJi   1 GW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by MitchJi » Nov 27 2010 3:08am

Hi,
Electric Rider wrote:That's freaking hilarious because that's what Optibikes uses on their 11 thousand dollar e-bikes. They only warrant the product for 90 days.. That should be a crime. Oh well now I guess we know why they have such a terrible warranty.
No (for the second or third time - which is getting to be hilarious) the nuvinci is not what Optibike uses.
Last edited by MitchJi on Nov 27 2010 3:09am, edited 1 time in total.
Best Wishes!

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boostjuice   10 kW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by boostjuice » Nov 27 2010 3:09am

The top spec Optibike uses a Rohloff 14 speed IGH. As far as i'm aware, no models currently use the Nuvinci CVT hub at this point in time. I remember reading somewhere on ES that a person who contacted Rohloff about forming a commercial partnership to use their speedhub in an electric powered application were received with open arms by the company. It's no surprise then that their are several other companies other than Optibike that have commercialised E-bikes built around the Rohloff, Third Element is one example > http://www.rohloff.de/en/news/news_rss/ ... index.html

Nuvinci is the opposite in this regard >http://nuvinci.informe.com/forum/bicycl ... html#p1164

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Last edited by boostjuice on Apr 21 2011 1:46am, edited 2 times in total.

alan   100 W

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by alan » Nov 27 2010 9:19am

Electric Rider wrote:That's freaking hilarious because that's what Optibikes uses on their 11 thousand dollar e-bikes. They only warrant the product for 90 days.
I just took a look at the Optibikes page, and it looks to me like they have a 90 day/1 yr/2 yr warranty, where nearly everything is covered for a year or more, and there is a product satisfaction no questions asked return guarantee for 90 days. Looks like a pretty good warranty to me!

-- Alan

NoDerail   10 µW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by NoDerail » Nov 27 2010 11:52am

Hi Everyone,

I am new to the forum and I saw your post about the Nuvinci warranty. I followed the link from boostjuice and it looks like Nuvinci updated their post saying that voiding the warranty only applies to motors over 250W. So it looks like you get a 2 year warranty that covers motors up to 250W. That makes me feel better since I was thinking about doing something similar to a bike I have had laying around in my garage for a loooong time. Do the other IGH's have similar warranty conditions or parameters when it comes to using motors with their hubs? The Nuvinci seems plenty strong since I have seen other people using them with motors in their bikes as well.

Thanks.

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MitchJi   1 GW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by MitchJi » Nov 27 2010 4:48pm

Hi,
NoDerail wrote:Hi Everyone,

Do the other IGH's have similar warranty conditions or parameters when it comes to using motors with their hubs? The Nuvinci seems plenty strong since I have seen other people using them with motors in their bikes as well.

Thanks.
This Velo Vision Review/Comparison from March 2008 of Nuvinci, Rohloff, Nexus Alfine 8 and SRAM iMotion 9 Geared Hubs has some useful information: :
http://www.velovision.com/mag/issue29/vv29hubgears.pdf
There’s a common link between the bikes we’ve reviewed so far this issue: they all use internal hub gears – and not just any hub gears, but the newest and latest from Shimano, Rohloff and NuVinci. As I’d also fitted the new SRAM 9-speed to my town bike, the stage was set for a four-way shoot-out.
Best Wishes!

Mitch


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Chevy Volt Pack Info - Salvage 16kwh Packs Under $2k here

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boostjuice   10 kW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by boostjuice » Nov 27 2010 6:02pm

I can't understand why Nuvinci don't want to warrant their hub for power levels higher than 250W. Their first model N171 hub features a published rating of 130Nm maximum input torque (Unfortunately the newer N360 hub datasheet neglects to mention a torque rating at all, but I imagine it couldn't be less than 75% of the N171 ( N171 = 8 spheres, N360 = 6 spheres))

A quick calculation estimating the power potential throughput for the N171 based on shortest gearing (highest torque) recommended by the published specs.

Assumes:
- It's used as an in-wheel hub as intended.
- The chainring:rear-sprocket ratio combination is the minimum recommended 1.8:1 based on the published specifications (highest/worst case input torque scenario)
- pedalling at a comfortable/realistic cadence of 70RPM

70RPM x 1.8 = 126RPM@130Nm at the input side of the hub = 1.715Kw maximum throughput.

Change the chainring:rear-sprocket combination to something more realistic like 44T:16T (2.75:1) and this figure jumps to 2.62Kw maximum throughput.

Of course peak pedal pulse torque when standing and pumping on the cranks can be substantially higher than continuous saddled pedalling but there seems to be still quite alot of headroom for electric assist beyond 250W without overshooting the maximum torque rating.

EDIT: I just calculated out that a 136.3kg/300lb rider standing on a 175mm length crank arm would actually produce 130Nm of torque at the input side of the hub based on the 1.8:1 chainring:rear-sprocket gear ratio. So maybe Nuvinci are smart in not warranting high power electric motor usage above and beyond the worst case scenario of a fat bastard using short gearing :lol:
Last edited by boostjuice on Nov 27 2010 11:25pm, edited 3 times in total.

NoDerail   10 µW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by NoDerail » Nov 27 2010 7:00pm

Thank you for providing those numbers. That is all way beyond me (that's why I find the forum so helpful). I'm sure you have to be on to something about riders being able to put out max torque and possibly damaging the hub. Since it is mainly designed for commuters and recreational cyclists, the assumption that a non-racer type of person (i.e.- a lot skinnier than me) would be using the hub is probably correct. Although I am sure this is not what they were thinking, the fact is that lightweight components on race bikes have weight limits in some cases and even if they don't, can still break. I've see carbon parts snap like the plastic pieces they are without any hesitation. Thus, it would make sense for Fallbrook to at least protect themselves in regards to customers going above and beyond the original design aspects of the hub.

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by NoDerail » Nov 27 2010 8:09pm

In regards to my prior post, I want to clarify that I make no assumptions about what Fallbrook had intended as their main consumer. The only thing I know is that I am consumer, am of portly stature, and enjoy riding my bike. Anything else is beyond me and I do not comment on what I don't know. Didn't mean to offend anyone if I did... :)

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by dumbass » Nov 27 2010 9:32pm

I have one of the older "08 model Nuvinci hubs (I think it must be the N171) on my ebike. I originally used it on a Cyclone 360w setup with no problem. I then moved it to an EZip but moved the motor so as to drive simularily to the Cyclone setup but I used a second chain for the motor driving directly from the motor to the Nuvinci hub and maintaining the original chain for the crain sprocket. Before making the installation I contacted Nuvinci tech services on the phone. They told me one of their guys was running his Nuvinci with a gas motor with no problem. And advised me where to buy the required extra sprocket and spacer for installing dual sprockets on the hub (both on the left side). If I remember correctly I told them I was going be be running twin 450w motor through the Nuvinci and they said not to worry about it it would work fine. I have only used both motors at the same time once and there was no problem from the hub but it was a very short ride.

Bob

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by NoDerail » Nov 27 2010 11:07pm

So it seems I would be fine running a larger motor if I wanted to and I shouldn't worry about what Nuvinci says. Correct? If so, that is very cool to hear. Thanks.

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boostjuice   10 kW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by boostjuice » Nov 27 2010 11:21pm

If the hub failed during the warranty period, how are they gonna know if it was used in an electric propulsion setup? They're not...unless you happened to enquire about its use with a motor earlier, whilst leaving your details Image

Nuvinci hubs are likely the strongest, most reliable IGH on the market and so are a great option as a derailleur alternative for a 'through-the-gears' E-bike, but you pay for it with the weight penalty. The Rohloff speedhub itself - renowned for strength, reliability and rated for tandem use - is 'only' rated to 100Nm max input torque :wink:
Last edited by boostjuice on Nov 28 2010 11:27pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by NoDerail » Nov 28 2010 12:39am

The other problem with the Rohloff is the price. Isn't it well over $1000 per hub? Even up to $1,500 depending on options and such? If so, no thank you. The Nuvinci seems way more robust and frankly if I am running a motor already, weight should be the least of my concerns.

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MadRhino   100 GW

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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by MadRhino » Nov 28 2010 5:05am

I wish someone develops a hub motor using the Nuvinci system. That would be a very interesting improvement in hub motor technology, no matter the warranty.
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Re: nuvinci hub warranty

Post by dumbass » Dec 01 2010 7:52pm

NoDerail wrote:So it seems I would be fine running a larger motor if I wanted to and I shouldn't worry about what Nuvinci says. Correct? If so, that is very cool to hear. Thanks.
No matter what anyone says they have or are doing with a Nuvinci (including me) there is always a risks but at least you know others are doing something simular to what your thinking. Keep in mind that at least in my situation I am using the older/heavier model. the newer model may or may not be as strong.

Bob

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