Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by wineboyrider » Dec 16 2011 12:14pm

Thanks for serving the USA Lightcycle. I hope you recover from your injuries. :D :D :D :D
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by john7700 » Dec 16 2011 1:10pm

amigafan2003 wrote:
Ykick wrote:Now he rarely uses the park for his daily commute - instead he rides the much more dangerous streets to avoid being targeted for revenue. It's really a shame he's been forced to take his chances on the streets as opposed to being targeted by the city for cash.
How much cash would they have got if he'd actually stopped at the lights?
THAN YOU I didn't want to be "that" guy

In my experience with city riders (Boston) they rarely obey traffic laws (yes, some do). How can you call
it harassment when you admit you were breaking the law. If E-bikes continue to be scofflaws, they will
continue to be legislated against.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Ykick » Dec 16 2011 2:04pm

john7700 wrote:
amigafan2003 wrote:
Ykick wrote:Now he rarely uses the park for his daily commute - instead he rides the much more dangerous streets to avoid being targeted for revenue. It's really a shame he's been forced to take his chances on the streets as opposed to being targeted by the city for cash.
How much cash would they have got if he'd actually stopped at the lights?
THAN YOU I didn't want to be "that" guy

In my experience with city riders (Boston) they rarely obey traffic laws (yes, some do). How can you call
it harassment when you admit you were breaking the law. If E-bikes continue to be scofflaws, they will
continue to be legislated against.
I get what you're saying and mostly agree. But there's times when a full STOP for an empty pedestrian crosswalk sure seems silly. And what if the bicycle rider simply dismounts and walks across an empty pedestrian crosswalk red light? Is that breaking some precious law?
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by veloman » Dec 16 2011 2:16pm

john7700 wrote:
amigafan2003 wrote:
Ykick wrote:Now he rarely uses the park for his daily commute - instead he rides the much more dangerous streets to avoid being targeted for revenue. It's really a shame he's been forced to take his chances on the streets as opposed to being targeted by the city for cash.
How much cash would they have got if he'd actually stopped at the lights?
THAN YOU I didn't want to be "that" guy

In my experience with city riders (Boston) they rarely obey traffic laws (yes, some do). How can you call
it harassment when you admit you were breaking the law. If E-bikes continue to be scofflaws, they will
continue to be legislated against.

It's not just ebikes, it's cyclists in general. You need to draw the line somewhere, and that's somewhere between following the law to a T and being reckless. Many stop signs and some traffic lights do not serve cyclists, they are designed for much more dangerous vehicles like cars. I do stop at nearly all stop signs now. I had a car behind me yell "nice stop" the other night. A few seconds earlier I was wondering if I should do a real stop because he was behind me and it felt dangerous since the intersection was completely clear and quiet.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by LI-ghtcycle » Dec 18 2011 2:00am

wineboyrider wrote:Thanks for serving the USA Lightcycle. I hope you recover from your injuries. :D :D :D :D

Thanks man, I seem to be doing ok, been so stink'n busy I haven't had much time to even post though! (Busy is a good thing! :mrgreen: )

You know, it would be great to see more E-Bikes in NYC used by celebrities, sad to have to use that tactic, but it might be the only thing that power/fame hungry lawmakers would pay attention.

Maybe Lady Gaga could ride around NYC and then they would make a 180 and say how wonderful they are! :roll: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by john7700 » Dec 18 2011 10:24am

LI-ghtcycle wrote:
wineboyrider wrote:T

Maybe Lady Gaga could ride around NYC and then they would make a 180 and say how wonderful they are! :roll: :lol: :lol:

Been Done! http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =lady+gaga
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Lock » Dec 19 2011 7:15pm

http://www.nypress.com/blog-9861-west-s ... ebate.html
West Side Spirit: Feds Say You Can't Restrict It-The Electric Bike Debate

In Section: NY comPRESSed Posted By: West Side SpiritMonday, December 19,2011
Image

The trouble with electric bikes, both lovers and haters will agree, is that no one can say exactly what rules apply to them. Electric bikes are either custom-made or adapted with an electric motor that gives the rider an extra kick. For some, they’re a godsend of alternative transit, making multi-borough commutes possible. For others, however, they are dangerous and illegal machines.

“We wanted them to be treated like a moped—you get a license plate, you pay a fee and everybody knows who they’re registered to,” said Andrew Albert, co-chairperson of the Transportation Committee. As for the insurance issues raised, he said that the committee will investigate the issue. What he didn’t realize, however, is that electric bikes are actually banned by the city and state of New York.Last week, Community Board 7 sent a resolution on electric bikes back to the Transportation Committee after board members could not agree on how a potential ruling by the city and state classifying electric bikes as motor vehicles could affect the ability of bike owners to attain liability insurance.

“The City’s Administrative Code prohibits electric bikes,” Scott Gastel, Department of Transportation spokesperson, wrote in an email.

The state DMV, will not register electric bikes, which it classifies as “motor assisted bicycles,” and outlaws them.

How then, are people in riding around on these bikes unhindered?
Last edited by Lock on Dec 28 2011 6:02am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Lessss » Dec 20 2011 12:57am

traffic lights cause traffic backup.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/spi ... 47,00.html

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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by veloman » Dec 20 2011 1:39am

Amazing videos.

I couldn't help but burst out laughing after switching from the first video to the 2nd. How many people went through the intersection in the first video? G'damn that was a LOT of volume of people. Talk about efficiency, oh my.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Ykick » Dec 28 2011 12:57am

No mention of eBikes in this story but "delivery rider" is practically code for eBikers in the city...

These people sure do seem to have nothing better to do, eh?

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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Lock » Dec 28 2011 6:11am

http://gruskinfoundation.org/pdfs/Pedes ... ts_3-1.pdf
Pedestrian-Cyclist Accidents in New York State: 2007-2010

Summary and Conclusions
A second finding emerging from this study is that the profile of pedestrians
injured in cycling accidents is a distinctive one. Compared to the population
for New York State as a whole, victims tend to be much younger and to be
members of minority racial/ethnic groups. In particular, Hispanics are
overrepresented among pedestrians involved in cycling accidents.
Clearly they should be targeting Hispanics...
:twisted:

I thought Prof. Ayrton was pretty amusing in his lecture from 1888 about the risks of electricity:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... &start=465
The electric pressure, or potential difference, between the terminals of any arc lamp is not high, but it is between the main wires near the dynamo as well as between these wires and the ground. How far does this lead to the risk of sparks or unpleasant shocks? That is a point that can be looked at in a variety of ways. First, there is the American view of the matter, which consists in pointing out to people exactly what the danger is, if there be any, and training them to look out for themselves: let ordinary railway trains, say the Americans, run through the streets, and let horses learn to respect the warning bell. Next, there is the semi-paternal English system, which cripples all attempts at street mechanical locomotion, because we are conservative in our use of horses, and horses are conservative in their way of looking at horseless tramcars. Lastly, there is the foreign paternal system, which, carried to its limit, would prohibit the eating of dinners because some people have at some time choked themselves, and would render going to bed a penal offence because it is in bed that most people have died.
What EVer happened to the American view?
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by gogo » Dec 28 2011 12:44pm

Lock wrote:I thought Prof. Ayrton was pretty amusing in his lecture from 1888 about the risks of electricity:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... &start=465
The electric pressure, or potential difference, between the terminals of any arc lamp is not high, but it is between the main wires near the dynamo as well as between these wires and the ground. How far does this lead to the risk of sparks or unpleasant shocks? That is a point that can be looked at in a variety of ways. First, there is the American view of the matter, which consists in pointing out to people exactly what the danger is, if there be any, and training them to look out for themselves: let ordinary railway trains, say the Americans, run through the streets, and let horses learn to respect the warning bell. Next, there is the semi-paternal English system, which cripples all attempts at street mechanical locomotion, because we are conservative in our use of horses, and horses are conservative in their way of looking at horseless tramcars. Lastly, there is the foreign paternal system, which, carried to its limit, would prohibit the eating of dinners because some people have at some time choked themselves, and would render going to bed a penal offence because it is in bed that most people have died.
What EVer happened to the American view?
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It was deluded by the influx of immigrants and their inclinations toward foreign paternal systems.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by veloman » Dec 28 2011 9:59pm

I just spent all day walking around midtown Manhattan and saw numerous ebikes, none of which doing anything dangerous or fast to deliver their foreign food. I did watch many pedestrians jaywalk and step in front of moving traffic, and not look where they are going.

That's the reality out there.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by John in CR » Dec 29 2011 6:33am

veloman wrote:...That's the reality out there.
Yes, but common run-of-the-mill stupidity doesn't make good press and doesn't serve any agenda.

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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Lock » Jan 09 2012 10:54pm

http://www.streetsblog.org/2012/01/09/t ... o-funding/
Monday, January 9, 2012 Comment here

This Week: Youth Bike Summit, Ravitch Talks Transpo Funding
by Streetsblog

Tops on this week’s livable street calendar is the second annual Youth Bike Summit, held this weekend by Recycle-A-Bicycle. Last year, teens learned everything from map-making techniques to organizing strategies. Also: Former Lieutenant Governor Richard Ravitch will speak on the economic perils of declining infrastructure, sounding a call he’s made repeatedly for proper transportation funding.

Tuesday: The transportation committee of Manhattan Community Board 7 discusses a proposal to turn part of 59th Street one-way, continues debating electric bicycles, and hears a presentation from Streetsblog publisher Mark Gorton on the place of the automobile in New York City. 7:00 p.m.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Lock » Feb 29 2012 5:41am

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailyp ... motorbikes
February 28, 2012 5:04 PM

Jessica Lappin: Put Brakes On Illegal Motorbikes

BY Ken Lovett

Manhattan City Councilwoman Jessica Lappin wants to put the brakes on illegal motorized bikes.

Our Reuven Blau reports:

“Delivery bikes are dangerous and illegal, yet there are a growing number on city streets,” she said Tuesday during a press conference on the steps of City Hall.

The lawmaker plans to introduce legislation to double the fines from $500 to $1,000 per ticket.

“We need to crack down and get better enforcement,” she told reporters.

The NYPD issued 48,556 bike tickets last year, according to Lappin. But it is unclear how many were for souped up electrical bikes which can race over 30 miles per hour.

Lappin, who represents the Upper East Side, said she was especially concerned for her elderly constituents who constantly complain about the problem.

The Bloomberg administration declined to comment on the pending legislation since the measure has not yet been formally introduced.
Where are the NYC ebikers???

They need to be constantly complaining about elderly constituents
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by dogman dan » Feb 29 2012 6:35am

They were too busy traveling to New Mexico to get their drivers licence renewed before the state stops issuing licences to illegal immigrants.

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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Ykick » Feb 29 2012 9:51am

I've heard this woman's name before and I believe she's trying to find a "cause" to help her political career. And with $5/gallon gasoline on the horizon?

If this were anythng that important on the upper east side I'd think NYCE Wheels would have something to contribute to the discussion?

To be honest, most car drivers and even traffic cops like how ebikes keep traffic moving. Dunno how many times I've watched a pedicab or slow pedaler enter an intersection as their traffic light turns red and poke across so slow that it creates a lot of anger and frustration.

Oh well, I'll just keep saving for my legal defense fund...
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Paul_G » Mar 01 2012 7:39am

Should Driving An Electric Bike Get You A $1000 Fine in NYC?

http://gothamist.com/2012/02/28/should_ ... ke_get.php
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by MattyCiii » Mar 01 2012 8:03am

That's why I'm going to make an attempt at stealth
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Alan B » Mar 01 2012 8:13am

Stealth is more about how you ride the bike than how it appears.

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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by dogman dan » Mar 01 2012 9:27am

Got that right. Cracks me up to no end the number of guys who show up here saying they intend to buld a stealth bike that goes 40 mph. Stealth is below 20 mph for starters. Blend in with regular bikes at 30-40 mph? :roll:

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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Ykick » Mar 01 2012 11:16am

I ride with the attitude that every cyclist and pedestrian I encounter is my grandmother. I have power assist so I don't care about momentum. If I have to come to a compete stop to yield right of way (even if it's supposed to be mine) what's the big deal? I'll be moving along shortly and not even breaking a sweat.

That's the "safety" point we should be making. How ebikes actually contribute to courtesy and safer operation than peddlers who blow through crosswalks and intersections.
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by Lock » Mar 01 2012 12:17pm

Ykick wrote:That's the "safety" point we should be making. How ebikes actually contribute to courtesy and safer operation than peddlers who blow through crosswalks and intersections.
Transport Canada "Electric Bike 2000 Project" Report from April, 2001:
http://files.meetup.com/1468133/Electri ... Report.pdf
...users also noted that e-bikes encourage users to obey the Highway Safety Code more strictly (for example, they are more likely to stop at mandatory stops) because the bikes’ motor power makes standing starts easier.
tks
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Re: Persecuting E-Bikes in New York City

Post by zombiess » Mar 01 2012 12:54pm

New York City is dominated by goof balls (usually extreme liberals, don't get me wrong I hate extreme conservatives too) who want to fix everything with the exception that for the fix to be acceptable it can't change anything. This is the same line of thinking that goes along with installing alternative energy plants such as wind and solar. They all want them, except where they live. NY City wants to alleviate traffic congestion, but outlaw a great alternative to it. Guess the pretty much covers all forms of Government in the USA, not just NYC.

The mantra is always the same, save the environment or blah blah blah, but we won't accept any changes or allow anything that's different, so all we'll do is keep complaining and campaigning and bringing up topic X to get votes and line the pockets of our cronies.

I can't wait until my Fiance gets here and sees how corrupt and broken the USA's political system is (ok, that and to have her with me). She always tells me how much corruption there is in the Philippines in the Government. I told her the big difference is in the Philippines every knows about it and expects it, but in the USA it's all "hidden" and often involves millions and even billions of US dollars. Her and her family found this to be pretty surprising when I told them some of the things that go on in our Government.

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