Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

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1000w   1 kW

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Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by 1000w » Mar 14 2013 6:33am

Last week I noticed a wheel set from a Schwinn Tailwind on Chainreaction Cycles in their recycled section for $168.
I couldn't pass this bargain up, so I bought it for an ebike build for the lovely wife, it arrived today and I'm really happy with them.
I've scored a nexus 8 speed hub and a small 220w geared hub both laced into nice 700c rims with 13g spokes and continental tyres for great price.
The good news is, this wheels set is still in stock, so there is a least one more set available.
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Mode ... elID=66346
Cheers,
Matt.
Last edited by 1000w on Mar 14 2013 9:02am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by John in CR » Mar 14 2013 8:49am

Nice find. It just goes to show everyone what the real prices of this stuff should be.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by deardancer3 » Mar 14 2013 11:00am

Good deal; snatch it up if down under.... the rear would be nice with a chain drive cyclone type motor, completely enclosed chain possible.

the front motor good for a different ebike if over volted maybe

d
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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by DewJunkie » Mar 14 2013 1:48pm

Thanks for the heads up, I went ahead and ordered one because I've been considering an e-bike for quite some time. Any clue on what controller I should pair with this? I was considering a KU93 46V 450W from bmsbattery. I didn't find many details about the hub online, so if you know of somewhere that will help me get this wired up when it comes, please share.

Thanks

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by 1000w » Mar 14 2013 9:18pm

I'm planning on using a 6 fet infineon from Cellman at 36volts.
I'll do build log with all the details and the wiring combination that works.
Cheers,
Matt.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by motomech » Mar 15 2013 9:25pm

DewJunkie wrote:Thanks for the heads up, I went ahead and ordered one because I've been considering an e-bike for quite some time. Any clue on what controller I should pair with this? I was considering a KU93 46V 450W from bmsbattery. I didn't find many details about the hub online, so if you know of somewhere that will help me get this wired up when it comes, please share.

Thanks
At 12S(46V) to 48V, the KU93 would be too much for that motor.
Hard to beat the lowly KU63 for mini-motors. With a simple shunt mod(from 14A to 17A), it is just right for >3.0 Kg. minis(which I think that one is).
For mini's < 3.0 Kg., Elifebike offers a 17A 9 FET(Which persumably could be modd'ed to 20A)which looks promising(I haven't used it). It also has a really useful 42V LVC. Perfect for 12S.
http://www.elifebike.com/peng/iview.asp ... P96D.9KNYX
The problem is, for one or two items, shipping from these distributers in China can be cost prohibitive.
If you have to go with an Ebay controller, try and use the parameters I've outlined.
Motomech

'03 Rocky Mountain Edge 2WD 260 Q100H frt and Ezee V1 rear 2 Elifebike 20A & 25A 9-FET controllers 12S/10Ah Multistar Lipo rear 4Ah Turnigy frt Luna Cyclops Extra lite Alex 24DM rims, Crazy Bobs run ghetto tubeless. 25 mph. Mean Well HLG-320H-54A
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =3&t=83430
'07 GT Idive 4 4.0, Q100C 201 14S LiPoly elifebike 9-FET 20A controller. 23 MPH.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 4#p1378484

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by MD. » Mar 16 2013 8:12pm

I just picked up this kit for a 700c bike I have. I have a couple questions maybe you guys could help me with.

Would 48v with that 17a controller be too much for this little motor? Or is 48v ok with a lower amp controller?

Is anything special needed to switch from a standard rear derailer to this internal hub? Can I use the same shift handle?

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by MD. » Mar 18 2013 1:24pm

Just in case anyone else is looking for this info.

It looks like the shifters are special for the Nexus hub. Here's what I found are compatible. I also found that I'll probably need to lose my front gears. It is my understanding that it's best just to have a straight, single gear, driveline with this internal hub. There was some information that if I wanted to keep the front gears I would need a spring loaded tensioner. I'm going to just give the simple 1 front, internal rear a try. Seems like it will be pretty cool if I can get the final speed right.

http://www.shimano.com/publish/content/ ... nexus.html
Shifters
SB-8S20 SL-8S20
ST-8S20
NEXUS features a range of shifting options with easy-to-read Optical Gear Indicators.

For the controller, I think I'm going to run the KU65, 12A, controller at 48V. I'm going to try the PAS and a three speed switch.
http://www.bmsbattery.com/controller/41 ... oller.html
MD. wrote:I just picked up this kit for a 700c bike I have. I have a couple questions maybe you guys could help me with.

Would 48v with that 17a controller be too much for this little motor? Or is 48v ok with a lower amp controller?

Is anything special needed to switch from a standard rear derailer to this internal hub? Can I use the same shift handle?

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by DewJunkie » Mar 26 2013 7:38pm

I received mine yesterday and put it on my bike today, still waiting on the controller. If you want to keep your front gears, just leave on your deraileur, and adjust the h/l screws until it is lined up with the sprocket on the hub. That is how I have mine now, and will probably leave it so that I didn't have to get a new chain. I have the old shifter on there now, but I ordered the correct one off of amazon, because the shifter I have although an 8 speed, doesn't give enough range of motion to go through all the gears. It feels like every 2 shifts on the shifter change 1 gear on the hub.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by MD. » Mar 27 2013 4:24pm

Thanks for the info DewJunkie. I'm going to do exactly what you suggested with the deraileur. Hopefully that works out on my bike.

My hub came with the Nexus roller brake. Did yours and are you planning on using it?

I cracked open the motor this morning. It is a Bafang for sure and I think it's the SWXB based on the nylon gear tooth count. My nylon gears have 28 teeth. From what I've read that means its the older SWXB. Schwinn says 15mph at 24v. I'll report back what I get at 36v. I'm hope to get around 20mph.

No matter what, it is/was a hell of a deal. My rear tire is brand new and even has the mold flashing. My front looks like it has a trip around the store. They're nice tires that are marked with puncture protection. So far I'm very happy with this purchase.

I'm waiting on my controller too. I hope to have it by Friday. I'll report back once everything is up and running.
DewJunkie wrote:I received mine yesterday and put it on my bike today, still waiting on the controller. If you want to keep your front gears, just leave on your deraileur, and adjust the h/l screws until it is lined up with the sprocket on the hub. That is how I have mine now, and will probably leave it so that I didn't have to get a new chain. I have the old shifter on there now, but I ordered the correct one off of amazon, because the shifter I have although an 8 speed, doesn't give enough range of motion to go through all the gears. It feels like every 2 shifts on the shifter change 1 gear on the hub.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by Deadmul3 » Apr 01 2013 11:08am

Dewjunkie/MD

thanks for the info. I just ordered the wheel set!

I have been reading ES for awhile and this will be my first e-bike (1st post too)
The main reason I jumped was that I already have a bike with the Nexus 8 speed hub that I really like and I wanted a low power front geared FW.
http://imgur.com/nQHTYuj

So now its on to figure out the rest of parts that I need :-)

I am looking forward to seeing your updates!

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by DewJunkie » Apr 03 2013 6:32pm

I just got my battery and controller today, got everything hooked up. This is my 1st e-bike, so nothing to compare it to. I rode it around the parking lot a bit, and then took it around the block for a 1.5 mile ride. I am really impressed. I have it paired with a BMS 36V 10.4 AH bottle battery & a KU93 controller. Right now I don't have the hall sensors hooked up so startup is not smooth, but really not bad either. I'm going to have to cut off both connectors and get a different one to get them connected. Today was about 80F with no wind and a pretty flat ride. Top speed was 25mph, and I believe about 22mph without pedaling. I have a wattsup attached and the peak wattage was 898 Watts, I'm assuming that was a very short burst, as I didn't think the battery was capable of that. I should be doing an 8 mile each way commute this week, so I'll get all the watts up numbers, top speed etc again. Speed is from endomondo, so it is possible that an odd gps signal bumped it up to 25, but most of the time I looked it was 20-23. It seemed to accelerate to 19-20 pretty quickly and then slowly keep climbing from there.
Thanks again for the heads up on a smoking deal
Also this is on a $50 walmart beach cruiser. I chuckle every time that I think about just one of the hubs being worth more than the bike.

Forgot to add, yes mine did come with the brake, and yes I am using it. The bike was originally a 26" so the brakes didn't work. On the front I bought a 26 to 700c adapter, which also works great. The coaster break is a little weak, but I may just not have it adjusted correctly, there is also a chance that the cheap cables are flexing a bit.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by DewJunkie » Apr 05 2013 8:17am

1st Trip report, I was pretty relaxed on this trip, I pedaled most of the time, and speed was 15-20 miles unless going down hill, never had the throttle wide open, I would guess about 1/2 way. I would have had to get off my bike and push up a few of the hills on this ride, but none of them were very long uphill ride. I had no problem going up the hill with the assist of the motor, and I got the feeling I wasn't adding much, but one of the reasons for the bike was to get some excercise, so the whole time I was pedaling, sometimes pushing harder than others. My other goal was to get to work without being a sweaty mess. This bike has way exceeded my expectations for what an e-bike can do.

Measurements courtesy of Endomondo and Watts Up Rc.

Here is my log
V start: 41.5
V end: 38.84
Wh: 22.96
Ah: 2.39
V min: 34.15
A peak: 22.96
distance (miles): 9.12
time: 00:39:09
speed avg: 13.98 (my chain popped off, so ~5 minutes was me trying to put it back on in the dark.

Here are my mile times to paint a better picture.
1: 3:16
2: 2:58
3: 4:09
4: 5:07
5: 4:25
6: 3:27
7: 7:10 (chain off here)
8: 4:05
9: 3:45

Image

DewJunkie   100 µW

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by DewJunkie » Apr 05 2013 11:55am

2nd long ride, this time I had it wide open pretty much the whole time. Biggest hill was a freeway overpass, from a stop at the bottom, I reached about 18 mph with light pedal assist. I made a lot of stops on this one so time and avg speed are off.

Distance (miles): 15.01
Time: 00:57:40
Wh: 256.7
Ah: 7.19
V start: 41.8
V end: 37.24

Image

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by -dg » Apr 05 2013 8:08pm

DewJunkie wrote:I just got my battery and controller today, got everything hooked up. This is my 1st e-bike, so nothing to compare it to. I rode it around the parking lot a bit, and then took it around the block for a 1.5 mile ride. I am really impressed. I have it paired with a BMS 36V 10.4 AH bottle battery & a KU93 controller. Right now I don't have the hall sensors hooked up so startup is not smooth, but really not bad either. .
Great work. How noisy is it?
If simplicity worked, the world would be overrun with insects.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by fred0 » Apr 05 2013 9:26pm

Anyone tried it yet at 48v with low amps?

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by DewJunkie » Apr 06 2013 10:27am

-dg wrote:Great work. How noisy is it?
1st e-bike so nothing to compare it to. After about 10-12 mph I can no longer hear it, I'm not sure if it get's quieter or if the noise from wind/tires drowns it out. Before that it is pretty quiet. I can definitely hear it, but it would be quite a stretch to say it is loud at all.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by Deadmul3 » Apr 11 2013 5:47pm

DewJunkie,

thanks for the update. I did receive the wheels. I didn't realize at the time that they were coming from the UK, to North Carolina in the US. anyway they look fine though the packing was not stellar and the axle ends were through the box.

damaged box --> http://imgur.com/ogVuRNn

Front wheel and hub http://imgur.com/22mBRGT and http://imgur.com/tgE0xB6 !
There are some marks and scratches on the hub but it appears to be in good shape

thanks again to 1000w for starting this thread!
back to controller and battery research!

deadmul3

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by Deadmul3 » Apr 15 2013 8:11pm

Okay, So I think I am just gonna follow DewJunkie's lead and go with a BMS battery and controller because its clear that I am still a bit lost in electric Bike technology

So I am thinking about the following
1) 36V15Ah Li-Ion Alloy 03-CASE EBike Battery Pack With a Carrier Rack
2) KU93 450W 9Mosfets High Speed Controller
3) A Pair of EBike Torque Arm (12m)

now the only problem I need to work out is out to throttle or set up PAS.

The shifter is here --> http://imgur.com/vcZHheP , which looks just like a half throttle setup
http://www.bmsbattery.com/accessory/390 ... ottle.html

so I don't think that will work and I am not sure if PAS can be setup ?
http://www.bmsbattery.com/ebike-parts/5 ... ensor.html

The other option i see is http://www.bmsbattery.com/accessory/231 ... ottle.html

any advice is appreciated... (maybe I need to start a new thread ?)
deadmul3

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by Ykick » Apr 15 2013 8:58pm

Deadmul3 - yes, start your own thread and hit the (!) and ask a mod to delete your post that doesn't belong here. I understand your interest and inspiration from OP's project but things get messy and hard to follow if you start dealing with another situation in here.

Once you get the message I'd appreciate if a mod would nuke this post too...
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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by Deadmul3 » Apr 15 2013 9:55pm

Ykick,

I created a new build thread per your advice and asked the mods to delete my post.
Is it okay to ask how the wiring was done on this build or just stay in my thread ?

deadmul3

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by dogman dan » Apr 17 2013 6:49am

You guys should be able to edit or delete your own posts. It just takes moderators power to delete or edit other peoples stuff.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by sico » Apr 17 2013 7:29am

I say let it stay, very valid questions and comments, and Matt will start a different build thread anyway.

I just ordered one myself, being more inclined towards the low power with plenty of pedalling of late.

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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by fred0 » Apr 17 2013 8:53pm

Got my stuff too!
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Re: Bargain wheel set with nexus 8 speed & hub motor

Post by Chalo » Apr 17 2013 9:26pm

John in CR wrote:Nice find. It just goes to show everyone what the real prices of this stuff should be.
Nonsense. That's a salvage/surplus price that represents somebody taking a fat loss somewhere. If you'd ever opened up a 7- or 8-speed gearhub, you'd know that it's a bargain at a couple hundred bucks all by itself.

Round flat rims that wholesale for less than $15 (in a world where dirty aluminum cans are worth more than $0.50 per pound) are the byproduct of economic distortions between slave economies and debt-driven economies. We'd be fools not to use them when available, but that's not a fair price that reflects their real cost.

No combination of an 8-speed gearhub, decent quality front hub, two double-walled rims and 72 stainless spokes plus expert assembly will reach an individual consumer for $168 without someone having gotten burned in the process.
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

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