2WD winter bike with studded tires...

trappermike · Aug 11, 2008

I have been thinking of building a winter bike,good in the few snows we get here,2 409's(front and rear)-48v-35a,with some studded knobby tires I see in my catalog. In the 70's was built a dirt motorcycle called the Rokon.I knew a guy who had 2,he said they were unbelievable in offroad traction,mud etc.They were known to be "tanks" offroad,despite relability problems with the front drive.
I see an easy bike to build,that will pull thru snow and muck like a 4wd truck! A 20 or 24a battery pack would do the job,the wieght adding to traction.
Whaddya think? :twisted:

Anonymous · Aug 11, 2008

Drunkskunk · Aug 11, 2008

If it was me, i'd do it with 2 Pumas. more torque and almost half the weight.

dogman dan · Aug 11, 2008

Front hub and peadle the rear. Seems pretty simple to me. Too cold in the snow to not peadle. In the heat though, I think a dual geared hub mtb could do some really fun trials type riding. Independent throttles so you can spin the wheel of your choice. There was a rokon on craigslist 40 miles away last spring. It was very , very, veryhard to resist.

rguy56 · Aug 11, 2008

I think it's a great idea, whether you use peddles or motored rear! If you get ice and snow in the winter, I think studs on the front, at least, are worthwhile.

Let us know what you come up with.

Bob

vanilla ice · Aug 11, 2008

You could even do something like deafscoot's triple limo with twin chain driven motors. Think scott's RC powered 52mph bike except twin wheel drive.. X-treme!!1 light weight possible here, esc/motor heat should be less an issue in snow weather.

John in CR · Aug 11, 2008

I'll be 2wd within 2 weeks. No snow here, so it's just mainly for hill climbing and acceleration. My single front hub didn't fair too well in soft sand, but 2wd should tear it up. I'm going with separate throttles and a freewheeling geared hub on the rear. That way I can still get great efficiency and speed on the flats using just the front hub, with plenty of added torque and acceleration when I pull the trigger kicking the rear into action, without too much added weight.

John

docnjoj · Aug 12, 2008

Hey John! What kind of rear hub u gonna use. Ive been real timid with mine cause of the nylon gears. I think if I nailed it I might get better performance, especially with 48 volts and LiFepo4.
otherDoc

trappermike · Aug 12, 2008

Well I always figured with 2wd to have a master switch to go from 1wd to 2wd. Just a power switch to both controllers,pretty simple.

trappermike · Aug 12, 2008

If anyone is interested in these studded tires I can look them up and give you the source.....here on the forum.

trappermike · Aug 12, 2008

I will build a 2wd bike in the next year,with the capability of 1wd or 2wd at the flick of a switch. Good for snow,mud,or hill climbing!

Lock · Aug 12, 2008

Interesting to see you guys tapping about 2wd in slippery conditions. I am only familiar with rear wheel drive that "skids out" fast/easy. Impossible to power through any turns w/out the back end slipping "out"... Thought the solution would be front wheel drive. There's an advantage to both? These are two driven wheels controlled as one, or?

And John in CR... I have "surfed" the (sandy) beach on the hard bits between the waves and the soft sand, but still, with sand "everwhere" in sprockets and chain, isn't this just chewing up all your mechanical bits? Granted, I am on Curry-style scoots where chain etc are very close to the ground/sand... maybe on a pedal bike things are better?
tks
Lock

trappermike · Aug 12, 2008

Like I told you,that old Rokon 2wd bike of the 70's was supposed to be an awesome machine!

Despite it's mechanical drawbacks.

cerewa · Aug 12, 2008

A 20 or 24a battery pack would do the job,the wieght adding to traction.

With some exceptions (like sinking your narrow tires through snow to solid ground) you'll get better traction with lower weight (assuming same tire size).

Typically, the more square-inches of rubber on the ground (per 100 pounds of weight) the better your traction will be.

John in CR · Aug 12, 2008

docnjoj said:
Hey John! What kind of rear hub u gonna use. Ive been real timid with mine cause of the nylon gears. I think if I nailed it I might get better performance, especially with 48 volts and LiFepo4.
otherDoc

Doc,
I'm gonna give the rear Bafang a go, and ordered an extra set of gears just in case, though Knuckles set got melted not stripped from a friend riding with the brake and throttle on at the same time. I'll try it in a 26" at first and go to a 20" if I feel more torque is needed. My front drive only comes up a bit short on takeoffs and hills, so as long as my batts can supply enough amps, I'm sure 2wd will get me where I want (at least until the RC guys hand us a high power solution).

Lock,
My gears and chain don't get a whole lot of use, but a quick hose down after a beach blast works fine for me. I did a week of daily beach runs in July with no ill effects, and only did a good cleaning the last day before putting it into the car.

John

wasp · Aug 12, 2008

trappermike said:
If anyone is interested in these studded tires I can look them up and give you the source.....here on the forum.

yes please

thx wasp

wasp · Aug 12, 2008

trappermike said:
Like I told you,that old Rokon 2wd bike of the 70's was supposed to be an awesome machine!
Despite it's mechanical drawbacks.

i wish i had one today...

thx wasp

rguy56 · Dec 17, 2008

I have my regular winter bike set up with a front hub motor now. With a li-mn battery, light ezee front hub motor, and aluminum frame it's still way lighter than my steel electric cruiser with sla's. I'm really concerned about how temperature will effect it at minus 40. Gotta try it out on that hard ice tonight.

rguy56 · Dec 17, 2008

oooo... Very sure footed on that hard, smooth ice. Better than my car, for sure.

36v. is noticeably slower than 48v.

broloch · Dec 19, 2008

Is snow to be damaging to the hub motors? If it gets into it? What precautions are available?

rguy56 · Apr 6, 2009

My Winter bike was a 36v. ezee kit from ebike.ca, mounted on a decent dual suspension bike with good studded tires front and rear. The ezee kit was well protected from wet conditions during the thaw. I didn't use a torque bar, partly because I advance the throttle slowly in winter. I have moosehorn type bars, and I wish I had multiple throttle mounts, because my hands get sore stuck in one position, especially when riding is tricky.

Without a motor it's really tough pushing through snow. With the motor, it could be dialed in to just keep normal momentum while pedalling. Using only the motor will easily pull through light snow, and with the studs, the front tire doesn't do a "washout" skid under power, but I haven't driven very aggressively. Icy/refrozen ruts were a challenge, but that momentum helped keep the bike stable.

I didn't use the bike under -20 C., but the battery worked well enough down to that temperature (LI PO). The battery had sufficient charge for me right from it's first use. The 36v set up was sufficient speed and power for the winter.

Overall, the bike improves the winter biking experience very much. I'll make some changes to it next year, mostly to improve comfort.

Bob

2WD winter bike with studded tires...

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