Security

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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cal3thousand   1.21 GW

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Re: Security

Post by cal3thousand » Jun 06 2014 11:49am

I can only tell you that it's a GeoGram One (~$150) with Telna SIM ($19/year). Can't tell you where I put it on the bike :wink: , but it's out of sight and has a backup battery that will last a few weeks if I put it into sleep/motion mode. It's also wired to a DC-DC circuit, so the backup 18650 cell gets topped up when I have the main pack attached.

I'm just not sure if I will make a removable/lockable housing so I can move it from bike to bike or if I should just get another device for my next additional bike.
efergy kb wrote:What GPS motion alarm have you got and where do you hide the device?

cal3thousand wrote:I have a combination of security devices that I use based on my surroundings, but the general idea is the same. It needs to look so beefy and time consuming to mess with that they will try another bike. And if they do lack the sense to stay away, I have a GPS motion alarm that sends me an SMS when moved or with GeoFences Set.

My lock is a Grade 120 3/8" thick transport chain covered in an old bike tube and locked with a shrouded MasterLock 6327. You will need some HUGE croppers or angle grinder to cut into it. I use it when I'm not sure of the area that I will be going. Most of the time, my MasterLock Street Cuffs are good enough.

On bikes normally equipped with QR skewers, I replace them with locking skewers that require a security allen key, so I don't have to carry a cable for the wheels. I'm never going to be gone long enough for someone to get the motor off.

For my wife's bike, we use 2 locks at the same time. I will most likely be doing that with my cargo bike as well. 2 locks makes the thief thing twice and the extra weight is nothing on an ebike with the cargo capacity. Minor inconvenience, but not getting another bike stolen is huge on my list of things that makes me happy.

And at home, since I park the bikes outside, they are under camera / motion alarm and under tight fitting dust covers. The covers deter anyone from even looking and the time it takes to remove it is the amount of time it takes me to grab my angle iron and get out there.
Get a Cycle Analyst and a Multimeter, you're still a noob if you don't have at least one of each.

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Re: Security

Post by mateusleo » Jun 08 2014 7:37pm

efergy kb wrote:What GPS motion alarm have you got and where do you hide the device?

cal3thousand wrote:I have a combination of security devices that I use based on my surroundings, but the general idea is the same. It needs to look so beefy and time consuming to mess with that they will try another bike. And if they do lack the sense to stay away, I have a GPS motion alarm that sends me an SMS when moved or with GeoFences Set.

My lock is a Grade 120 3/8" thick transport chain covered in an old bike tube and locked with a shrouded MasterLock 6327. You will need some HUGE croppers or angle grinder to cut into it. I use it when I'm not sure of the area that I will be going. Most of the time, my MasterLock Street Cuffs are good enough.

On bikes normally equipped with QR skewers, I replace them with locking skewers that require a security allen key, so I don't have to carry a cable for the wheels. I'm never going to be gone long enough for someone to get the motor off.

For my wife's bike, we use 2 locks at the same time. I will most likely be doing that with my cargo bike as well. 2 locks makes the thief thing twice and the extra weight is nothing on an ebike with the cargo capacity. Minor inconvenience, but not getting another bike stolen is huge on my list of things that makes me happy.

And at home, since I park the bikes outside, they are under camera / motion alarm and under tight fitting dust covers. The covers deter anyone from even looking and the time it takes to remove it is the amount of time it takes me to grab my angle iron and get out there.
I would hide it below the seat post(inside the frame) and find a good path to pass the wires by
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TheBeastie   1 MW

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Re: Security

Post by TheBeastie » Jun 09 2014 1:38am

cal3thousand wrote:I can only tell you that it's a GeoGram One (~$150) with Telna SIM ($19/year). Can't tell you where I put it on the bike :wink: , but it's out of sight and has a backup battery that will last a few weeks if I put it into sleep/motion mode. It's also wired to a DC-DC circuit, so the backup 18650 cell gets topped up when I have the main pack attached.
Do you know how long it lasts on battery? I guess in what ever mode you use which I am guessing is the motion detection mode? Or just respond to SMS location request mode?
Any mode you use it I am interested in hear how it goes. Battery usage info on the Geogram site is missing, I digged a bit on the web site and it mentioned 35mAh as one of the lower power drawing modes I believe which made me think you would get 85hours of battery if you had a 3000mAh battery, I guess I am talking here without your main battery pack attached..
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lester12483   10 kW

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Re: Security

Post by lester12483 » Jun 09 2014 5:06am

I personally use 2 kryptonite U locks for locking my ebike. Downtown Chicago has a ton of bike thefts, but mine has never even been attempted to steal.

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Re: Security

Post by xenodius » Jun 10 2014 11:57pm

mlt34 wrote:
MadRhino wrote:The Xena alarm disc lock that I have is small and loud. it is a very good turn off for robbers since it is almost impossible to stop it from screaming when the bike moves the slightest. If someone doesn't care about the noise and take the bike in a truck, I can follow the GPS tracker on my phone. No cable or U lock can compare, or anything else that locks the bike on a post for all of them can be cut in a few sec.
I've wondered about those, do they trip easily when you try to unlock it? I hate the alarms that are so easy to accidentally trip myself, but people seem to like this specific lock, so does it not have that problem?
Abrupt temperature change or vibration/movement will trigger the Xena lock, it beeps a few times then wails REALLY loud. It has a polished surface on the inside and a low-power LED at some specific frequency-- it only arms when that is disrupted. So when I take it off, it almost always beeps once, maybe twice... but then it's silent. And the beeps aren't THAT loud. Just the alarm. It's a good little lock.

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cal3thousand   1.21 GW

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Re: Security

Post by cal3thousand » Jun 11 2014 5:10pm

TheBeastie wrote:
cal3thousand wrote:I can only tell you that it's a GeoGram One (~$150) with Telna SIM ($19/year). Can't tell you where I put it on the bike :wink: , but it's out of sight and has a backup battery that will last a few weeks if I put it into sleep/motion mode. It's also wired to a DC-DC circuit, so the backup 18650 cell gets topped up when I have the main pack attached.
Do you know how long it lasts on battery? I guess in what ever mode you use which I am guessing is the motion detection mode? Or just respond to SMS location request mode?
Any mode you use it I am interested in hear how it goes. Battery usage info on the Geogram site is missing, I digged a bit on the web site and it mentioned 35mAh as one of the lower power drawing modes I believe which made me think you would get 85hours of battery if you had a 3000mAh battery, I guess I am talking here without your main battery pack attached..
It only gets REALLY good power efficiency in sleep/motion mode as you have surmised.

The power use in active modes is actually pretty poor. The battery will only last about 2 days in that mode. I guess I should do some more robust testing and report this information to the board.

But, I don't want it in active mode anyway. Motion detection with SMS alert in sleep/motion mode is exactly what I need. At night, I just set the motion on and don't worry. The only thing I want to change (and I may have to write the code myself) is that is should go back to sleep mode every hour on it's own, in case I forget when parking. Alternatively, I could have my phone send a sleep SMS to the bike at regular intervals. The thing comes with 1000 texts per month on the Telna plan, and I NEVER come close to using it all.
Get a Cycle Analyst and a Multimeter, you're still a noob if you don't have at least one of each.

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sven_nilsson   10 mW

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Re: Security

Post by sven_nilsson » Jun 11 2014 5:20pm

Forget about the expensive locks and instead install alarms and tracking. Much more effective, trust me.
Why? Even with locks, the expensive electronics, batteries and motors can still be stolen!

You can have an alarm with accelerometer, text messaging and GPS tracking.

When someone tampers with your bike, the alarm will sound, and even if they still manage to steal it you will be able to find it.

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Re: Security

Post by alsmith » Jun 11 2014 6:19pm

sven_nilsson wrote:Forget about the expensive locks and instead install alarms and tracking. Much more effective, trust me.
Why? Even with locks, the expensive electronics, batteries and motors can still be stolen!

You can have an alarm with accelerometer, text messaging and GPS tracking.

When someone tampers with your bike, the alarm will sound, and even if they still manage to steal it you will be able to find it.
From your experience? Theory?

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Re: Security

Post by TheBeastie » Aug 18 2014 6:35am

Speed Kills Range, 10mph = 46 miles range, 20mph = 20 miles, 30mph = 8 miles rangehttps://goo.gl/1JNL53
Over Charging Kills ur battery bit.ly/1hzWKl4
Consider PAS as your only throttle https://goo.gl/Kg1F8F
Fuel-Cell is the ultimate battery coupled with 4th-gen Nuclear
https://goo.gl/TcKtHs https://goo.gl/ZhFFot https://goo.gl/gfa215
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Re: Security

Post by mlt34 » Aug 19 2014 5:42am

That's really cool, and the video makes me feel like I'm finally in the future (especially compared to my rusty old u-lock)

The scenario presented in the video of some kid using it on a locker and if he's not at school he can give his friend the bluetooth access to open it for him is neat, and could apply to many different applications. One problem would obviously be if someone needs access but doesn't have a smartphone, or the app, or cell coverage, etc. Perhaps a solution could be a type of lock with some form of puzzle that you could share the answer with anyone who needed access. Like maybe a numerical code. a dial perhaps with numbers, so anyone could access it if you give them the code.

ok but seriously, this is a pretty cool lock. A thicker shackle version will be great for bikes.
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Re: Security

Post by Ykick » Aug 19 2014 8:04am

You know, this has got me thinking - BT locks and GPS tracking stuff could be useful tools if folks ever wanted to do "eBike sharing" on self service level? Hmm????
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Re: Security

Post by Modbikemax » Aug 19 2014 9:34am

A rusty old bike is pretty safe and if gets stolen another one is pretty cheap. I see a few chained to railings around the train station. If it's an expensive bike don't leave it out of sight. It's the cost of modern living.

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cal3thousand   1.21 GW

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Re: Security

Post by cal3thousand » Aug 19 2014 11:03am

BT lock is neat idea, but no more secure than another lock. That think looks quite easy to nick due to the 90 bends. There's a reason U locks aren't squared off at the end and it isn't just ease of manufacturing. :wink:
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Re: Security

Post by Wrecker Magoo » Dec 14 2014 11:34am

This is the kind of thing I was looking at for a stealthy (in plain sight) gps system.
Just in case anyone else is interested...

Image

link to amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/XCSOURCE%C2%AE-Mo ... e+tracking

there are many other similar ones also, with and without remote etc..

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Re: Security

Post by xenodius » Dec 15 2014 1:25am

That's actually really cheap, and with a remote too! I paid a bit more for my Geogram One. Although it really does have excellent signal quality, and is easy to wire into my battery pack and program for extra functions. Plus, it can be activated by vibrations. HANDS OFF. =)

I have yet to get an app that lets me send canned text messages with a single shortcut on my phone, so I can more easily use it as a remote-- but that's just laziness.

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Re: Security

Post by alsmith » Dec 16 2014 2:06pm

Why do these things rarely include 2 keys, they're not expensive.

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Re: Security

Post by danielrlee » Dec 16 2014 6:06pm

Designed for use on EVs of up to 80v, I can personally recommend the GPS303E:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00QBJ45Q ... SX200_QL40

I've been running it for a few months and it really takes away that feeling of anxiousness when I leave my bike locked up out of sight. Also comes with two remotes.
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Wrecker Magoo   10 mW

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Re: Security

Post by Wrecker Magoo » Dec 17 2014 7:34pm

That one looks good :D

I still prefer something that doesn't look like a gps, so thieves can't just find it and cut the cord.. as easily...

But. The fact that it works up to 80 volts is great! and it looks like it has some other ebike specific functions too.

17.Sleep Mode by time ,by shock sensor
20.Lock motor automatically
24.Deep sleep by shock sensor, Scheduled wake-up

those sound like handy features. I wonder how it can lock motor automatically?? idk but if it works that sounds really handy, especially with a remote. and deep sleep by shock sensor too. almost sounds more like an alarm system for your bike

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lester12483   10 kW

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Re: Security

Post by lester12483 » Dec 17 2014 7:44pm

I have used 2 kryptonite U locks for my ebike and it has not failed. Even in downtown Chicago where bike thefts are very common.

I also recommend to build your ebike to blend in with other ebikes. Make it clean looking, with no bright colors or wires sticking out.

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Re: Security

Post by 999zip999 » Dec 17 2014 8:15pm

Make it look homeless. Don't park it same time same place everyday like school or work. I like gps and alam, but 150usd.

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Re: Security

Post by crea2k » Dec 18 2014 4:24am

That bluetooth one is ok until the battery dies and you cant unlock it lol

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Re: Security

Post by crea2k » Dec 18 2014 4:26am

I use one of these as well as a cable lock, its a motion alarm, so move the bike and it screams its head off http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycle-Sc ... 5656fb00bf

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Re: Security

Post by danielrlee » Dec 19 2014 4:19am

Wrecker Magoo wrote:That one looks good :D

I still prefer something that doesn't look like a gps, so thieves can't just find it and cut the cord.. as easily...

But. The fact that it works up to 80 volts is great! and it looks like it has some other ebike specific functions too.

17.Sleep Mode by time ,by shock sensor
20.Lock motor automatically
24.Deep sleep by shock sensor, Scheduled wake-up

those sound like handy features. I wonder how it can lock motor automatically?? idk but if it works that sounds really handy, especially with a remote. and deep sleep by shock sensor too. almost sounds more like an alarm system for your bike
It is good.

I had the same concern about simply disconnecting the power, but my install prevents gaining easy access and requires removal of one battery bag from the frame and the batteries from my triangle bag before they even get to the GPS unit. Even if external power is cut, there is an internal battery that cannot be disconnected without opening the case via six small screws at the rear. All the while, this movement would trigger a notification on my phone, so I'd have a good advance warning.

I don't actually have an audible alarm connected, but if you chose to, you can enable a silent mode that doesn't activate the alarm, but still triggers a GSM notification.

There is functionality to lock the motor automatically, but in practice it just doesn't make sense since I can't see why I'd walk away from the bike still powered. Instead, I've chosen to control the ignition supply to the controller via the key fob, like a remote start.

EDIT: I'm using the GPS unit on a bike with a geared motor. Thinking about the automatic motor lock, if you run a direct drive motor and use a controller with a motor lock function (joins phases) this should be possible. I think that one of the pins on the harness shorts to ground when the shock sensor is enabled and triggered.
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Re: Security

Post by TheBeastie » Dec 19 2014 5:15am

Came across this today. Its a vibration alarm. If your bike vibrates a little too much (like some one trying to steal your bike or try and pull bits off) it sounds off a loud alarm. Activation/Deactivation is wireless

http://www.dx.com/p/yy-610a-electric-bi ... #.VJP7BAAw
http://aud.dx.com//product/yy-610a-elec ... #.VJP7jAAw
I have the older more basic model of this that wasn't wireless and you instead had to push in a little keycode to activate or deactivate it.

Good thing about this is that some people are likely to believe its some kind of super alarm system that's going to SMS the owner etc so there more likely to stay away just at the sight of it.
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Speed Kills Range, 10mph = 46 miles range, 20mph = 20 miles, 30mph = 8 miles rangehttps://goo.gl/1JNL53
Over Charging Kills ur battery bit.ly/1hzWKl4
Consider PAS as your only throttle https://goo.gl/Kg1F8F
Fuel-Cell is the ultimate battery coupled with 4th-gen Nuclear
https://goo.gl/TcKtHs https://goo.gl/ZhFFot https://goo.gl/gfa215
10 Square Miles of solar panels = 0.12GW average power! https://goo.gl/Ub1S39

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Re: Security

Post by danielrlee » Dec 19 2014 5:31am

TheBeastie wrote:Came across this today. Its a vibration alarm. If your bike vibrates a little too much (like some one trying to steal your bike or try and pull bits off) it sounds off a loud alarm. Activation/Deactivation is wireless

http://www.dx.com/p/yy-610a-electric-bi ... #.VJP7BAAw
http://aud.dx.com//product/yy-610a-elec ... #.VJP7jAAw
I have the older more basic model of this that wasn't wireless and you instead had to push in a little keycode to activate or deactivate it.

Good thing about this is that some people are likely to believe its some kind of super alarm system that's going to SMS the owner etc so there more likely to stay away just at the sight of it.
I had the old one without a remote and I thought it was pretty shit. The alarm wasn't very loud and it only lasted a couple of months before it failed. It was okay for popping into a shop while the alarm is within earshot, but useless for much else.

I am of the opinion that an audible alarm is counter-productive if you cannot hear it. The thief can use it as an 'owner proximity sensor'. If nobody comes running after the first alarm, they can be pretty sure the coast is clear to continue. The value in an effective system is in the remote notification ability.
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