Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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Dauntless   100 GW

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Dauntless » Jun 06 2014 11:37am

Just one thing I think is about guaranteed. The bad guy will always be irate when caught.
Joseph C. wrote:
Danschutz wrote:Back a hundred years ago when I rode motorcycles...
Just how old are you, Danschutz? :lol:
Here's a picture of him BEFORE he discovered motorcycles.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by The fingers » Jun 06 2014 11:49am

Our prayers go up for the family and friends of the victim. :cry:
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Danschutz » Jun 06 2014 6:19pm

Dauntless wrote:Just one thing I think is about guaranteed. The bad guy will always be irate when caught.
Joseph C. wrote:
Danschutz wrote:Back a hundred years ago when I rode motorcycles...
Just how old are you, Danschutz? :lol:
Here's a picture of him BEFORE he discovered motorcycles.
Something like that.....

Whenever bicycle safety issues rise up in town I think the one thing we can do as cyclist is to obey the rules of the road this seems to be a hot topic with car drivers. I'll admit I run a lot of stop signs and don't use my signals much Unless Im around cars. I don't weave in and out of traffic and generally take side streets and paths.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Danschutz » Jun 06 2014 6:20pm

The fingers wrote:Our prayers go up for the family and friends of the victim. :cry:
Indeed Sir.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by dnmun » Jun 07 2014 1:49am

fat car drivers are always using this supposed lack of responsibility in following 'rules of the road' like coming to a dead stop at every stop sign to argue that bicyclists are reckless.

it is so impossible for car drivers to understand that when you do not have a big fat cocoon of steel around you, then you are much more aware of oncoming traffic or other risks.

they live in air conditioned oblivion in their radio blasting, cell phone texting, back seat babies watching, and fighting with their partner in the car and arguing with each other while driving, car.

but people on bicycles are the ones they say are reckless because they can see when there is not traffic before they reach the stop sign.

whereas a dufous in the car has no clue because they don't feel like they even have to pay attention because their car is a safe place to be even if they do run into something, or over someone.

then they say it was an accident. the bicyclist pulled out in front of them, "rode under the back wheels of the trailer when i was turning, officer", "never stopped at the sign officer", "it is the bicyclist's fault officer. but he's dead. so there is no need to arrest me for homicide, officer!"

"you are right sir, we never arrest drivers for running over bicyclists, they are always violating stop signs".
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Offroader » Jun 07 2014 11:18pm

I got doored traveling at like 25+MPH, my chest shoulder slammed into the glass and I didn't fly over the door.

The guy swung the door wide open as fast as you can, never had a chance. He wanted to fight me because I hit his door and didn't want to bother with this police.

I should have told him we can get the police, I'll pay $300 dollars to fix your door and then you pay me $10,000 for medical to fix my shoulder. I wasn't really hurt but it did hurt like hell, and I couldn't lift my arm above my head for a week afterwards.

After this incident I don't mess around near doors anymore, I just use my bike like a motorcycle. I slow up now if I have to pass doors, like when riding past cars stopped at a red light. I'd much rather be doored at 15-20MPH then 25+ MPH.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by mlt34 » Jun 08 2014 1:13am

If ever in a dooring, my biggest fear isn't hitting the way you hit (fairly flat against the fully opened door), but rather I'm afraid of getting impaled on the sharp corner of the partially opened door. 26" wheels and a decently upright riding stance seem to put my center of mass right where that top corner of the window/door is. I feel like pooping out a hole in my side into a plastic bag for the rest of my life because my intestines got speared through my back just isn't really living anymore.

That's what keeps me up at night. and spiders.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by jateureka » Jun 11 2014 8:39pm

There is a 3 page article in the June - July edition of Ride On magazine starting on page 40 about the youtube dooring incident and the road rules and rights of riders who are doored.
The a*hole that exited the taxi in the video and doored the female cyclist was fined some where around $352.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by dingoEsride » Jun 11 2014 9:04pm

jateureka wrote:There is a 3 page article in the June - July edition of Ride On magazine starting on page 40 about the youtube dooring incident and the road rules and rights of riders who are doored.
The a*hole that exited the taxi in the video and doored the female cyclist was fined some where around $352.
Just looked it up, they have no care at all about the bikes, you pass a bike then stop then open your door without a glance over your shoulder, good on her for being persistant



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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by MikeFairbanks » Jun 11 2014 9:07pm

I don't think the driver of the car should go to prison for this, but he does owe the rest of his life to the cyclist's family (in terms of financial help--if he was completely responsible).

We all make mistakes, and all of us at some point could accidentally take a life without any intention. In fact, it's possible we have. Who knows what chain of events we may have set off at one time or another?

It's just a tragic accident. But it serves to remind me that I need to be more careful when driving.

Also, if the cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet, he's as irresponsible as a driver without a seatbelt. Riding an e-bike (or any bike) without a helmet is just poor decision making.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by lbz5mc12 » Jun 11 2014 9:29pm

When I'm riding past parked cars, I'm always looking for tail lights or into the windows to see if the vehicles are occupied. Even being careful I've had a couple of close calls. Even if I have the right of way at some blind intersections, I still slow down.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Ch00paKabrA » Jun 11 2014 9:34pm

zener wrote:The law is clear. It was the car drivers fault.

Yes, Laws are clear. Unfortunately laws don't effect individual outcomes. When I used to ride my R1, the general rule of thumb is that you ride as if you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you. That is generally how I ride my ebike. A bit aggressive and very defensive.

It is tragic what happened though. My sympathies go out to the family of the rider.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Raged » Jun 12 2014 6:01am

people don't look... Drivers/Passengers get out where they think it's convenient.

I've been building my bike for the last few months (http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 91&start=0) and I was doored on Tuesday (2014-06-10) here :

Image

It's a clearly marked bike lane (circled) and I was doored by the passenger of a car waiting at the lights. (I typically look at parked cars) at the point marked X. Pretty much need to make sure you eye both cars on the side of the road as well as cars waiting at the lights...

I'm lucky I flipped over the door and rolled out on the other side (no solid impact), but it could have been 10000x worse.

That said, I've been riding a carbon road bike for the last few years without issue (rain or shine) and this is my first dooring (in an MTB). We'll see if he will actually stump up the $100 to fix my bike and pay for another helmet.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by dogman dan » Jun 12 2014 6:52am

So, you will never ride in that area again? I won't.

Thing about ebikes, many of us may be traveling too fast to really check each non moving car we ever pass. But if you are just doing 10 mph passing the line of cars at a light, getting doored won't kill you. They'll pop a door to toss a cig or dump coffee, and still get you, so do that slow. Lane splitting a row of cars at high speed is just dumb.

I am just saying, don't be going 20mph or more in that get doored zone.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Raged » Jun 12 2014 7:20am

Yeah I was slowing down for the red light.... didn't have to be my ebike... could have been my carbon roadie and the result would have been the same. Just pure carelessness.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by zener » Jun 12 2014 7:34am

An answere would be disallowing cab's with these frocking doors. (or better all cars LOL get rid of the shit 2nd door and make one which not swings)
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by mlt34 » Jun 12 2014 7:39am

I guess we are lucky that Deloreans never really caught on, or we would have combined dooring and clotheslining into one horrifying experience…
double ouch.png
Are you planning your first electric bicycle conversion? I wrote a book that teaches beginners everything they need to know about building their own ebike.
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I also write for EbikeSchool.com, a site that does mainly how-to style articles and other informational write-ups. Check out our youtube channel for great how-to battery building videos.
Lastly, I run www.Vruzend.com, which sells solderless 18650 battery kits, 18650 cells, li-ion chargers, BMSs and more!

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Ykick » Jun 12 2014 8:28am

mlt34 wrote:I guess we are lucky that Deloreans never really caught on, or we would have combined dooring and clotheslining into one horrifying experience…
It would appear Tesla Model X will be able to accomplish either type of dooring -
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Sunder » Jun 12 2014 8:37am

Raged wrote:people don't look... Drivers/Passengers get out where they think it's convenient.

I've been building my bike for the last few months (http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 91&start=0) and I was doored on Tuesday (2014-06-10) here :

Image

It's a clearly marked bike lane (circled) and I was doored by the passenger of a car waiting at the lights.
Sorry to hear about that mate. Hope the passenger is honourable about his/her responsibilities.

That said, if the laws are the same in Vic as in NSW, that area is not an official bike lane - it's a bicycle awareness zone, which is only there to make drivers and passengers aware of bicycles commonly using that road. You have NO obligation to use that lane and can ride in any lane you need to īn order to feel safe (Time after time, magistrates rulings have always allowed the rider to define for themselves "as close as practical to the left" as long as they give any reason whatsoever for not being further left.)

Anyways, hope you heal up fast.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Architectonic » Jun 13 2014 9:53am

MikeFairbanks wrote:Also, if the cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet, he's as irresponsible as a driver without a seatbelt. Riding an e-bike (or any bike) without a helmet is just poor decision making.
Bicycle helmets are not some sort of panacea and don't actually absorb that much energy. You will often have almost as bad head injuries wearing a helmet as without if you are involved in a serious collision >40km/h or so. And that is if the top of your head hits the vehicle. The sides and front offer almost no protection at all anyway.

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by mlt34 » Jun 13 2014 10:25am

Architectonic wrote:
MikeFairbanks wrote:Also, if the cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet, he's as irresponsible as a driver without a seatbelt. Riding an e-bike (or any bike) without a helmet is just poor decision making.
Bicycle helmets are not some sort of panacea and don't actually absorb that much energy. You will often have almost as bad head injuries wearing a helmet as without if you are involved in a serious collision >40km/h or so. And that is if the top of your head hits the vehicle. The sides and front offer almost no protection at all anyway.
That's why it is up to us, an ebike riders, to understand that we are asking more of our bikes than they were originally intended for (most casual bike riders aren't trucking along at a continuous >40km/h or so). I used to wear a full face helmet when I started getting into ebikes. I was young and stupid and it saved me a number of times. Now I'm slightly less young and slightly less stupid, and mostly just wear a regular bicycle helmet, though I understand that at my top speeds it isn't going to work as well as it is designed to work.

Either way, people can bitch about bicycle helmets not being 'as good as people say' or some crap like that, but at the end of the day, statistics show that you are much less likely to have head/brain trauma when wearing a bicycle helmet versus using your hair as a helmet.
Are you planning your first electric bicycle conversion? I wrote a book that teaches beginners everything they need to know about building their own ebike.
Then I wrote the book (literally) on building custom lithium batteries.
I also write for EbikeSchool.com, a site that does mainly how-to style articles and other informational write-ups. Check out our youtube channel for great how-to battery building videos.
Lastly, I run www.Vruzend.com, which sells solderless 18650 battery kits, 18650 cells, li-ion chargers, BMSs and more!

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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by docnjoj » Jun 13 2014 11:19am

Having cared for ER bike victims and been one myself, the cracks in the helmets suggest that they hit the ground hard. While this is certainly not empirical one of those cracks was in my helmet when I was flipped off my trike (rear wheel lockup) at about 20mph. 6 broken ribs but no discernible head injuries by the ER physician test for concussion. One bike accident victim arrived DOA with massive head injuries, no helmet said the paramedic who wheeled him in. Any helmet is better than none.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by Supertux1 » Jun 13 2014 11:26am

Here we have bicycle lanes that double as parking lanes (annoying as hell) and when a car is parked you have about two feet between the door and the next lane on the road. Less if the driver is a tard and doesn't know how to park.

If I see a driver's or passenger's head through the rear window I slow way down and will wait for cars to pass before taking the lane.

At electric bike speeds, you can't be sticking your head back all the time to look for cars, it hurts the neck, affects your steering and takes your attention off stuff ahead.

I use a mirror like this one to help facilitate lane changes: http://www.amazon.com/Mirrycle-MTB-Moun ... ref=sr_1_1
(This is my third one, I have smashed the other two by letting the bike fall over on uneven ground. Grr..)

I don't believe it is legal to lane split in most areas, trying to hug the curb or get around tightly packed cars like in that video is a recipe for disaster.
I'm not so worried about cars in close curb riding, but all the crap that accumulates next to it, like old construction materials, garbage, bottles and car parts.
Or the occasional sewer grate that grabs your tire.

So when there isn't a distinct bike lane I will sometimes take the whole lane and sit in traffic, while contemplating another route. Yes, the drivers of the cars behind you looked pissed when they first roll up, and some honk, but a middle finger and a quick throttle jab on the green is all it takes to shut them up.

There are also bike friendly intersections which have green space in between where the cars are supposed to stop and where the pedestrians cross, you can roll past stopped cars, get in front of them and be the first to go through lights. This is especially useful if you have something that can accelerate faster than cars. :)


When all else fails, pedaling slowly on the sidewalk is an option (it is legal here on SOME kinds of sidewalks but not all), especially when construction messes with your lane. I have done that a few times, and as long as you have a good reason for riding on the sidewalk the authorities won't bother you. Not wanting to get killed/doored by cars and/or construction is a perfectly good reason.
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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by cal3thousand » Jun 13 2014 11:28am

Architectonic wrote:
MikeFairbanks wrote:Also, if the cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet, he's as irresponsible as a driver without a seatbelt. Riding an e-bike (or any bike) without a helmet is just poor decision making.
Bicycle helmets are not some sort of panacea and don't actually absorb that much energy. You will often have almost as bad head injuries wearing a helmet as without if you are involved in a serious collision >40km/h or so. And that is if the top of your head hits the vehicle. The sides and front offer almost no protection at all anyway.
Sure!!! and football players should just go back to wearing leather caps, because that's safer and they would be more likely to avoid head-on collisions in that case :roll:


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Re: Electric Bike Rider Dies After Dooring

Post by arkmundi » Jun 13 2014 11:53am

dogman wrote:The really cool thing about ebikes, is that you can take a safer route miles out of your way with ease. I do the same thing all the time in cars too.
Ditto that! I know my exact route for every trip I take. If I'm going some place new, I'll use google map to route it. There are bike routes highlighted for many areas, a very niffty feature. I use routes through parks & green areas as much as possible, where cars can't go. I also use sidewalks, parking lots, dirt, etc., a lot. And I avoid heavily traffic'd roads if at all possible. And yes, even considering, situational awareness if very necessary to be safe, not just for yourself but everyone else you're sharing the road with. Best.

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