cell_man
100 kW
Hi Guys,
I don't post on ES too much in recent times, but recently I saw a video and I had to come on here and put something out there. I'm not gonna name names, I'll let someone else figure that out.
It would seem by hearing certain companies speak, that they virtually invented the Bafang BBS02 kit and that their re-branded Bafang kit is significantly superior, in many ways to what all the other plebs are selling. Also, they invented the BBS02 extended BB, despite the fact Doug at http://www.california-ebike.com has been converting and selling these for well over a year and everyone that came after, blatantly ripped off his methods and design. Now the same people are supposedly going to be the only company that offer higher grade mosfets in the BBS02 and only they will be offering this, starting in August 2015.
Regarding certain re-branded kits, does anyone really believe that Bafang will supply a superior product to 1 buyer, but sell second rate products to others? Why would they possibly do that and risk comebacks from the vast majority of their customers? It is a pretty simple detail to add additional connectors to the loom, or make small changes, but basic fundamental stuff, i do not think so. Let me tell you something about the BBS02, there have been many changes made and they continue to be made. However, when those improvements are made, they are made at 1 time and everything with a later build date will almost certainly be the same later version. Bafang do not have versions, 1, 2, 3 and 4, only saving the later versions for those extra special customers. I am so tired of hearing all this misinformation about special versions this and that. If the build date is recent, it will almost certainly have all the latest versions of everything. There is a limited amount that can be done with the Controllerst software to change the basic software parameters. Yes it can affect how the kit reacts, but I am sorry, it has really been overstated by some, how making a few tweaks here and there is going to make really significant changes.
Now specifically regarding the new version Mosfets that only the re-braned Bafang kits will start to exclusively supply, starting August 2015. We buy a reasonable quantity of BBS02 and I was telling Bafang for over 1 year to try better fets in their controllers, even after they changed to 9 fets, things were not significantly improved. I suggested Bafang use the same IRFB3077 mosfets we use in our Infineon controllers and which are known by many to be a very good 75V mosfet. In late May 2015, we supplied 1000pcs of free issue IRFB3077 after Bafang agreed to try some controllers for us, built with these 3077 fets, just for us. Since then all our 48V 750W BBS02 kits and controllers have used genuine IRFB3077 fets in their construction. This can be proved by a simple fact, you do not have to take my word for it. These new version controllers that only EM3ev have been supplying since June, have a model number ending 206.1 (see the additional info copied below, this info is not valid for controllers supplied after the date of this post). The standard 48V 25A BBS02 controller ends 206. Bafang (unsurprisingly) found the new fets did help the controller run cooler and they were so happy with the results that they almost immediately decided to fit these same fets in all the future production, despite a significant additional cost, but they are a big Company and it has taken a little while to happen. I was asked not to publicize that we were using non-standard controllers and we respected that wish, i only told some trusted business customers of ours. I was a little unhappy that bafang decided to use the same fets for all their production, but not all surprised. We didn't get any refund for the fets we didn't use, each set of 9 fets cost us around 15USD per controller/kit, that was never added to the cost of the kits we sold. Bafang are in the process of changing all their 48V 25A controllers to use these 3077 fets, and i expect that any controllers built around this date or soon after, will use the 3077 fets. i am quite sure the number system applied to our Controllers will also be applied to future production, so look for the 206.1 and that should mean it has better quality fets.
Suppliers should keep it real IMPO. If you are a good local supplier, you have good service, you deal with the problems, people find your prices acceptable, you take a part from here, add it there, change things around a little. Well that is already cool, you are doing cool stuff, great. Why do people feel the need to stretch the truth, or try to spin everything so much, or just tell blatant lies. It is a shame that some of the more popular US resellers are so prone to this kind of activity. There is reasonable marketing and there is BS.
Peace
Paul, AKA Cell man
Edit:
the serial number info, is not as i stated above, the current info is this. The above info, is only the situation for those first controller we received, that were fitted with the 3077 fets, as supplied by us:
Here is a new controller fitted with 3077 fets (K5NCR0F0206, which were generally released around Aug. 2015):
Here is an older controller (pre 3077, K5ECR0F0206, Mar 2015 build date):
I don't post on ES too much in recent times, but recently I saw a video and I had to come on here and put something out there. I'm not gonna name names, I'll let someone else figure that out.
It would seem by hearing certain companies speak, that they virtually invented the Bafang BBS02 kit and that their re-branded Bafang kit is significantly superior, in many ways to what all the other plebs are selling. Also, they invented the BBS02 extended BB, despite the fact Doug at http://www.california-ebike.com has been converting and selling these for well over a year and everyone that came after, blatantly ripped off his methods and design. Now the same people are supposedly going to be the only company that offer higher grade mosfets in the BBS02 and only they will be offering this, starting in August 2015.
Regarding certain re-branded kits, does anyone really believe that Bafang will supply a superior product to 1 buyer, but sell second rate products to others? Why would they possibly do that and risk comebacks from the vast majority of their customers? It is a pretty simple detail to add additional connectors to the loom, or make small changes, but basic fundamental stuff, i do not think so. Let me tell you something about the BBS02, there have been many changes made and they continue to be made. However, when those improvements are made, they are made at 1 time and everything with a later build date will almost certainly be the same later version. Bafang do not have versions, 1, 2, 3 and 4, only saving the later versions for those extra special customers. I am so tired of hearing all this misinformation about special versions this and that. If the build date is recent, it will almost certainly have all the latest versions of everything. There is a limited amount that can be done with the Controllerst software to change the basic software parameters. Yes it can affect how the kit reacts, but I am sorry, it has really been overstated by some, how making a few tweaks here and there is going to make really significant changes.
Now specifically regarding the new version Mosfets that only the re-braned Bafang kits will start to exclusively supply, starting August 2015. We buy a reasonable quantity of BBS02 and I was telling Bafang for over 1 year to try better fets in their controllers, even after they changed to 9 fets, things were not significantly improved. I suggested Bafang use the same IRFB3077 mosfets we use in our Infineon controllers and which are known by many to be a very good 75V mosfet. In late May 2015, we supplied 1000pcs of free issue IRFB3077 after Bafang agreed to try some controllers for us, built with these 3077 fets, just for us. Since then all our 48V 750W BBS02 kits and controllers have used genuine IRFB3077 fets in their construction. This can be proved by a simple fact, you do not have to take my word for it. These new version controllers that only EM3ev have been supplying since June, have a model number ending 206.1 (see the additional info copied below, this info is not valid for controllers supplied after the date of this post). The standard 48V 25A BBS02 controller ends 206. Bafang (unsurprisingly) found the new fets did help the controller run cooler and they were so happy with the results that they almost immediately decided to fit these same fets in all the future production, despite a significant additional cost, but they are a big Company and it has taken a little while to happen. I was asked not to publicize that we were using non-standard controllers and we respected that wish, i only told some trusted business customers of ours. I was a little unhappy that bafang decided to use the same fets for all their production, but not all surprised. We didn't get any refund for the fets we didn't use, each set of 9 fets cost us around 15USD per controller/kit, that was never added to the cost of the kits we sold. Bafang are in the process of changing all their 48V 25A controllers to use these 3077 fets, and i expect that any controllers built around this date or soon after, will use the 3077 fets. i am quite sure the number system applied to our Controllers will also be applied to future production, so look for the 206.1 and that should mean it has better quality fets.
Suppliers should keep it real IMPO. If you are a good local supplier, you have good service, you deal with the problems, people find your prices acceptable, you take a part from here, add it there, change things around a little. Well that is already cool, you are doing cool stuff, great. Why do people feel the need to stretch the truth, or try to spin everything so much, or just tell blatant lies. It is a shame that some of the more popular US resellers are so prone to this kind of activity. There is reasonable marketing and there is BS.
Peace
Paul, AKA Cell man
Edit:
the serial number info, is not as i stated above, the current info is this. The above info, is only the situation for those first controller we received, that were fitted with the 3077 fets, as supplied by us:
Here is a new controller fitted with 3077 fets (K5NCR0F0206, which were generally released around Aug. 2015):
Here is an older controller (pre 3077, K5ECR0F0206, Mar 2015 build date):