Doctorbass 2WD ADAPTTO / NYX / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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Doctorbass   100 GW

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 19 2015 10:50pm

adam333 wrote:Nice project Doc =)

I am surprised that you want to attempt hi speed with such a low voltage though.

I will follow your developments.

Well, It will be configured for more quick acceleration than top speed. but top speed should be in the 125 130km/h minimum. To get a decent 1/8 mile time it will need to be both quick and fast.

I might test the new Adaptto MAX-E 14kW nominal on this ebike. this could reach up to 40kW .. but it will require NO2 for the motor lol

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 20 2015 12:10am

FRONT WHEEL MOTOR FINISHED and INSTALLED! :mrgreen:

Wasn't so easy! but finally acheived! I had to drill every single eyeslet and file them to fit the 12 gauge nipples.

Next task: true the wheel and have proper spoke tension and then finally Install front motor MAX-E controller and wiring to the motor and battery and rear wheel drive MAX-E communication link!

I will also have to proceed to the rear MXUS motor wheel. Actually it'S the 5403 still installed on the bike.
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Last edited by Doctorbass on Aug 20 2015 12:16am, edited 1 time in total.
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Stielz   100 W

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Stielz » Aug 20 2015 12:16am

What a awesome machine!

Is the second max-e going inside the battery space?

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 20 2015 12:19am

Stielz wrote:What a awesome machine!

Is the second max-e going inside the battery space?
Well not sure yet i might mount it vertically on the fornt of the fork below the LED lamp for better cooling and shorten the phase wires to the maximum.

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 20 2015 12:52am

Looking good Doc!
Doctorbass wrote:FRONT WHEEL MOTOR FINISHED and INSTALLED! :mrgreen:
Is that offset to the side going to be ok?
I mean, will it track straight with the front not centred?
You could always go with a bigger front disk (maybe 250mm) if you wanted to space the disk away from the hub less.

You should also investigate using a disk side impellor to draw air into the holes near the axle.

Cheers
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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by macribs » Aug 20 2015 2:24am

Doctorbass wrote:
adam333 wrote:Nice project Doc =)

I am surprised that you want to attempt hi speed with such a low voltage though.

I will follow your developments.

Well, It will be configured for more quick acceleration than top speed. but top speed should be in the 125 130km/h minimum. To get a decent 1/8 mile time it will need to be both quick and fast.

I might test the new Adaptto MAX-E 14kW nominal on this ebike. this could reach up to 40kW .. but it will require NO2 for the motor lol

Doc
You could do water cooling first, and then if you need more do a "reversed RIMS" cooling for the motors. Rather then having a Recirculating Infusion Mash System (term used in beer brewing to describe inline heating) you could use maybe copper tubing coil around the cooling line from the radiator and towards the motor inlet. That way your cooling fluid would be super chilled before entering the motor. The cooling of copper or chill plate could be ie a large peltier element along with dry ice, liquid gas or any other way you can dream up to rapidly super cool the motor cooling inlet line.

The thing is that you will only need maximum heat removal capacity for 12 seconds or less on the drag strip or a little longer if you get battery capacity to do a 1/4 mile race. But you could have the motor pre cooled before the run from you cooling loop, you could chill it below zero degrees C as long as you have alcohol based liquid coolant. And even during the 1/8 mile run you would poor ice cold chilled water into you motor inlets.
Last edited by macribs on Aug 20 2015 7:02am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by madin88 » Aug 20 2015 4:12am

Doctorbass wrote: Well, It will be configured for more quick acceleration than top speed. but top speed should be in the 125 130km/h minimum. To get a decent 1/8 mile time it will need to be both quick and fast.

I might test the new Adaptto MAX-E 14kW nominal on this ebike. this could reach up to 40kW .. but it will require NO2 for the motor lol

Doc
do you know whats the difference between 14kW and 10kW Max-E?
i wonder if it's only a different software or if Adaptto also did some improvements on the powerstage -> like we both did :)

Some time ago i have built a FAT bike first with only one MAC on the rear and later with a second on the front. Even with higher current settings after the 2WD conversion the motors did not get as hot as the single rear MAC did. I think the same thing happens in your case: about half the load (or something like 60 rear : 40 front) on each motor during acceleratin, faster acceleration means the time the motors sees large phase currents is shorter, double the mass to suck the heat and so on..
I believe a simulation in ebikes.ca simulator with about half the total vehicle mass should come close to what you get in real.
With only 1p of this crazy LiPos i think the battery will be empty before the motors starting to overheat :)
- 10kW belt drive with Neumotor 8057: [url]viewtopic.php?
- KTM Hardtail Pedelec / eZee V2 6T / 27,5" / Kelly KBSX @ 1,5kW / Torque PAS / CA-V3 / 13s4p Sanyo GA in Shark case

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by fechter » Aug 21 2015 6:57pm

Most drag bikes have a hard time keeping the front wheel on the ground. Less weight on the front will make it prone to losing traction. You might consider doing something with the saddle to allow shifting your weight as far forward as possible.
"One test is worth a thousand opinions"

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by madin88 » Aug 22 2015 9:25am

I wonder what happens if you put >100A regen into these Lipos. That would be over 20C CHARGE rate :mrgreen:
- 10kW belt drive with Neumotor 8057: [url]viewtopic.php?
- KTM Hardtail Pedelec / eZee V2 6T / 27,5" / Kelly KBSX @ 1,5kW / Torque PAS / CA-V3 / 13s4p Sanyo GA in Shark case

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Allex » Aug 24 2015 5:30pm

Oh look it's a bike with front drum brakes :mrgreen:

Nicely done, very good craftsmanship!

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by gone_walkabouts » Aug 28 2015 8:35am

looking forward to getting the perforance stats on this one !!

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 29 2015 11:33am

Alot of work now to prepare the 2WD bike to be on time for the Interbike 2015!

Rear MXUS motor:
- Upgrade phase wires + install proper high amp connector and hall connector CHECK
- Modify the holes in the cover
- Drill and file every single eyeslet of the Doubletrack 24 rim
- Install the 12 gauge spokes and true the wheel
- Build the dual Adaptto controller high power harness with dual seperate 160A 150V DC breaker.
- Upgrade to the new Adaptto controller for the 14kW cont 20kW burst version. :twisted:
- reinforce the CF frame where the head tube is to support the high thrust of the front fork
- replace both tube and tires.
- program and test/tune the 2WD.
- adjust total battery current to not make the Farasis cells to suffer too much until the 150C drag racing pack is ready!
- Make sure everything is "safe" :twisted:

Once i will be back from Las Vegas i will a build the 20s2p 9Ah drag racing pack for total power availlable of 80kW burst with minimal voltage sag at 35-40kW.

Doc
Last edited by Doctorbass on Aug 30 2015 1:03pm, edited 1 time in total.
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by wojtek » Aug 29 2015 11:47am

great project!!! Thumbs up :)
WIRES AND CONNECTORS
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/vi ... 31&t=30176
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 31&t=32244

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by macribs » Aug 29 2015 12:10pm

Wow less the 3 weeks Doc. I really hope you manage to get the bike properly assembled and tested ahead of interbike.
You should really consider showing off you dragrace on 2 wd on a big screen on interbike. I am sure jaws will drop :)

Will your bike be on the NYX stand?

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 29 2015 12:13pm

Doc, will your bike be at any particular booth?

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 29 2015 1:13pm

spinningmagnets wrote:Doc, will your bike be at any particular booth?
Adaptto and NYX boot are at the same booth :wink:

It will be really difficult to show a drag race on video BEFORE the interbike as the bike have to be shipped like in about a week!! :shock: :shock: i have to do everything during this week + my normal day work, taking care of my wife, give the dog 2 walk a day and managing our new kitchen reconstruction and continu shipping makita battery!! :lol:

a week have 168hours right?? :lol:

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by macribs » Aug 29 2015 1:25pm

Yeah what I pictured was a big screen beside you bike on the booth at Interbike, showing the drag race.
But I understand, time is an issue to complete the build and to make the shipping in time.
Anyway enjoy interbike - cool that you get your hands on the new max-e v2.

Bad ass booth Adaptto and Nyx together. Two outstanding companies both on the cutting edge.

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 30 2015 1:02pm

OK phase wires upgrade on the rear motor is finished!

I used my favorite method to join the phase wire and the strands together using copper pipe crimp and solder and sealed shring to avoid the solder to leak when overpower make it melt !! :twisted:

I took the 12 gauge teflon wire from my 5403 to upgrade the 14-16 original wire gauge and will only use it for a short lenght then it will be joined to 8 AWG and XT150 connectors for the adaptto.

btw i also measured directly at the winding terminal ( no wire) the resistance phase to phase and i got:

Green-Blue: 55.2miliohms
Blue-Yellow: 55.2 miliohms
Yellow-Green: 55.3 miliohm.

Barent from Kinaye motorsport sent me the spec sheet witch indicate 0.060ohm witch is close but probably is including the resistance of the 14 gauge wire harness.

I used my 0-100A regulated power supply to supply a constant current of 10A to not heat too much the winding and false the result, and my DVM to get the voltage.

I also measured the inductance and got

Green-Blue: 161 uHenry
Blue-Yellow: 160 uHenry
Yellow-Green: 163 uHenry

this indicate me that the winding appear to not be damaged and all 20 strands per phase are conducting :D

Doc
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CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Stielz » Aug 30 2015 4:06pm

Looks good!

It would be cool to see a direct comparison between the clyte 5403 and the mxus. Although I assume the speed constant are too different to get a fair comparison?

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 30 2015 5:29pm

Stielz wrote:Looks good!

It would be cool to see a direct comparison between the clyte 5403 and the mxus. Although I assume the speed constant are too different to get a fair comparison?

No worie i also have a 4T mxus witch match the 9kv of the 5403 :wink: i'll do all these test in teh coming weeks!

Doc
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 30 2015 5:36pm

I am in the process of filling all the eyeslet holes of the Doubletrack 24 rim right now to make the 12 gauge nipples to fit inside.... DAMS that's SO LONG !!!! even i have used a drill to remove from 156 to 185mil" i still have to file all the remaining 11 mil" to fit the 196 mil" of the nipple!!! :lol:

I have half holes done now... 18 holes left !!! :?

That's the price to pay to avoid the need of the easy to assemble motorcycle rim and save 7-8 pounds weight !

OLD GREAT DOUBLE TRACK 24 !!!! WITH 39mm wide make very stable tire and strong wheel!

Doc
Attachments
20150830_183829 (Personnalisé).jpg
20150830_183829 (Personnalisé).jpg (110.35 KiB) Viewed 4323 times
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Ohbse » Aug 30 2015 6:27pm

I've done the same thing a number of times doc, it's a real pain the wrist.

Last one I built I ended up mounting a high quality round file intended for chainsaw sharpening in my drill and used both spin and back and forth motion to greatly speed up the filing process. That made a big difference.

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 30 2015 9:30pm

Rear Wheel MXUS+ Doubletrack 24 laced and true!
Attachments
Studio_20150830_223843 (Personnalisé).jpg
Studio_20150830_223843 (Personnalisé).jpg (73.93 KiB) Viewed 4296 times
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by Doctorbass » Aug 30 2015 10:00pm

OK... progressing!

Both motor and wheel done!!

Wheel 99% ready, Need only to install wire harness now.

Doc
Attachments
Studio_20150830_230354 (Personnalisé) (Personnalisé).jpg
Studio_20150830_230354 (Personnalisé) (Personnalisé).jpg (89.18 KiB) Viewed 4318 times
CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
YOUTUBE---https://m.youtube.com/user/Doctorbasss
http://twitter.com/DocbassMelancon
I speak FRENCH and english

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macribs   1.21 GW

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Re: Doctorbass 2WD NYX / Adaptto / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

Post by macribs » Aug 31 2015 1:05am

Doctorbass wrote:
Stielz wrote:Looks good!

It would be cool to see a direct comparison between the clyte 5403 and the mxus. Although I assume the speed constant are too different to get a fair comparison?

No worie i also have a 4T mxus witch match the 9kv of the 5403 :wink: i'll do all these test in teh coming weeks!

Doc
Sweet looking wheels, vented and ready to race. Dang those looks good.

Wonder if you should have that 4T in your rear wheel and a 3T upfront? Most torque on the rear, less likely to break traction up front.
Yet when you need the speed wind from 3T you still have it upfront. I wonder how much peak performance we will see on this thing.

Now that you got Adaptto v2, do you think you could get even more power from using the QS 205 H50 v3 extra motor rather then mxus 3000? Would the extra weight from the QS hold you back? Or maybe contribute to heat removal?

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