My recumbent cargo bike

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Mar 31, 2016 8:52 am

I rode to Farmville again Tuesday. As I got down to Fife, I was passed by an ambulance. I turned left to go the quarter mile to Georges Tavern,

http://www.markerhistory.com/georges-ta ... ker-sa-51/

and saw firemen setting up traffic cones blocking the road. I smelled smoke too. I turned right onto the road to Elk Hill.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Elk_ ... Marker.JPG

to detour around on Rt 6. When I got to Georges Tavern, I could see they had the road blocked off on that end too. I figured it must be a hell of an accident.

Rode the rest of the way to Farmville, enjoyed my lunch at Walker's Diner, and asked about the rail trail that runs right past their place. Turns out it is pretty cool. I rode from the diner the 3 mile to where it crosses the road back home under muscle power. People asked about the comfort of my odd bike, but didn't have a clue it had a motor. Had I known about the really big bridge just 1.8 miles further on, I would have ridden that part too. Next time!

http://www.dcr.virginia.gov/state-parks ... idge-trail

When I got back to Georges Tavern, the road was still blocked five hours later! I stopped and chatted up the firemen and found out a propane truck had rolled in the curve by the fire department, and taken out some poles and transformers.

http://www.wistv.com/story/31592675/dri ... -goochland

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Mar 31, 2016 9:30 am

Someday I am going to note every historical site and marker within a 75 mile radius of us. This place is chock full of history. From the archaeology of the annual Indian potlatch gatherings on Elk Island, the Randolph clan "given" all the Indian land along the James River, hundreds of years of torture and slavery, the Revolution, the Civil War, Rosenwald schools, etc.

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Mar 31, 2016 2:37 pm

I put 1,000 miles on this bike in three weeks, since putting it back together. Yesterday, I charged up my old bike and did the first ride on it in a month. Pretty interesting contrast after all that time. The first word that popped into my mind was "lithe." The Linear is 10 inches shorter, 58 pounds lighter, and a mid-drive with no freewheel for the cranks. I see 250-450 watts all the time, and perhaps 600 watts for an instant at a time. I can change course seemingly with a thought. I actually feel the change in thrust with each pedal stroke. Stopping to pee in the woods, I can lay it down and pick it back up with one hand. I use all 8 gears on every ride, and my speed ranges from 8.5 mph to 40 mph on most rides, like yesterday.

The RANS, by contrast, feels indomitable. Rolling the throttle on (never tried slamming it on) gets me to 32 mph, and 2,800 watts briefly, in about two pedal revolutions. On cruise control, hills and wind cause the speed to vary by a couple mph. I shift between the top three gears between double digit climbs to double digit descents. At 32 mph downhill, the motor starts regenning back to the battery, keeping me to 36+ mph, on 20% grades that the Linear freewheels to 44 mph on. My pedaling has no discernible effect on the speed. Only by looking at the watts readout do I see any effect. I account for about 40 miles on a 150 mile ride.

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 05, 2016 8:41 am

It was 79 F here yesterday. Wife wanted to cut the grass. I rode to the local market for lawnmower gas. This morning it was 34 F and snowed for an hour...big, light flakes that melted on touching down.
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[edit] gas push mower has been replaced with great electric mower, and weed whip, from Greenworks.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =1&t=79384
Last edited by Warren on Jul 15, 2016 8:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 09, 2016 10:25 am

I rode to Farmville again yesterday. When I got to where River Road crosses High Bridge Trail I stopped to talk to the rangers working the booth there. One is a local historian, and has written a book about the history of the bridge. The original bridge was wood, resting on 20 brick pilings. It was a double-decker with the trains running on top, and a pedestrian, and wagon bridge below. Armies of the North and South crossed it several times during the war, and the Confederates tried to destroy it at one point to stop Grant's troops. It was replaced by the current wrought iron bridge during the [Oops! It was 1914] Depression. Bricks from five of the old brick pilings were used to build a shoe factory [It was a tobacco warehouse, before it was a shoe factory] behind Walker's Diner. The ranger told me there was a hiking trail at the other end of the bridge that goes down the bank below the bridge and runs along the river. He suggested I park at the end of the bridge and go down to check out the view. I asked if bikers ride down it. He said the trail down the embankment was very steep and covered in big rocks. He said mountain bikers go down there, but said I probably couldn't get to the bottom in one piece, and if I did, I certainly couldn't get back up. I told him I was sure he was probably right.
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lester12483
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by lester12483 » Apr 09, 2016 5:38 pm

Mean machine!
MT6 Hybrid- Electric Bicycle 48V
48V 23AH AllCell Lithium Manganese Battery Pack
http://www.chicagoelectricbicycles.com

John in CR
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by John in CR » Apr 09, 2016 11:08 pm

For some reason I always get a kick out of getting a can full of gas to help satisfy gasser motor thirst while out on my cargo ebike.

oldwahoo54
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by oldwahoo54 » Apr 10, 2016 11:46 am

We did a ride on the High Bridge Trail last fall, sans motors. There is a little Cafe that we like just down from the bike shop that sits right next to the trail in Farmville. Ice cream, sandwiches, coffee. Hope to hit more of these rails to trails projects in Central Va this summer.

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 10, 2016 1:21 pm

Yes, there are quite a few nice places to eat right where the trail crosses the main street.

14 years ago, when this bike was still a tandem, we did the Virginia Creeper Trail. We went Damascus to White Top Station and back one day, and Damascus to Abingdon and back the next day. The first day was pretty exciting. They coasted clueless tourists, on rental bikes, down from White Top Station while we were climbing up. :-(

On that same trip we also did the New River Trail, and spent the night at an old railroad station, along the trail, that had been converted to an awesome B&B.

http://www.virginia.org/listings/Places ... leStopInn/

And we did Burke's Garden.

http://hshi.net/chanlipscomb/spring07bi ... Garden.jpg

An amazing natural formation. Not a meteor crater, or volcanic crater, it was formed when underground limestone caverns collapsed.

Man...to be that young again.

My two short rides on the High Bridge Trail have been without motor assist, except for crawling back up the bank from the river. I came up that with the throttle switch in the 50% position, to make it most controllable. I picked my way up at 4-5 mph, and hardly disturbed a single rock. Nobody pedaling up that trail could have done that. Electric is way smoother than pedaling. When the hill out our back door is wet, on my old bike with skinny slicks, I can't do it pedaling without slipping and putting a foot down. With the motor, I can crawl right along without losing traction.

On the flat rail trail I stick to my 40 tooth, middle chainring, and the 24 and 32 tooth rear cogs. Spin right along at 8-12 mph. Nobody seems to have a clue it's electric assist. If you ride it like a bike, you are invisible.

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 11, 2016 4:38 pm

Rode to Afton today. Left at 9:45 am, 57 F. Back at 4:40 pm, 76 F. Winds in the teens gusting well into the twenties. A flying trash can day.

126 miles, 5:46.21, 21.8 mph av, 35.2 mph max, 20.3 Wh/mi. Most regen so far, 2.1%, just over 1 Ah. Saw 65.1 C motor temp from regen down the mountain.

Hot dog with cheese and slaw, and hot cocoa for lunch at the best (only) place in Afton.
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Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 13, 2016 1:20 pm

It has been three weeks since my recycling and trash runs. I figured I might be able to do it all in one run, if I didn't wait four weeks this time. I did get it all on there, but the big plastic pots that the wife's plants came in were a challenge. I think two week intervals make the most sense.

Anyway, it is a lovely day, with winds in the single digits, for a change. Leaving the recycling center, I thought I'd ride around a bit, and see how the empty panniers handled in low wind conditions. They seemed just fine pulled in tight to the sides. They might even be improving the aerodynamics. I'd gone 13 miles, when I started thinking about Chalo's latest dump of misinformation about recumbents. He is a fine mechanic, but knows less than nothing about recumbents, based on one ride on a Bike-E. Now the Bike-E was one of my least favorite recumbents, even though our ten year old daughter had no trouble riding one around a bike shop parking lot.

When I pulled up to a stop sign, I thought I would try riding no-hands. This is one of those things that people who have never ridden more than a mile on one will tell you is impossible on a recumbent. Some people have more trouble riding them than others. I remember a kid I worked with in the bike shop. He could pull a wheelie on a Giant DH and ride it the length of the block. We had gotten in some Sun recumbents from J&B. After I put a short wheelbase together, the kid said he wanted to try it out. I went into my spiel about how you need to counter steer, and how it might seem odd at first. He rolled his eyes, got on, and immediately did a track stand, then proceeded to ride it around the displays, no-hands.

I took off from the stop sign, set the cruise control, and proceeded to ride the last ten miles home no-hands, up and down hills, around curves, even over a bit of gravel I only touched the bars to shift, to stop at one more stop sign, and when the state trooper went by the other way. Then I rode one-hand, while smiling and waving in my most obsequious manner.

23.1 miles, 1:04.58, 21.3 av, 31.7 max, 18.1 Wh/mi

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 13, 2016 6:00 pm

OK. Anything for the advancement of science, right? :-)

I just got back from a 40 mile ride, essentially all no-hands. I found that at 14 mph the front has a slow weave from side to side. Disconcerting, but it doesn't get worse, unless you try to get ahead of it. PIO, pilot induced oscillation. But at 20 mph and above it is rock solid. At 33.8 mph down hill, over a small bridge, it is on rails! I can hold my windbreaker down with one hand, while I zip the side pocket open with the other hand. I can pump my legs, pushing on my knees with my hands, for miles. I can take my phone out of my pocket, and take a picture of the CA at 21 mph, and put it back in my pocket. And if I forget to zip it back up, it falls in the road. I get to jump off, run back, and flag cars around it, until I pick up the cover, battery and phone. :-(
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Who needs Tesla's autopilot?

oldwahoo54
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by oldwahoo54 » Apr 13, 2016 8:26 pm

If Afton and Farmville are the ends of your rides, you must be near C'ville.

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 13, 2016 9:58 pm

oldwahoo54,

"If Afton and Farmville are the ends of your rides, you must be near C'ville."

I've also ridden to Ashland, Scotsville, Culpeper, Spotsylvania, Goochland, Madison, and C'ville.

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 19, 2016 8:34 am

I rode about three miles of gravel over Chicken Mountain, Saturday, to get to Madison for a BLT, at the old Tastee Freeze.
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I was trying to get a mountain in the shot, but the curious guy to the right stepped into the shot.

On the way back, riding through the roundabout in Gordonsville, I merged right behind a red Polaris Slingshot. After the roundabout, I pulled up next to him, and we chatted the length of the short main drag. He had just bought it used from a guy in West Virginia, for $6K. My seat bottom was level with his shoulder. I could have reached down and patted him on the head!

91.28 mi, 4:13, 21.6 av, 35.3 max, 17.6 Wh/mile. Looks like this was the last ride in this years great spring weather. Rode the old bike yesterday, in 90 F temps!

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 23, 2016 4:08 pm

Disc brakes are OK but...the pads are proprietary not just to each make, but even to each model, and they are twice as expensive as rim brake pads.

Case in point: I reused the Hope rear disc caliper that came with our 1996 tandem. It was a really nice floating caliper Hope. It worked great, but the pads had over 6K miles on them, and I contacted Hope about replacement pads. They don't carry them anymore. They put me in contact with the original pad maker, but they don't have them anymore either. So now, after 8,400 miles of use, the pads are gone and my perfectly good Hope disc brake is junk. I've replaced it with an Avid BB7. There are a ton of these out there, so hopefully pads will be available for the years I have left. I can still buy rim brake pads for my 44 year old Frejus, or a 100 year old bike for that matter. :-(

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » Apr 26, 2016 8:38 am

Yesterday I rode to Culpeper. Didn't leave home until 1:25 pm. It was 85 F. I came into town on S. East St, which parallels Main Street. I saw a sign for the visitor center which, as is often the case, was in an old train station. This was a very nice section of town I had not seen before. A micro-brewery, upscale shops and hipster upstairs apartments, etc. I pulled up in front of the visitor center and noticed a police car with flashing lights at the intersection, and a policewoman directing traffic. I asked the gal in the tourist information center what was up. She said they were filming a show with the trikes that are built just up the street. I walked outside to the intersection just in time to see the trikes come down the side street and pull a U-turn before heading back to the main drag. There was a drone hovering above the middle of Main Street.

https://www.facebook.com/Culpeper-Times ... 434730575/

https://www.facebook.com/tanommotors/?fref=nf

I had managed to catch the very end of what had clearly been big excitement. I ended up right around the corner from the visitor center at another nice BBQ place.
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98.24 mi, 4:15.53, 23.0 av, 35.4 max, 19.2 Wh/mi, 2,492 mi total

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » May 07, 2016 9:17 am

The electric car industry's struggles have been a boon for DIY bicycle/scooter/motorcycle builders.

3 kWh, 2.5 usable, 51 pounds, $545. Cheaper and lighter, per kWh, than my Leaf modules.

http://hybridautocenter.com/HAC4/index. ... Itemid=605

http://www.greencarcongress.com/2014/11/20141116.html

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by OptimusPrime » May 07, 2016 2:14 pm

Warren wrote:Did the monthly trash run today. Bigger and heavier than the recycling run. Worked just fine.

I should mention the most important part of this whole build...the centerstand. I have never liked kickstands. None of my bikes have had one, until now. This bike is huge, and heavy. No way am I going to lay it down. Propping it against stuff is a struggle. And fixing a rear flat would be impossible without this stand.

http://shop.juicedbikes.com/collections ... 9796755141

Did I mention I love this centerstand? :-)
monthlytrashrun1.jpg
Just wondering, do you fix your flats with the wheel on the bike?

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » May 07, 2016 3:55 pm

OptimusPrime,

I haven't actually had a flat yet on this bike, but I have done a dry run. I loosen the axle nuts, and torque arms while the wheel is still on the ground. It is very easy to find a spot where the rear wheel is one or two inches off the ground when the stand is down. The easiest way to deal with the chain and derailleur is to undo the fixing bolt and move it all out of the way. Finish up removing the two torque arm bolts, and loosening up the axle nuts, and the wheel drops out of the dropouts. Roll the wheel back and out, fix the flat, and reverse the whole procedure. Not quite as easy as on my 72 pound mid-drive, but good enough.

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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » May 10, 2016 5:27 pm

The weather here has been crap, the last two weeks. It has either rained, or threatened rain every day. The rain, when it comes, has been drizzle on and off all day, or overcast all day, with a brief but violent downpour. If this becomes a trend, I will need fenders.

Last Tuesday, I was pacing around all day, watching little storm cells appearing and vanishing all over the map. I'd finally had enough at 3:30 and decided to go for a short ride. I got about 15 miles from home with big clouds stacked up ahead of me the whole way. But I started to notice dark clouds building fast behind. I arced around and headed for home. I switched from WOT in position 2 (21-25 mph), to WOT in position 3 (28-32 mph). It was looking real nasty about 10 miles from home. By 4 miles, it was raining pretty good. By 2 miles I had my glasses pulled down my nose, squinting between the glasses tops, and my cap brim. The sky was pitch black, swirling, with cracks of lightning too near for comfort. At the entrance to our road, the power cut off. I looked at the CA and the voltage was 35 and dropping fast. Something was obviously wet, and shorting out. Probably the controller, or the BMS. I cut the power switch, downshifted to a low gear, and started grinding out the last bit over one mile to home. I turned on the power switch every minute or so. The CA would boot up. The voltage would read in the low 30's, and start dropping fast. I finally pushed the bike in the back door with water running out of my shoes, soaked through. I haven't been that wet since falling out of a kayak. I pulled the soggy, black polyester cover from the battery. I had been meaning to urethane the inside, but hadn't gotten around to it yet. The BMS and battery were damp. I unplugged the battery from the controller, and the BMS balance lead plug from the BMS. I checked the pack voltage at the main pack terminals, with my VOM, and read 53.4 volts, about what it was before the rain hit.

The backside of the BMS had an insulating layer of black posterboard/cardboard, held on with the nuts for the six tiny screws that held the aluminum heatsink to the front. Paul, at EM3ev, had warned me not to count on it, so the BMS sat on a piece of black neoprene foam from a mouse pad. However, the posterboard was completely soaked, and now conducted well enough to cause a small drain on some part of the BMS. The CA, reading a low voltage, was cutting power. I was able to peel the wet cardboard off the back of the BMS, leaving little bits under the mounting nuts. I put a floor fan on high, and let it blow over the electricals all night. The next morning, I carefully removed the tiny nuts, one at a time, and replaced the scraps of posterboard with small nylon washers. I then glued a 4 mm thick piece of white, closed cell packing foam to the back of the BMS to replace the cardboard, and neoprene foam. This, and the urethane coating I now have in the bag, should prevent the problem from reoccurring. With two rides, and a charge since, everything seems fine.

Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » May 13, 2016 9:28 am

Yesterday, I was just about to take the recycle/trash to the recycling center when the mail arrived. I got a Rideye video camera, so I took the time to figure out how to use it, and stuck it on the side of my helmet. One mile, and three minutes into my first video. :-(

[The extension mp4 has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]


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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by oldwahoo54 » May 14, 2016 8:41 pm

I got a Fly6 this Spring, and I've been posting examples of good behavior to FaceBook. In this one, three Albemarle County vehicles plus some cars give me a safe passing along Georgetown Road.


Warren
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » May 14, 2016 9:23 pm

oldwahoo54,

Even though I worked there for 28 years, I have only ridden a bicycle in Charlottesville five times. The first time was when I moved to Virginia, on my bicycle, in 1974. I rode right through town on Rt 250. It was a sleepy little college town then. Now it is a mini Los Angeles. I have recently figured out a reasonable safe way into town, so plan future forays.

So glad the sun has finally shown its face, at least part of the day, the last three days. Managed Scottsville, Fork Union, and Columbia today, before the rain hit again.

75.7 mi, 2:56.52, 25.6 av, 35.2 max, 1762.8 Wh, 23.1 Wh/mi 2800 miles, so far.
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Re: My recumbent cargo bike

Post by Warren » May 17, 2016 3:10 pm

A few shots from my Rideye on yesterday's ride.

126.05 mi, 5:29.58, 22.9 mph av, 36.0 mph max, 19.1 Wh/mi, 2926 miles, so far.
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In between these big towns is nothing but miles of tree lined, country roads. :-)
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