S12s and s-lcd3 with 52v/14s?

Hello all,
I have tried searching but can't come up with a definitive answer.
I am leaning towards using lunacycle's mighty mini cube 52v 6ah pack due to the small size and light weight and mostly running short trips.
Can the bmsbattery s12s or s12sh with the s-lcd3 be fed a 14s pack? Any problems with this setup? Can the s-lcd3 be set to show battery level with 52v, can the lvc be changed?
I would be powering either a q100, bpm2, or q128 front hub motor on a 26" wheel, looking for around 260rpm or lower, top speed of 20mph would be plenty.
Also a bpm2, q128, or mac on a 20" wheel and would want closer to 25mph. Best voltage/rpm/winding combo to achieve those?
Thanks all.
Lebn

Should not be a problem.
mosfet p80nf70 N-channel 68 V, 0.0082 , 98 A,
саpacitor 63V


http://electrotransport.ru/ussr/index.php?topic=18757.90#topmsg
Settings LVC can be changed from display in parametr P5

Great, thank you tony16, seems like it should work.
Anyone actually using this setup?
Any suggestion on best best geared hub to use at 52v in the wheel sizes and desired speeds above? The 26" will be low weight ~200lbs with bike, minor hills. The 20" will be occasionally high weight (~up to 350lbs depending on cargo load, and also fairly minor hills. Both will pedal assist primarily, very low or no throttle use.
Any good posts out there on changing the settings on a s-lcd3? The manual is a bit cryptic. Do you know what p-5 should be set to for a 52v setup?
Thanks again.
Lebn

I am using 14S with LCD3 with default configuration.
The LVC is 40/30/20 depending on the controller. (48/36/24)

lebnjay said:

Great, thank you tony16, seems like it should work.
Anyone actually using this setup?
Any suggestion on best best geared hub to use at 52v in the wheel sizes and desired speeds above? The 26" will be low weight ~200lbs with bike, minor hills. The 20" will be occasionally high weight (~up to 350lbs depending on cargo load, and also fairly minor hills. Both will pedal assist primarily, very low or no throttle use.
Any good posts out there on changing the settings on a s-lcd3? The manual is a bit cryptic. Do you know what p-5 should be set to for a 52v setup?
Thanks again.
Lebn

Click to expand...

I think most S12S LCD3 users would agree to just keeping it on P5=0 as in zero... I have tried a bunch of different numbers on different batteries on this controller LCD setup and it doesn't appear to change behavior anyway.. It seems to just watch the voltage from initial battery plugin and determine when your battery is done automatically and reduce your power at the very end to a dribble to get you home instead of having a ultra hardline LVC like traditional controllers do.
I used to think it was weird/silly but after using it for a few years now (now with two S12S LCD purchased setups) I actually do think its a cool little smart feature, its not really denying you of any remaining power in your pack its just a different/software way of letting you know your out..

I am sure when they first released this controller this P5 setting must of got a lot of negative feedback and after many years its still exactly the same.. I think the LCD3 developers knew it was a feature that would be hard to accept but they obviously stuck with their guns about it I think that was a noble decision. I never had a 52v volt pack on my S12S LCD3 setups but I would be surprised if it doesn't magically work properly in regards of LVC as well..

You can just hit the main power button quickly to change from km/h to total pack volts in real time and just watch your volts the whole time instead of speed which is what I tend to do.. The little mobile phone style battery bar is not really good for accurate watching of your battery discharge level..

P5 is a damping factor for the LCD battery display. It has no affect on the operation of the controller.

Using a S12S for a Q100 is total overkill. At 48v, about 18 amps is the maximum you should use.

A Q128 or BPM in a front wheel at 52v with a S12S is not a good idea either in a normal bike because the wheel will slip too much due to the torque. Why do you want a front motor?

For a q100 would you recommend a s06s then? I didn't see a 9 fet version that is both sine wave and offers torque simulation. I just figured since the cost was similar I could oversize the controller and then limit the amp output via the LCD settings, thinking it would be more reliable in the long term.
I was thinking the q128 or bpm would be okay in the front if they are used with pedal assist and mostly at level 1 or 2. Maybe 48v would be better, does anyone make a nice smaller 48v battery like the Luna mighty mini 52v?
For the 26" wheel I was leaning towards a front hub as we will be towing a kid trailer with that bike sometimes. Most of the time it will be a very light use pedal assist, level 1 or 2 as it is my wife's bike and she does not want to go fast. But occasionally it will be pulling a trailer so I want it to have some good torque as well. The trailer attaches using the axle skewer to hold a bracket on that has a 10.5mm hole, and is 6mm wide. I was under the impression that this wouldn't be compatible with a rear hub.

The 20" front hub will be for a cargo bike attachment called The Lift, http://www.liftbikes.com
It replaces your front wheel and attaches at the bottom bracket and front fork giving you a front box bakfiets style bike on demand.
I want to keep my bike light and pedal powered only, but want extra help when pushing the cargo attachment.

Seems like the s-lcd3 wouldn't provide a very effective lvc for a 52v setup, reading the manual it seems the you can adjust it +2v up to 42v, but that is still too low.
Thanks for all your help as I muddle through all this.

Lebn

lebnjay said:

I am leaning towards using lunacycle's mighty mini cube 52v 6ah pack due to the small size and light weight and mostly running short trips.

Click to expand...

Looking at that 2P14S battery pack I don't think its a good idea because with a 2P pack build you are going to draw a large amount of current out of just two parallel cell sets which puts a lot of strain on the cells and will greatly shorted their total life cycles.. Loose about 25% of your total life cycles (300 to 250) drawing more current according to official specs.. I would say drawing that hard the pack will become useless/saggy quite quickly and also you will get less total ah drawing that hard from the small pack from 3000ah to 2700ah at minimum.. If you look at the white colored line for 20a draw it only gave a bit over 2000mah from the cell in total.. which is a lot less then the rated 3000ah.
That pack was designed for 250watt kits if you ask me..

Cycle life: 300 cycles to 70% (4A charge and 15A discharge)
Cycle life: 250 cycles to 70% (4A charge and 22A discharge, pause at 70°C, resume at 50°C)
http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Samsung INR18650-30Q 3000mAh (Pink) UK.html

This test on a samsung 25r 18650 gave 1,300 cycles on a much lower discharge level..
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/download/file.php?id=187888

Unless you have a special bottom bracket, a crank-drive motor will probably be the best solution. You only have to choose the power you want. They're easy to install too.

Thanks for that thebeastie and d8veh,
Sounds like I might be better off with a bigger pack for the cargo bike attatchment, but I still think the small pack would be good for my wifes bike. She won't be pulling many amps and I would guess that she will rarely go over 10 miles, more often closer to 5. And her frame is a step through, so very little room in the triangle, anyone fit a dolphin or shark or bottle battery in a step through ladies frame? Its a trek 830.
I was initially thinking two small packs, one for hers and one for the cargo bike when we are riding together, then when I take the cargo bike to work I could take both the small packs together.
I am still considering mid-drive, but the cargo bike attatchment uses a bracket that is installed at the bottom bracket, so I don't think it will be compatible with the bbs02. And for my wifes I was leaning towards the front hub for a lower cost, lower power, simpler system.
Has anyone tried pushing a 52v/14s pack on a bmsbattery sine wave controller like the s12s or s12sn, or their integrated controller in the battery 09 case?
Thanks again
Lebn

lebnjay said:

Thanks for that thebeastie and d8veh,
Sounds like I might be better off with a bigger pack for the cargo bike attatchment, but I still think the small pack would be good for my wifes bike. She won't be pulling many amps and I would guess that she will rarely go over 10 miles, more often closer to 5. And her frame is a step through, so very little room in the triangle, anyone fit a dolphin or shark or bottle battery in a step through ladies frame? Its a trek 830.
I was initially thinking two small packs, one for hers and one for the cargo bike when we are riding together, then when I take the cargo bike to work I could take both the small packs together.
I am still considering mid-drive, but the cargo bike attatchment uses a bracket that is installed at the bottom bracket, so I don't think it will be compatible with the bbs02. And for my wifes I was leaning towards the front hub for a lower cost, lower power, simpler system.
Has anyone tried pushing a 52v/14s pack on a bmsbattery sine wave controller like the s12s or s12sn, or their integrated controller in the battery 09 case?
Thanks again
Lebn

Click to expand...

It's somewhat confusing combining two builds into one thread, maybe you should have started two threads.
At any rate, I'll address her bike since I have lot's of experience w/ that type of build.
Motor-700or 800 Watts is about the max. you want to run on her frt. wheel. More than that and it can get squirlly. And aside from wheel spin on less than optimun surfaces, there is the possibility of leaning on the throttle w/ the bike stopped. It used to happen to me before I went w/ a half-twist instead of a thumb and @ 700 Watts, the bike doesn't launch out of one's hands. Also, at this power level, one can safely use the PAS without a brake cut-off. With the Q100, there is very little advantage of running the 201H over the 260H. The 260H pulls about as well as the 201 while having a higher top speed when both are on the same Voltage. And a 260 will hit your target speed of 19 Mph on 36V. By keeping the Volts low, we can run a fairly stout controller, while keeping the overall system power level in our "safe" range.
You are correct in your observation that BMS B. doesn't offer a sine wave in the 17 to 20 Amp range. I use a simple 9-FET 17 Amp square wave from Elifebike that uses the 3-speed 810 led display. I like the simpleness of this set-up and on a bike w/ a limited speed range, the 3-speed limit works well, with speed ranges of around 14 to 15 mph, 16 to 17 mph and 19 mph unlimited. And with the low power of the system, the bike doesn't lurch to speed when using the PAS. Also, you can buy their controller on Ebay for $40 including shipping. The name of their store is diyebikestore.This is good since you will have to buy a battery, you might as well get both the motor and a Lithium Ion battery from BMS Battery, probably the best value batteries out there, especially when one combines the shipping of both the battery and motor.
Battery-Check on her Trek to see if there are water bottle mounting lugs on the under-side of the main down tube. If they are there, use can use a water bottle(or Dolphin or Shark) style battery. If they are not there, consider the new flat-pack battery that rear rack mounts. The frt. motor will counter the battery weight nicely. I have one of the 36V Dolphin batteries w/ genaric cells and it is working well, but D8veh feels the Panasonic cells are worth the extra $$. Go with the best and largest capacity battery that fits the budget.
Don't forget the little stuff, like a spoke wrench, torque arm and throttle. I should say throttles, because it might be a good idea to buy every style til she decides what she likes. I like the left-hand half-twist because most of us remove the left side shifter(shifting chain rings is not needed on an Ebike)and i like the throttle on the left and the shifter on the right. The half-twist seems to be easiest on thr arm muscles, especially when combined w/ PAS.
I rode a bike much like this for a summer where I rode almost exclusively on a boardwalk w/ lot's of people around and I liked it's releaxed slow speed controlability while retaining good hill climbing performance(for a mini-motor).
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=68756&p=1036885&hilit=+idrive#p1036885

Hi guys

In the thread below I explain the use of parameter P1 on Q100/S-LCD3 display.
I expect it to be the same on q128 and other motors/LCDs

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=97237

Sincerely yours

DuncanDK