Building a commute bike. Recommendations please.

Hi all.
I've been interested in ebikes for a while, and after a recent trip to Japan, where I rode a few, I am again considering a build. I'm a keen cyclist, and ride to work when the weather is good, but soon ill be moving to a new job, which is further away. I think its time to build an e-bike. I'm after some advice please.

Typical commute would be 8-10km each way, relatively flat, some light grade gradual hills only.
I'm 65kg, and would typically carry a 5kg backpack.
Ill either modify an existing 26'' hardtail, or build with a new 700c frame for less rolling resistance.
Id like to be able to cruise at ~30km/hr on the flats as a minimum, without too much pedaling effort.

I'm hoping for a relatively stealth looking bike, but have no legal considerations here in Indonesia to worry about. Given that I enjoy cycling, also keen to keep the bike light and clean where I can.
Rain might be a problem in the tropics, I've considered making a custom sealed pannier to house the controller and/or battery in case of rain, but not sure how that would go with heat buildup.

2 options have taken my interest at this stage, a front wheel 250-500w hub motor, from leaf bike (keen to hear peoples view on that) with a 36 or 48v battery and controller. I liked the idea of this alongside a internal rear hub gear set on a commuter as it would be balanced and quiet.

Second option that seems viable would be a bafang mid drive kit.

Cost wise, id like to keep it less than 1000aud, as for a similar price I could get a decent motorcycle here.
I dont think I need lots of power, but also want to avoid upgrade envy after a short while. I won't be riding off road, or many big hills at all. Ill do that on my Dh bike.

Keen to hear some suggestions and thoughts about the quality of leaf bike kits as well as issues of weather sealing and heat in the tropics.
Cheers.
Tom.

Your goals are easily doable w/ a hub motor(you don't list speed, so I gather you don't need to go real fast) and when A hub motor will suffice, for the sake of simplicity, cost and stealth, it is the way to go.
Consider the newish mid-sized geared motor from BMS Battery, the Q128C;

https://bmsbattery.com/ebike-kit/769-q128c-135mm-500w-rear-driving-ebike-hub-motor-wheel-ebike-kit.html

More powerful than a mini, yet smaller than the larger geared motor, it is proving to be the perfect size for an "assist" Ebike, yet versitile enough to handle other situations. The C suffix means it will accept the donor bike's cassette, which makes for easy gearing changes and smooth shifting, although you will find that w/a motor, you will only be using 2 or 3 gears(which is why you don't need an internal hub).
BMS Battery is a good source for Lithium Ion Batteries, so get everything from them. That would be a battery w/ the intergrated 20 AMP sine wave controller w/ the 5-level "torque imitation" PAS(pedal assist system), which is, cost vs features, the best assist system avail.
W/ a 36V battery, top speed will be 20 to 23 MPH depending on motor speed and wheel size and a 48 V battery will top out around 23 to 25MPH. Fast enough to be fun, but not so fast to require lots of bike mods to be safe.
These components intergrate w/ 9-pin "water resistant" connectors and the controller is semi-sealed in the battery container, which should help in the rain. On a hardtail, the "bottle" style battery would be mounted in the center frame area, so you could wear a poncho that would drape over that part of the bike for additional protection.

The reason to choose a front motor would be the IGH, otherwise I'd prefer a rear motor.

26 or 700c,, either one is fine. The power of the motor will make even fairly big differences in rolling resistance matter little. But if you do plan to ride with the motor off, then you do want an easy roll. Most find that adding the 20+ pounds of weight to the bike makes riding with the motor completely off tiresome. But that is not always true of a real cyclist. Its fat old men like me who used to pedal hard that need the motor on all the way.

Lots of real pedalers like a very small, rear geared motor on a nice road bike. But you might change the bars to flat, or just a slight rise mtb bar. Again, with the motor, you won't need to ride in a time trial tuck. What about the IGH? Well, betcha you put it in the highest gear and leave it there all the time. So all you need is a derailleur, and can even strip off the shifter.

For normal riding on the road, I prefer a hub-motor to a crank-drive. They're quieter, smoother, require less gear-changing and generally give you a more comfortable ride.

A 250w one should be able to give more than enough power for what you want, especially if you run it at 48v. I've built and converted a lot of bikes, and I've used many different motors. the one I use now is the Q128C from BMSBattery. It's a fantastic motor. I'm 86kg and on level 3 out of 5, I can cruise along at 22mph (33km/h) without having to pedal hard. It's the 201 rpm 36v version, which runs 33% faster at 48v.

At your weight and not many hills, the Q100C would probably be better unless there's times when you want to ride without pedalling, where the higher power from the Q128C would be useful.

With a hub-motor, the motor's maximum speed is a very important characteristic. You can change it to an extent by changing the battery voltage. If you want to cruise at 30km/h, you need a maximum speed of about 36km/h because the power ramps down at the top end. The 36v 201 rpm Q100C at 48v will match your requirement perfectly. the only problem is to find the right controller. The closest match is the 17 amp Sinewave controller from PSWpower.com, but if you want to get everything from one shop, BMSBattery sell downtube - mounted batteries that have 20 amp sinewave controllers installed in them, and the rest of the kit (PAS, throttle and LCD) is included along with the wiring with waterproof connectors. All that will be well within your budget.

You need a cassette motor (C suffix in the motor designation) if your donor bike has 8 speeds or more at the back.

Here's my bike with this kit installed. It weighs about 21kg. a Q100c would be 1.5kg less:

Wow,.. I think your primary choice is perfect for major intended commuter use. Looks like ya want all it has to offer,.... simplistic dependability to cover your efforts and needs without concerns, and not be terribly obvious about it.

The front hub IS simplistic,.... easy and simple conversion. I might edge out the 500w over the 250w, and 48V is common. The 500 will provide all ya need with a touch of reserve that might be appreciated sometimes, but I wouldn't exceed that on the front. A direct drive hub is quietest, with absolutely no wear, maintenance, or concerns,... super dependable. Other option, mid-drives and geared hubs, have mechanical parts and wear that serve purposes other than yours quite well,... but they ARE mechanical. Make sure it's mounted well in the forks, and that the forks are strong enough to see no great stress. Might consider a sturdy "guard" over the axle end to better protect the cable that exists there. Will easily see the speed you expect,... so make sure ya got adequate brakes, tires and rims. The Leafbike motor has varying degrees of regen braking,... think you'll appreciate that too. At top cruising speed, you might find it tough to keep up a cadence with enough effort to assist the motor, but unlike Dogman Dan and I,... your likely in better shape. And you won't notice the slight cogging effect if your flat out pedaling with out power.

The Leafbike conversion will come on a good rim if your ordering the assembly. The 500w hub isn't too large, outstanding and obvious, and is VERY quiet. As a commuter, your likely considering panniers even with a backpack. But if your forced to ride heavy or steady rains, your controller, connections and such will benefit from any extra protection you provide. That tropical heat is tough too. So make sure your protections are well ventilated. An easily removable battery,... bottle, sharkpack, or whatever,... is great for the commuter. Easy to remove and charge at work or home,... don't neglect safety when charging. Removable, means it's a well protected housing and you don't have leave it out in the heat either.

Cost wise,... you'll likely push that 1000 mark. But you'll be far more dependable than a motorcycle, no added fuel costs or expenses, nor any maintenance beyond typical bike care. In fact, you'll find chain and brake wear (with light regen braking) to likely be less than unpowered bicycle, with less adjustment needs too. Dependable, clean instant go,... perfect commuter!

Been happy with Leafbike, and I'll be ordering from them again soon. Think you'll be VERY happy with your choice,.. and looks like you've given more than jus a passing thought to it all.

I'm afraid Leafbike has fallen behind the times. Their battery selection, for example, is basic and overpriced. No intergrated controller/battery version and no sine wave controller. The KT system is based on Current limiting, not speed limiting, which makes for a better PAS experience.
Comparing mini geared motors, one will notice the Q100H mini is rated 350 Watts, while only weighing 2.0 Kg.s, while the 250 Watt rated Leafbike motor is over 2.5 Kg.s.
As far as comparing Ebikes to motorcycles, that's a road best left untraveled. While many ebike riders have many reasons justiyfing the sport we love, savings over gas-powered bicycles or sm. motorbike or scooters is not a valid one. In most places, that $1000 spent on a used Honda would provide more economical transportation over the long run(miles vs costs). But that's not the point of an ebike. You can't pedal a Honda.

I wouldn't advise a direct drive motor for what OP wants. They're too heavy for a light rider and a bike with 700c wheels. He's only 65kg.

Aw come on guys,.... he's lookin' for cheap, quiet, dependable smooth-riding commuter. 48V or even 36V! No trails,.. few if any big hills,.... he has a DH for that. He's a avid bicyclist in good shape lookin' for a little assist to get over the longer run to work at nothing much greater than bicycle speeds with a bit less effort. It's a hot climate, and who want's to rush and arrive to work all sweaty and whooped out after pedalin' with a backpack with all ya need for work. He's seen what's common and typical in Japan, and likes it! Want's something at least equivalent, or even a bit better.

ANY, motor/battery addition is gonna add significant weight. But ANY motor/battery, will make up the difference in effort needed to move that weight. He doesn't want EXTREAMLY heavy, nobody does, but a couple Kg difference in the expected overall weight isn't greatly important, to him... simplicity and dependability is.

A DD hub HAS NO MOVING OR WEARING PARTS (aside from axle bearings common to all)!!! There are no noisy gears to wear or get noisier or possibly need replacement at some time. It drives no sprockets or chains, or stresses or wears anything beyond the wheel assembly. He doesn't need great power for the hills HE expects,... because he's a an avid healthy bicyclist! He needs simple dependability to get to work easily. He doesn't seem too thrilled with the maintenance, upkeep, and repairs of a motorcycle that still may or may not start on a hot, wet, tropic day, when he has to get to work NOW. And a front-wheel hub IS easy and economical, AND he can use his desired internal-geared rear hub!

He noted that he doesn't need lots of power or speed, but a bit of reserve would might be nice. His interest is 250-500w front hub, 36V or 48V,..... the 500w@48V will have the bit extra that 250w@36V doesn't for jus a few$ extra. The 48V battery will serve well in a future upgrade to 1000W, 1200W, 1500w or whatever if he desires. The 36V battery will be limiting on future upgrades, that he probably would like to keep minimal in additional costs.

The Leafbike kits are dang good,.. shipping to US is costly, but probably much less to Indonesia. There ARE other makes and sources,... better? cheaper? Maybe, but Leafbike IS a good, economical choice, if one were in Indonesia. I MIGHT suggest seeking other battery sources,... but those offered by Leafbike are probably fine for his needs. Might also suggest 26" over that 29",... motors do best in 26" for which they were majorly engineered and designed for. But nothing wrong with a 29" given his primary intended use and purpose,... he does have DH, remember?

Get the best you can reasonably afford within your budget, Your primary interests are MORE than fine, (500W DD hub @48V) for your commuter. Think it will be all you expect and a bit more than what you may have experienced in Japan. But if you think you might want more, or to put it all on that DH someday,... THEN, you might wanna reconsider. :wink:

Yep. If you want a dependable commuter, nothing comes close to a DD hub. And they will be cheaper than the other type. And while a 48V 500W will do fine, you can get a 1000W for about the same price if not cheaper. See Need Advice link in sig.

wesnewell said:

Yep. If you want a dependable commuter, nothing comes close to a DD hub. And they will be cheaper than the other type. And while a 48V 500W will do fine, you can get a 1000W for about the same price if not cheaper. See Need Advice link in sig.

Click to expand...

IMO,... a 1000w front hub is nearly more than I'd even care for on the front of a simple conversion/commuter. You can regulate it back a bit, but ya can't put it on the rear of anything if your looking to get all ya can outa it or upgrade or anything. If he was considering a rear hub,.. certainly, go a 48V 1000W! Still dependable has heck, with plenty of speed (50kph) and even more power. But with speed ya got brakes to think more of,... in terms of both added cost and needed safety. Rear hub means you can forget that internal multi-speed,... you'll need derailleur and fit up a sprocket set that doesn't rub or interfere with anything. UGH!

Keepin' it simple, dependable, economical, and reasonably safe.
Even the 48v 500W is likely to see 40kpm,... on a "bicycle" with typical brakes??? I'll be all you expect and a bit more.

But if ya REALLY want some fun and enjoyment,....