Assembling a safe fast ebike

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
raylo32   100 W

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by raylo32 » Sep 15 2020 5:01am

Yup, you ride like a motorcycle. I ride my road pedal bike in city traffic like that. But lots of motorcyclists still die. You can pretend that you are choosing all the interactions with other vehicles... and you can indeed choose many... but there are plenty of idiots out there who won't see you... and you won't always be able to find them before they find you. They pull out of intersections
and parking lots without stopping or looking... they make abrupt left turns across traffic or radical lane changes with no signal or warning, etc, etc. Be careful.
John in CR wrote:
Sep 15 2020 1:41am

The great thing about our electrics is how easy it is to get extreme performance. I'm not talking about speed in particular other than enough speed to pace traffic and a bit more. It's acceleration that I use to stay safe in traffic. I say that because I don't let cars near me. I move around between and ultimately in front of them with ample empty space behind me. I run full lights and have a horn, so the only remaining risk, ie traffic entering from the sides, is more likely to see me, though I'm always alert to be able to avoid anything entering the road from side streets. I also don't ride along side vehicles other than a brief time while passing them. The way I ride I create so much space between myself and vehicles that it would be quite difficult for someone to hit me...even intentionally. I chose my own interactions with vehicles and ride assuming none see me until I've confirmed they actually have, so things such as getting right crossed are virtually impossible.
[/quote]

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MadRhino   100 GW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by MadRhino » Sep 15 2020 11:02am

Different cities, different idiots.

Here the worst are U-turns and illegal left turns. Most of the important streets here are left turn forbidden and U-turns are forbidden everywhere. When cagers do it, they know it is illegal. So they don’t signal and do it quick. They are more concerned about looking for police in their mirrors than upcoming bikes. Most of the time I know what the idiots are up to, seeing their behavior long before. But sometimes there are no signs, and sometimes the hypocrites are signaling a right turn and move to the extreme right before suddenly doing a U-turn.
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.
Current bikes
Street:
Trek Session 10 mod. Variable geometry. 70mph
Dirt:
Santa Cruz V10. 50mph

John in CR   100 GW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by John in CR » Sep 15 2020 11:55am

raylo32 wrote:
Sep 15 2020 5:01am
Yup, you ride like a motorcycle. I ride my road pedal bike in city traffic like that. But lots of motorcyclists still die. You can pretend that you are choosing all the interactions with other vehicles... and you can indeed choose many... but there are plenty of idiots out there who won't see you... and you won't always be able to find them before they find you. They pull out of intersections
and parking lots without stopping or looking... they make abrupt left turns across traffic or radical lane changes with no signal or warning, etc, etc. Be careful.
John in CR wrote:
Sep 15 2020 1:41am

The great thing about our electrics is how easy it is to get extreme performance. I'm not talking about speed in particular other than enough speed to pace traffic and a bit more. It's acceleration that I use to stay safe in traffic. I say that because I don't let cars near me. I move around between and ultimately in front of them with ample empty space behind me. I run full lights and have a horn, so the only remaining risk, ie traffic entering from the sides, is more likely to see me, though I'm always alert to be able to avoid anything entering the road from side streets. I also don't ride along side vehicles other than a brief time while passing them. The way I ride I create so much space between myself and vehicles that it would be quite difficult for someone to hit me...even intentionally. I chose my own interactions with vehicles and ride assuming none see me until I've confirmed they actually have, so things such as getting right crossed are virtually impossible.
[/quote]

Been dodging those idiots for over 4 decades. Actually my biggest risk is idiots riding motos too aggressively.

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by dogman dan » Sep 16 2020 4:24pm

This discussion should be about riding like a motorcycle. If not, its by definition a discussion of how to assemble a safe, slow e bike.

Your duty is to SEE all of those idiots. Takes some practice, but I haven't hit a car with a bike or motorcycle since the 70's. Got better at seeing.

Seeing vs merely looking is very rare. Not 10% of the population can do it.

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MadRhino   100 GW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by MadRhino » Sep 16 2020 6:41pm

Faster speed and higher trafic density are letting a rider less time and opportunity to see. Unpredictable situations are happening to me 3-4 times a year, even after 55 yrs riding without any serious consequences. I hit a car once in a while, well let’s say I like bumping them when they do a U-turn cutting my way, but haven’t had a car hitting me in the last 35 yrs.

It is about riding a motorcycle. Fast ebikes are subjected to the same situations as motorcycles. Yet I find the lighter weight of ebikes is making a safer ride. They don’t hear you coming, but you can handle the situations quicker. Building a fast ebike is also tuning that unique handling, making it safer.
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.
Current bikes
Street:
Trek Session 10 mod. Variable geometry. 70mph
Dirt:
Santa Cruz V10. 50mph

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E-HP   1 MW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by E-HP » Sep 16 2020 9:26pm

I can only give general advice. Fundamentally, for safety on two wheels, you need good agility, good acceleration, and good braking. Those factors have to stay balanced as you build speed. You add more power to go faster, increasing your mass, now you need better braking to haul it down, and then modify or tune your suspension to retain handling. Personally, of the three factors, not having enough brakes has caused the greatest crap my pants moments, because you come to that realization enough ahead of disaster, and in slow motion. But between the three, agility, then acceleration, then braking, in that order, have been the primary factor for avoiding a bad outcome. But the order doesn't really matter since an issue with any of them could take you out.

You need a certain amount of power to compete with cars. I don't care to ride along with cars much on an ebike, but if I had to regularly, I'd want a minimum of 8kW on tap, with the corresponding levels of brakes and suspension and tires. That may only be 10HP, but electric motors are capable of the instant burst of acceleration that you need to get out of a situation (at least in the right part of the power band). Tires are important, but that's just a research exercise and some trial and error, but don't forget suspension, and you can never have too much brake.

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ZeroEm   100 kW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by ZeroEm » Sep 16 2020 10:23pm

I would need to do 80 mph around here 50-60mph would get me ran over. Then someone would not see me and pull out, where are the air bags.
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Balmorhea   100 kW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by Balmorhea » Sep 17 2020 3:02am

I've been riding arterial streets with cars since the 1980s, and I've only need pedal powered speeds to do it. It's unpleasant and cars suck, but bicycle speeds are enough.

I probably would have hurt myself more had I been moving faster.
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ZeroEm   100 kW

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Re: Assembling a safe fast ebike

Post by ZeroEm » Sep 17 2020 10:35am

:lol: You live in Texas you know how they drive here, do not wish to mix with them. My favorite speed is between 15-20 mph.
abundans cautela non nocet
2019 Performer E-Trike 9w/km
2013 Nissan Leaf S 7 bars 331.5w/KM

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