Another Stealth bomber (clone) build

[Ham]

Good man, so satisfying!

Those zoom forks looks great too and for the price you cant go wrong! Grabbing a cheap set of pike 351 and a hope hub front wheel next week. Then just the rear brake line and isolater switch.

Got my rear caliper mount finished today and my esc mounted dry inside the frame. Happy days...now i need the sunshine you have rather than the rain here.

[markz]

zoom forks looks

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=23996&p=1366348&hil ... s#p1366348

[Ham]

Oh haha:) how bad can they be?! I mean how may of us here really need world cup downhill grade suspension...my riding feels like i am beast but I'm actually a total fairy and slow

[shortcircuit911]

@Ham ya man so happy to get this thing together for a test ride. Glad to hear yours is coming together too. Let me know how you like those forks. The zooms are meh, when you go over a big bump and the front end let's you know(suspension fully extends and slams)lol. There's also some play I need to get out of the headset.

So I'm a bit worried. I went for a ride yesterday to check out some of the new setting I programmed in (no delay on accel, 350A phase current) and when I got back the motor was scorching hot. It was about 95F out, I rode 2 miles, pulled 1.5-5Kw most of the time (10-18 mph trying to baby the batteries). The controller was warm, but the motor, holy shit it was hot. Thoughts? Too much phase current?

[Ham]

I'm the wrong person to ask about hubs and hot motors as my knowledge of electronics is hilarious.

I've read some posts about cotroller settings being off affecting noise and heat?!

[Ham]

Is that a DNM rear shock?

[John in CR]

Too much phase current?

Yep. I run much lower resistance (16mOhm phase to phase) higher efficiency motors at much higher peak power (28kw real peak input) and only run slightly higher phase current with 390A split between 2 controllers running a 19.25" OD wheel. The big wheel on your motor hurts too in a big way. Heat created in the windings goes up by current squared, so giving up a bit of launch torque pays big dividends in terms of heat. If you're a heavy person, then you also need to decrease current limits more than the small guys simply because high current is required for longer to accelerate to speed. I get hit by a double whammy of being large and living in a mountainous area with hill climbs on almost every ride. Lastly how you ride plays a big role in motor heat, with repetitive hard launches causing lots of waste heat, so if you don't have a temp sensor in the motor you'll have to learn what gets your motor hot at the controller setting you use to achieve absolute dependability.

[shortcircuit911]

@Ham, yeah it's a DNM shock.

@John, thanks for the reply. I have turned the phase current down from 350A to 250A, hopefully that does the trick.

I haven't really been riding much as the battery pack isn't huge, so I've been trying to make small parameter changes in the MQCON app. Like I said above, I have lowered the phase current to 250A, and I have also enabled regen, but haven't ridden it with regen yet. I'm waiting on some stainless hardware for the rear dropout clamps, we'll see how long that lasts with regen.

Since overheating the motor the other day I've been a bit paranoid so I ordered some statorade for now, then maybe hubsinks if heat is still an issue. When I took it off road in the gravel the other day rocks and dirt were going everywhere, so I ordered a front fender and number plate to give it a bit more of a dirtbike look. I will also start thinking about a rear fender for this thing as soon as the seat comes in. I got an email from EM3EV that my battery and seat shipped today so hopefully I'll see that next week.

[Ham]

Thanks, I've been holding off buying one as I wasn't sure of the bolt mount width...would suck to buy it and find it doesn't fit!

If you get a minute would you mind measuring how wide your rear shock mounts are on the inner face?

[shortcircuit911]

@ham width of inner walls of the mount is 23.6mm (probably wider initially but tightening bolts might have closed the gap).

So I made some progress this weekend. First I took the hub motor apart so that I could drill a hole in the side cover to inject the statorade when it arrives. I also conformal coated the inside of the hub side cover as well as RTV’d the side covers to the base so that the statorade won’t leak out. I tapped a 4mm hole on the side and cut down a 4mm socket head allen as the drain plug. It looks like some of the wire holding the windings in place broke and some of the windings were sitting a little low, maybe because it got hot? Who knows. 2 of the side cover screws were stripped so who knows, could be a QC issue. I think I see a QS205 on the horizon.

My front fender also came in so I made up a quick mount and drilled out the forks for the mount. It’s all made out of aluminum and light plastic, so not much weight was added. Still waiting in the front number plate and seat to come in. After i get the seat I’ll start looking for a back fender.

I got an email from EM3Ev with the tracking information for my battery and seat- looks like that will be here thursday. Hopefully I can get it all back together by the weekend.

[Ham]

Thank you. Off to find a dnm shock now:)

It looks to be coming together nicely. I finally sorted a power switch for mine in the form of an antispark xt90 loopring key. Now to wait on the new renthal bars and stem and I'm good for a peoper test run.

I still want to build a hubbie bike and you are adding fuel to that fire!

[shortcircuit911]

So I've made quite a bit of progress over the past few days. The staorade came in and I added 5mL to the hub and then installed the drain plug. I started seeing staroade on the carpet and immediately started looking for the leak. Of course, the cutout for the wiring on the axle. I put the hub on its side, cleaned it up and RTV'd around the wires coming out of the axle. All sealed up now, going to add probably 2 mL and see how that works out.

I received my rear fender (one of them) and got that mounted which took a little bit of time because I drilled and tapped the swing-arm to avoid using zip ties to mount it. This will just keep crap off the shock and some of the swing-arm. I will work out another fender option for the moto seat when it arrives. I was also able to borrow a chain breaker from my friend and got the chain installed - it's officially an 'ebike'.

Last bit of progress I was able to make was that I made my own torque arms. Really what they are is axle clamps/covers. I have a clamping bolt in the back that came with the frame. I then made the covers that cover the locking washer on the shaft that sits in the dropouts. The cover puts pressure on the washer keeping it engaged at all times. I also drilled 4 holes to help keep the dropouts from expanding/spinning out on hard accel/decel .

I made a mistake when reading the delivery date on my battery, it is actually coming this tuesday. Much more progress to come!

[Ham]

Coming together!

[SirLongAss]

How did you make those torque arm plates? Also, I find the moto seat that you can get from em3ev is a little uncomfortable after a long ride. I might end up welding a new seat frame for my electric enduro.



Something like this. It's from delfast but I already asked and they wouldn't sell me the seat.

[shortcircuit911]

@sirlongass, I made them on the mill pretty quickly. I Milled out a pocket on the back side so that I can still run the washers in the dropouts (they actually put pressure on the washer keeping it engaged in the dropouts) and the clamping bolt in the back of the swingarm. I just got my moto seat and I can see what you’re saying. Mine is a different bolt pattern, so I. going to lower it/move it back and reduce some of the angle. The seat frame is pretty shitty and basic. If it bugs me enough I’ll waterjet something and weld it up.

So I’ve been working on getting the battery mounted in the frame. I ended up ditching the internal battery tray that came with the frame. I’ll instead take that space up with foam for the battery to sit on. I initially wanted to have the controller on the inside of the frame, but it is just a bit too tight in there, and the weight is distributed much better with the controller mounted externally. I will end up making a skid plate/enclosure to protect the terminals of the controller and hide all the wiring.

The plan is to keep everything waterproof so that I can actually ride this thing like a true dirtbike if I so choose. I found some cool connectors on amazon that will allow me to pass wires through the frame while keeping everything sealed/maintaining a clean look.

I still need to figure out some of the cable routing and make a lot of final adjustments before taking this thing out for a real ride. I’ve really been taking my time with things and redoing previous work to get a cleaner look. Hopefully I can get this thing buttoned up this weekend to take it for a spin. I’m really curious to see how it is going to perform, because I haven’t ridden it with the new battery as well as the new parameters set through the bluetooth app.

Back with more.

[SirLongAss]

@sirlongass, I made them on the mill pretty quickly. I Milled out a pocket on the back side so that I can still run the washers in the dropouts (they actually put pressure on the washer keeping it engaged in the dropouts) and the clamping bolt in the back of the swingarm. I just got my moto seat and I can see what you’re saying. Mine is a different bolt pattern, so I. going to lower it/move it back and reduce some of the angle. The seat frame is pretty shitty and basic. If it bugs me enough I’ll waterjet something and weld it up.

So I’ve been working on getting the battery mounted in the frame. I ended up ditching the internal battery tray that came with the frame. I’ll instead take that space up with foam for the battery to sit on. I initially wanted to have the controller on the inside of the frame, but it is just a bit too tight in there, and the weight is distributed much better with the controller mounted externally. I will end up making a skid plate/enclosure to protect the terminals of the controller and hide all the wiring.

The plan is to keep everything waterproof so that I can actually ride this thing like a true dirtbike if I so choose. I found some cool connectors on amazon that will allow me to pass wires through the frame while keeping everything sealed/maintaining a clean look.

I still need to figure out some of the cable routing and make a lot of final adjustments before taking this thing out for a real ride. I’ve really been taking my time with things and redoing previous work to get a cleaner look. Hopefully I can get this thing buttoned up this weekend to take it for a spin. I’m really curious to see how it is going to perform, because I haven’t ridden it with the new battery as well as the new parameters set through the bluetooth app.

Back with more.

Nice! Wish I had a mill. As for waterproofing, I ride mine around in the wet mud and never really worry about it. Besides dropping it in a river, I think you'll be fine. Although you wont have worry about ever cleaning the inside if you do waterproof it.

Uh, dude. You're seat is on upside down. It looks like a pop can tab

[shortcircuit911]

@sirlongass, Shit, you're right, funny pic dude. I was going to rock it that way lol. I was going to use it for superman seat grabs (pic below). Flipped that sucker around and what do you know, fits slightly less shittier. Going to add some additional brackets and mounts to get the seat some more support as I moved it down and back.

So I had quite the interesting weekend with this thing. Friday night I came home from work and put the kid down so I could work late on the bike. I was able to get the seat adapters mounted on the frame. These are brackets that have the same bolt pattern as both the frame holes for the seat, and the holes in the seat frame (they're not the same distance apart). This involved some drilling, but that was no problem. I got the battery box all cleaned out and then started lining it with foam that came with the battery. I also used some RTV to hold the various pieces of foam together, just makes things easier. The battery has lots of padding and fits so nice in the battery bay. I made the custom cables needed to get the battery connected to the sabvoton. Got everything hooked back up, cool ready for a test ride.

The test ride. I noticed that the front suspension is such shit, I need to do something about it, but don't want to spend the money (bigger fish to fry, read on). The rebound is really aggressive and the bike is so heavy which doesn't help things. Anyway, I cruzed it to the skate park and check things out for a bit and decided to take off. The motor temp was warm but not too bad, I was pulling 3-5kw constant going to the skate park. There's a big hill leading out of the skate park,wanting to see what this thing can do I grab a hand full and headed up the hill. The bike was climbing (not awesome torque) and about half way up, I head a creak and lost all motor power. The TFT screen was showing error 07h and the sabvoton was blinking 13 times. I googled the blinks on the side of the trail and realized it was a hall issue, weird but ok let me swap them since it has two set. I do the swap and nothing, I'm getting the same error. Motor was scorching hot, so I thought maybe it was being thermally limited. I try and try, no go. So I did the unimaginable, I started pedaling, damn it was so hard, and it felt like there was motor resistance. So I did the walk of shame to the nearest grocery store and called the wife, and got a ride home. (Side note, the motor was hotter at the store than the side of the trail. wtf)

I was so bothered by this first real test ride when I got home. I parked the bike and started doing other things. Then I got so pissed that I took the damn thing apart again and opened up the wheel, stunk like shit! I definitely fried that damn thing (pics below). The temp got so hot in the motor that the yellow wire of the hall sensors de-soldered from the board. So I pulled the soldering iron out and quickly fixed it. Putting the motor back together I was like "why did this happen?" the motor has a temp sensor, cool. But, if you look at the hall connector coming out of the controller there is nothing connected to the white wire coming from the motor. WTF! I bought this from the same vendor and they "set everything up", should've known better. Does the 72150 not have a temp sensor input? There is the option in the app to limit temp.

Anyway, the bike runs and the performance is lower than I expected. This is probably because I don't have a QS205 V3, which is what I'm going to get. Anybody have a good vendor? I was going to go to aliexpress and try and get a motor and maybe some spokes, then have the bike shop do the swap (hopefully). This is going to be an expensive upgrade, but the bike is so lame to ride right now I have to do it. There is no torque, and the motor is getting way too hot for the little bashing I've done (haven't even gone off road). I'm going to start the search for that tomorrow.

CALLING ALL SABVOTON USERS:
I'm trying to get re-gen setup on the bike and have enabled it in the app. I also saw that there is an e-brake function to enable. What does that do?

Also, If you let off the throttle the bike still keeps going. Example: I picked up the rear wheel and hit the throttle a little, the wheel should've stopped spinning after a few seconds letting off the throttle, but the motor kept spinning like the throttle was on.

I noticed when riding I, I was pulling like 2,500w then let off, then the screen still said 300w and I could feel the bike still moving a bit. Not sure whats going on here, but I don't like it, need to figure it out.

[SirLongAss]

@sirlongass, Shit, you're right, funny pic dude. I was going to rock it that way lol. I was going to use it for superman seat grabs (pic below). Flipped that sucker around and what do you know, fits slightly less shittier. Going to add some additional brackets and mounts to get the seat some more support as I moved it down and back.

So I had quite the interesting weekend with this thing. Friday night I came home from work and put the kid down so I could work late on the bike. I was able to get the seat adapters mounted on the frame. These are brackets that have the same bolt pattern as both the frame holes for the seat, and the holes in the seat frame (they're not the same distance apart). This involved some drilling, but that was no problem. I got the battery box all cleaned out and then started lining it with foam that came with the battery. I also used some RTV to hold the various pieces of foam together, just makes things easier. The battery has lots of padding and fits so nice in the battery bay. I made the custom cables needed to get the battery connected to the sabvoton. Got everything hooked back up, cool ready for a test ride.

The test ride. I noticed that the front suspension is such shit, I need to do something about it, but don't want to spend the money (bigger fish to fry, read on). The rebound is really aggressive and the bike is so heavy which doesn't help things. Anyway, I cruzed it to the skate park and check things out for a bit and decided to take off. The motor temp was warm but not too bad, I was pulling 3-5kw constant going to the skate park. There's a big hill leading out of the skate park,wanting to see what this thing can do I grab a hand full and headed up the hill. The bike was climbing (not awesome torque) and about half way up, I head a creak and lost all motor power. The TFT screen was showing error 07h and the sabvoton was blinking 13 times. I googled the blinks on the side of the trail and realized it was a hall issue, weird but ok let me swap them since it has two set. I do the swap and nothing, I'm getting the same error. Motor was scorching hot, so I thought maybe it was being thermally limited. I try and try, no go. So I did the unimaginable, I started pedaling, damn it was so hard, and it felt like there was motor resistance. So I did the walk of shame to the nearest grocery store and called the wife, and got a ride home. (Side note, the motor was hotter at the store than the side of the trail. wtf)

I was so bothered by this first real test ride when I got home. I parked the bike and started doing other things. Then I got so pissed that I took the damn thing apart again and opened up the wheel, stunk like shit! I definitely fried that damn thing (pics below). The temp got so hot in the motor that the yellow wire of the hall sensors de-soldered from the board. So I pulled the soldering iron out and quickly fixed it. Putting the motor back together I was like "why did this happen?" the motor has a temp sensor, cool. But, if you look at the hall connector coming out of the controller there is nothing connected to the white wire coming from the motor. WTF! I bought this from the same vendor and they "set everything up", should've known better. Does the 72150 not have a temp sensor input? There is the option in the app to limit temp.

Anyway, the bike runs and the performance is lower than I expected. This is probably because I don't have a QS205 V3, which is what I'm going to get. Anybody have a good vendor? I was going to go to aliexpress and try and get a motor and maybe some spokes, then have the bike shop do the swap (hopefully). This is going to be an expensive upgrade, but the bike is so lame to ride right now I have to do it. There is no torque, and the motor is getting way too hot for the little bashing I've done (haven't even gone off road). I'm going to start the search for that tomorrow.

CALLING ALL SABVOTON USERS:
I'm trying to get re-gen setup on the bike and have enabled it in the app. I also saw that there is an e-brake function to enable. What does that do?

Also, If you let off the throttle the bike still keeps going. Example: I picked up the rear wheel and hit the throttle a little, the wheel should've stopped spinning after a few seconds letting off the throttle, but the motor kept spinning like the throttle was on.

I noticed when riding I, I was pulling like 2,500w then let off, then the screen still said 300w and I could feel the bike still moving a bit. Not sure whats going on here, but I don't like it, need to figure it out.

Holy shit! Let's break this down.

Now when you say, you where pulling 3-5kw and have no torque. Doesn't that mean you're only running the controller at 40-80amps? If you want full torque, you gotta push it to 150 battery amps and 150 con, 350 max phase amps.

Have you done the hall angle test? This is very importaint!

Yes the sabaton has a temp sensor but you have to make sure its getting temp reading by looking at the app.

If you want a good vender, you can but straight from QS motor on aliexpress.
https://www.aliexpress.com/store/produc ... 2086dpijS2

E-brake turns the motor into a generator(which creates a engine braking kinda deal). This must be enabled to use regen braking. Remember! Regen braking creates HEAT! This is why I don't even bother with it.

The throttle issue sounds like you have the throttle min voltage set to low. Turn on the bike and look at the app to see what voltage your throttle is at without touching it, then change the throttle min voltage to slightly higher then that.

[shortcircuit911]

Dude you nailed it. So the issue was the hall test. When I wired up the bike the motor spun fine so I never did the hall test. As a result I think the although the motor ran it ran very inefficiently causing lots of heat. One I ran the hall test I hit the throttle and the wheel spun backwards, so I changed direction in the app, all was good.

Lesson of the day: Do your hall tests kids

You were also right about the throttle issue. I did what you said and it worked like a charm. FWIW, the standing voltage was 1.13 (I think) and I set it to 1.15. Throttle response is perfect and it's not doing that weird shit it was doing where it would keep going.

I hopped on it at 10pm last night and ripped down the street! This was the performance I was expecting. No wheelies(felt close), but there's a few more phase amps to squeeze out of it, so we'll see. I'm going to book it home after work and take the kid to the park on the bikes, going to rip it up and get a better idea of performance.

THANK YOU LONGASS!

I also heard back from QS and it's going to be $500 to get the motor laced into a 19" wheel and sent here. Not cheap, but not terrible either. Its $70 to lace it into a wheel, I think that's still cheaper than the bike shop pulling the hub out of a rim and re-lacing it with the QS. I'm going to hold off for a bit, especially since the bike is performing like it should.

Going to tackle properly mounting the seat and making and enclosure for the bottom. Back with more

[SirLongAss]

Dude you nailed it. So the issue was the hall test. When I wired up the bike the motor spun fine so I never did the hall test. As a result I think the although the motor ran it ran very inefficiently causing lots of heat. One I ran the hall test I hit the throttle and the wheel spun backwards, so I changed direction in the app, all was good.

Lesson of the day: Do your hall tests kids

You were also right about the throttle issue. I did what you said and it worked like a charm. FWIW, the standing voltage was 1.13 (I think) and I set it to 1.15. Throttle response is perfect and it's not doing that weird shit it was doing where it would keep going.

I hopped on it at 10pm last night and ripped down the street! This was the performance I was expecting. No wheelies(felt close), but there's a few more phase amps to squeeze out of it, so we'll see. I'm going to book it home after work and take the kid to the park on the bikes, going to rip it up and get a better idea of performance.

THANK YOU LONGASS!

I also heard back from QS and it's going to be $500 to get the motor laced into a 19" wheel and sent here. Not cheap, but not terrible either. Its $70 to lace it into a wheel, I think that's still cheaper than the bike shop pulling the hub out of a rim and re-lacing it with the QS. I'm going to hold off for a bit, especially since the bike is performing like it should.

Going to tackle properly mounting the seat and making and enclosure for the bottom. Back with more

No problem man. Sorry to see you toasted your motor a bit.

[rumme]

Ive got $3000 in this build. I tuned the controller down so it only does a max speed of around 45 mph..which is plenty for me....I weigh 230 lbs and am 6ft 5 inchs tall. I also toned down the phase amps, so it has adequate torque, but not so much as to overheat the motor.

I mounted my controller under the seat, then made a air duct out of PVC square rain gutter to flow air over the controller and keep it cool. I fully recomeend the LYEN sensorless controller because ive been using it for over a year now, and it works perfectly. No need to worry about those silly hall wires anymore.

[rumme]

I can run mine at 3kw continuous and its fine...and it does 5kw bursts, no problem. I went with tubless tire setup and love it....sealed the rims up with gorilla tape so they wont leak and then made my own tire slime using :


large ground up black pepper

cornstarch

hot water


seals up any holes quickly. Ive had 4 ebikes and this one is my favorite......happy with every aspect of it.

[SirLongAss]

Ive got $3000 in this build. I tuned the controller down so it only does a max speed of around 45 mph..which is plenty for me....I weigh 230 lbs and am 6ft 5 inchs tall. I also toned down the phase amps, so it has adequate torque, but not so much as to overheat the motor.

I mounted my controller under the seat, then made a air duct out of PVC square rain gutter to flow air over the controller and keep it cool. I fully recomeend the LYEN sensorless controller because ive been using it for over a year now, and it works perfectly. No need to worry about those silly hall wires anymore.

Holy $hit! Didn't know the green giant was into ebikes(I mean this is the nicest of ways, I'm a manlet). I noticed you have to use every inch of the steering tube to accommodate your size and I wanted to ask if you thought about putting some spacers to keep you from snapping it. I've read and seen one of my friends break their tube when it was set up like that. It seems to happen when you get rough with it.

[rumme]

Ive got $3000 in this build. I tuned the controller down so it only does a max speed of around 45 mph..which is plenty for me....I weigh 230 lbs and am 6ft 5 inchs tall. I also toned down the phase amps, so it has adequate torque, but not so much as to overheat the motor.

I mounted my controller under the seat, then made a air duct out of PVC square rain gutter to flow air over the controller and keep it cool. I fully recomeend the LYEN sensorless controller because ive been using it for over a year now, and it works perfectly. No need to worry about those silly hall wires anymore.

Holy $hit! Didn't know the green giant was into ebikes(I mean this is the nicest of ways, I'm a manlet). I noticed you have to use every inch of the steering tube to accommodate your size and I wanted to ask if you thought about putting some spacers to keep you from snapping it. I've read and seen one of my friends break their tube when it was set up like that. It seems to happen when you get rough with it.

Im already using spacers..several of them, you just cant tell in the photo. Luckily I do not use the ebike to ride in very harsh conditions or do jumps, wheelies, etc.

[SirLongAss]

Ive got $3000 in this build. I tuned the controller down so it only does a max speed of around 45 mph..which is plenty for me....I weigh 230 lbs and am 6ft 5 inchs tall. I also toned down the phase amps, so it has adequate torque, but not so much as to overheat the motor.

I mounted my controller under the seat, then made a air duct out of PVC square rain gutter to flow air over the controller and keep it cool. I fully recomeend the LYEN sensorless controller because ive been using it for over a year now, and it works perfectly. No need to worry about those silly hall wires anymore.

Holy $hit! Didn't know the green giant was into ebikes(I mean this is the nicest of ways, I'm a manlet). I noticed you have to use every inch of the steering tube to accommodate your size and I wanted to ask if you thought about putting some spacers to keep you from snapping it. I've read and seen one of my friends break their tube when it was set up like that. It seems to happen when you get rough with it.

Im already using spacers..several of them, you just cant tell in the photo. Luckily I do not use the ebike to ride in very harsh conditions or do jumps, wheelies, etc.

My bad then.