Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
ScooterMan101   10 MW

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Joined: Oct 06 2012 4:45pm
Location: South of San Jose, California.

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by ScooterMan101 » Jul 29 2018 1:39pm

The one I linked to was a 24 volt one, good for charging one battery at a time
( or two with parallel charge cable or parallel charge board )

The two that motomech mentions are good for charging 2 packs in series at a time,
when I just went back to the website and looked into it more ...
the 48A and the 54A are about the same price as the 24A
Interesting Pricing, but that is good for the Buyer ... US.
So
That would be a better option , to charge two batteries at the same time,
now you would just pick the amount of watts it is capable of charging at , that fits your budget.
For example the 240 watt 54 volt one is $ 64.10
But for faster charging the 320 watt 54 volt one is $ 93.20
big price jump for 80 more watts ( 40 watts per pack ) of charging.
My first conversion ... Sold

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=71378&p=1077497&hil ... 1#p1077497

It's 2018 already, ( now 2019 ) lets get some real , improved e-bike / e-velomobile / e-motorcycle designs .

FlyByNight   1 mW

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Joined: May 30 2016 5:04pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by FlyByNight » Jul 29 2018 4:01pm

Adding Mean Well P.S. to the load will get very heavy. Remember, I'm not on a Motor Cycle or anything of the sort. I'm riding a recumbent Trike over 12,000KM with my daughter so I desperately need to keep the weight down. She is only able to tow about 30lbs (She'll be 10) and I can tow approx 100-120 lbs. For 12,000km+ that's not really a lot of weight. I get how amazing these Mean Wells are, but they are heavy when using more than 1 and they are also an awkward size to be carrying 12,000KM. I don't understand why I would need one. I currently use my iCharger 4010 DUO plugged right into my wall socket and it charged my 8 Turnigy Batteries, at the same time, without issue. I guess I need to do a little more research into the Mean Wells.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the higher the C Rating the faster the batteries drain? Wouldn't that mean I want the lowest C Rating possible? Although I do now understand that 10C would be too little. My old batteries were 20C (30C Peak). I'd have to double check but I am pretty sure my lipos charged at 2C with my current charger. Those lipos, by the way, lasted me 4 years and they were in use for 2 years before I bought the Trike. So the Turnigy 5S 5000mAh 20C lasted just over 6 years.

I only need a Battery Medic. I already have a CA 2.4. I just wish the CA had a larger screen so all could be seen at the same time without having to scroll screens.

I have no idea what an "Opportunity Charger" even is. I've never even heard that term used before. Also, I'm confused about recommending Turnigy over MultiStar.... MultiStar "IS" Turnigy ....... Turnigy is what I used before and they lasted a VERY long time. Being that MultiStar is made by Turnigy this is what made me think about moving to them as well as the high mAh capacity.

Range is definitely the goal here. My Trike already goes a speed of, at least, 50KM/h without being full throttle. That in itself is more than enough (Too much in my opinion. I'd be happy with 35-40KM/h). Some distances between cities will exceed 300KM so I want to be sure I have enough power to assist me.

On a Happy Side Note, I think I found both cables needed to connect the CA2.4 & MOSFET Lyen Controller to my computer. Now here's to hoping it will work with Linux else I will have to take it to a friends house as there are no "Windows" computers in my house, lol.

I've thought about building my own batteries, but I'd need to do a lot more research to learn a lot more before I would trust myself doing that.

I ride a recumbent Trike. I don't have the room to mount multiple Mean Wells.

I'm going to have to research and see if I can alter the Lyen MOSFET Controller I have. I'm not even entirely sure the setup of it nor what it is rated for in A. These MultiStars so come in 10C, 15C, 25C, etc.... They're not just strictly 10C only. Which is good. After learning about teh C Rating here from all the great comments I searched more and found the higher C rating MultiStars with the same high mAh.

ScooterMan101   10 MW

10 MW
Posts: 2032
Joined: Oct 06 2012 4:45pm
Location: South of San Jose, California.

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by ScooterMan101 » Jul 29 2018 4:48pm

You have made a couple of simple mistakes that I will help clear up.

1) Your iCharger 4010 Duo is a DC charger , meaning it needs a DC source to use. I am looking at the specifications here ..
https://www.progressiverc.com/icharger-4010duo.html
If it was a AC and DC charger you could plug it into any socket along your route.
But to use it you will need a Power Supply , and right now the Meanwells look best.
( other than modyfing a HP Server P.S. like the one or two I linked to above ).

Now to use it with a solar panel it , Might , be fine , that is if the input DC voltage can handle the Solar Panel DC output.
However ... as others have pointed out here, that charger would probably be rattled to its Death ! on such a ride. ( I have a AC charger that was destroyed in just two rides, and I even wrapped a shirt around it to try and lessen shock to it )
So although it is a great charger for home , $ 350 is allot of money to loose when it's circuit board/Solder is destroyed by all the vibration and shocks of a Road trip.

2) The higher the C rating of a Lipo Battery the lower its internal resistance, and more amps can be drawn from it safely. And the longer it's life span will be at moderate and higher amp draw's.
You say that you do not need high amps, but when you start going up hills, especially with a Daughter and Camping Gear you , Are , going to be using a higher amp draw from the motor and often.

So do you really want to take a gamble on destroying a $ 350 dollar charger
or
Just use a Mean Well , or other RC battery charger ?

Here is a good DC charger that is the new one out and has allot of features and has a wide range of DC input and a large Amp/Watt output to charge your batteries.
https://alofthobbies.com/isdt-t8-smart-charger.html ( will charge up to 8 cell packs )
or for up to 6 cell packs
https://alofthobbies.com/isdt-t6-smart-charger.html
My first conversion ... Sold

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=71378&p=1077497&hil ... 1#p1077497

It's 2018 already, ( now 2019 ) lets get some real , improved e-bike / e-velomobile / e-motorcycle designs .

FlyByNight   1 mW

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Posts: 12
Joined: May 30 2016 5:04pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by FlyByNight » Jul 30 2018 7:49pm

ScooterMan101 wrote:
Jul 29 2018 4:48pm
You have made a couple of simple mistakes that I will help clear up.

1) Your iCharger 4010 Duo is a DC charger , meaning it needs a DC source to use. I am looking at the specifications here ..
https://www.progressiverc.com/icharger-4010duo.html
If it was a AC and DC charger you could plug it into any socket along your route.
But to use it you will need a Power Supply , and right now the Meanwells look best.
( other than modyfing a HP Server P.S. like the one or two I linked to above ).

Now to use it with a solar panel it , Might , be fine , that is if the input DC voltage can handle the Solar Panel DC output.
However ... as others have pointed out here, that charger would probably be rattled to its Death ! on such a ride. ( I have a AC charger that was destroyed in just two rides, and I even wrapped a shirt around it to try and lessen shock to it )
So although it is a great charger for home , $ 350 is allot of money to loose when it's circuit board/Solder is destroyed by all the vibration and shocks of a Road trip.

2) The higher the C rating of a Lipo Battery the lower its internal resistance, and more amps can be drawn from it safely. And the longer it's life span will be at moderate and higher amp draw's.
You say that you do not need high amps, but when you start going up hills, especially with a Daughter and Camping Gear you , Are , going to be using a higher amp draw from the motor and often.

So do you really want to take a gamble on destroying a $ 350 dollar charger
or
Just use a Mean Well , or other RC battery charger ?

Here is a good DC charger that is the new one out and has allot of features and has a wide range of DC input and a large Amp/Watt output to charge your batteries.
https://alofthobbies.com/isdt-t8-smart-charger.html ( will charge up to 8 cell packs )
or for up to 6 cell packs
https://alofthobbies.com/isdt-t6-smart-charger.html
Your post had me confused so I had to go look and as it turns out the 4010 DUO I have has it's own PS box... It's been so long since I used it that I actually forgot and was thinking of an older charger I had before this one. What the charger is using is a Junsi S1200. It came with it when I bought the charger (used, but new to me).

The solar panel option was an idea I had in hopes of not having to take a charger with me, but the more I research it the more I think that may only be viable for the schematic I posted above for all my lights and such.

I don't remember saying I didn't need higher Amps. I'm just trying to stress to people that it is " not " speed I am looking for in relation to obtaining batteries with high mAh, but rather I am looking to get more distance. My current setup (If my batteries weren't depleted) can get me to 50KM/h which is already too fast. I'm hoping with more research I can learn how to limit the top speed, but maintain the distance.

I'm not towing my daughter, just a trailer. She has her own Trike to ride with her own trailer. I was just pointing out the weight. She can pull about 30lbs in her trailer and me about 100 in mine. Although there will be a LOT of hills and a fair bit of mountains with VERY steep grades. I will likely use the motor to assist me. The motor won't be used consistently. There may even be times where I don't use it for days on end. I cannot say for sure.

Sadly, Mean Wells seem to be the lightest out of all the P.S. (from my research so far) even though they are heavy in their own right. Looks like I may need to get one after-all. Here's to hoping I can get just one and be ok.

Would I not need to have higher than a 8 cell charger if I plan to parallel charge? If I decide to go with the MultiStar's or equivalent in mAh then I will be charging 2 or 3 6S per channel. when charging in parallel doesn't that make it a 12S per channel?

Thankfully I have time to figure all of this out. Then it will also be much easier to apply it all to my daughters trike too although her batteries do not have as much mAh as she doesn't need assistance with pedalling like I do. I only set hers up because I am "assuming" she will need help in the Rocky Mountains, but I might be wrong.

ScooterMan101   10 MW

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Joined: Oct 06 2012 4:45pm
Location: South of San Jose, California.

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by ScooterMan101 » Jul 31 2018 7:49am

You can parallel charge 2 , 3 , 4, 5, 6 batteries at a time by using

1) parallel charge cable made by you , together with a JST-XH parallel charge cable
https://www.progressiverc.com/parallel- ... apter.html
Note: if parallel charging more than two batteries at a time, the above linked to parallel xt60 adaptor will not work, for 3 or more you should make your own , or buy a 4 into one if they are available and just use 3 of the cable/connectors on that side of the adaptor cable.
Also
Sometimes parallel adaptor cables do not come with the connectors that your Red and Black Charge/Discharge battery cable connectors have , so just cut off the ones that come with the adaptor cable and solder on the matching connectors for your batteries.
you will also need a parallel JST-XH balance adaptor cable, something like this.
https://www.progressiverc.com/parallel- ... apter.html
or
2) a parallel charge board , like this ...
https://alofthobbies.com/six-port-fused ... board.html

Important : all the batteries need to be the same size like 6s or whatever , and the same mAh size of battery.

On a long trip , both you and your daughter ( both bikes ) will benefit from having a motor , often the people who try such trips and who do not use electric assist wind up injuring their knee or both knees .
My first conversion ... Sold

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=71378&p=1077497&hil ... 1#p1077497

It's 2018 already, ( now 2019 ) lets get some real , improved e-bike / e-velomobile / e-motorcycle designs .

billvon   1 GW

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Location: san diego

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by billvon » Jul 31 2018 7:27pm

ScooterMan101 wrote:
Jul 31 2018 7:49am
Important : all the batteries need to be the same size like 6s or whatever , and the same mAh size of battery.
And they need to be at roughly the same state of charge.
--bill von

ScooterMan101   10 MW

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Joined: Oct 06 2012 4:45pm
Location: South of San Jose, California.

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by ScooterMan101 » Jul 31 2018 8:44pm

To ensure that my Batteries are at roughly the same state of charge I keep two packs taped together all the time ( 2 6s packs ) or for faster speed days ( 2 7s packs ) ( plus another 2 6s packs and another 2 7s packs taped together )
then parallel charge those two taped together packs at the same time.

You can label the packs 1 & 2 , then for another 2 packs 3 & 4 and so on for how many packs you have .

Always charging packs 1 & 2 together and the 3 & 4 packs together when parallel charging.

With a big enough Power Supply and Charger you could charge and discharge four packs together or even 6 so that they are always the same state of charge.

That way they always charge to the same state of charge and discharge the same.
My first conversion ... Sold

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=71378&p=1077497&hil ... 1#p1077497

It's 2018 already, ( now 2019 ) lets get some real , improved e-bike / e-velomobile / e-motorcycle designs .

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MadRhino   100 GW

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Location: Montreal QC Canada

Re: Lipo Battery Help + Solar Charging

Post by MadRhino » Aug 01 2018 2:52pm

I always been bulk charging. With low resistance lipo I can charge in 7 minutes. 8)

If I would be leaving for a long trip and had to charge on the road, I would fit a Cycle Satiator charger on the bike.
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.
Current bikes
Street:
Trek Session 10 mod. Variable geometry. 70mph
Dirt:
Santa Cruz V10. 50mph

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