TDSZ2 : Motor Hall Sensors replacement (originally Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?)

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pagaille   10 mW

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Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

TDSZ2 : Motor Hall Sensors replacement (originally Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?)

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 8:23am

Hi,

I need help to understand what's wrong with my motor who died during a maintenance. 🙁 It's a TSDZ2 running the Opensource-Ebike-Firmware 1.0.

What's wrong ?
Motor doesn't work anymore : it emits a small buzz but doesn't turn. It makes a somewhat louder 'tick' when cutting power. When pedalling or activating the Walk mode, the display soon shows "3 : Torque Fault"
(NB : Actually the display is corrupted on the SW102 (line too long) but I was able to guess the error message by looking at the code)

What did I do ?
I added a temperature sensor, which is working perfectly. I had no particular issue while soldering the wires.
I didn't dismantled the axle containing the torque sensor, only the chainring.
Everything is correctly connected, I double checked. The motors turns freely.

Possible causes
During the operation I removed the motor to check the blue gear state. I had an issue while screwing back the three wires : I overtightened one of the three screws and broke the thread. I installed a bigger screw but it turned out that the new one was a bit too long and was touching the metal case. I thought it could be the reason (one phase missing) but fixing the problem didn't helped.
Maybe the controller is fried ? I'm not sure that the motor case is connected to the ground.
I don't understand how and why the Torque sensor could be wrong. Moreover, the error messages is also displayed as soon as I activate the Walk mode.

What could I do to further diagnose that problem ?

Thanks for your help.

Matthieu
Last edited by pagaille on Jul 30 2020 4:03pm, edited 1 time in total.

vass   10 mW

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Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by vass » Jul 30 2020 8:40am

can you put stock firmware back just to check?

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
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Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 8:43am

Sure, but that’s a somewhat tedious task. Maybe there will be other ideas before I try that ?

jtsavola   1 mW

1 mW
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Joined: Mar 23 2019 3:41am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by jtsavola » Jul 30 2020 9:58am

My motor stopped giving power. Reason was black and red wires coming from torque disk to controller were broken in the root of the disk. Both wires were broken so I think for any reason disk has rotated in place and cutted wires. I soldered wires back. After reassembling motor worked again. This is quite easy to check after opening controller cover and pulling lightly the wires. Or better by unplugging connector and measuring there is no resistance between black and red wires

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
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Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 10:01am

Nice tip. Let me check.

casainho   10 GW

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Joined: Feb 14 2011 2:43pm

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by casainho » Jul 30 2020 10:14am

That error name is not correct on the firmware, must be corrected.

Error numbers 3 happens because the motor is pulling current but not rotating, it is blocked. Maybe the hall sensors connector has any issue?? Check the hall sensor signal on the advanced Technical menu.
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of OpenSource knowledge and technology for ebikes: Wireless Ebike boar ANT+ and Bluetooth, Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation to help my developments: paypal.me/jorgecasa

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
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Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 11:05am

jtsavola wrote:
Jul 30 2020 9:58am
My motor stopped giving power. Reason was black and red wires coming from torque disk to controller were broken in the root of the disk.
I measure 2,7 ohms. I guess the sensor is electrically ok. Thanks anyway.

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 24
Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 11:10am

casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2020 10:14am
Error numbers 3 happens because the motor is pulling current but not rotating, it is blocked. Maybe the hall sensors connector has any issue?? Check the hall sensor signal on the advanced Technical menu.
Spot on. The display shows somewhat random numbers between 5 and 7. Sometimes 4 appears too. Let’s dismantle it to understand what’s wrong.

Thanks !

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 24
Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 11:34am

casainho wrote:
Jul 30 2020 10:14am
That error name is not correct on the firmware, must be corrected.
This is how it appears : https://nextcloud.gaillet.be/index.php/ ... q47M2Jy27t

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 24
Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 2:46pm

So the hall sensor has indeed a problem.

I tested using the method provided on this thread : viewtopic.php?f=3&t=105444&p=1543436&hi ... l#p1543566

Image

With the sensor connected to the controller I measure voltages either 0 V or +5V between the black wire and the green or yellow wire, depending on the rotation, but not on the blue wire which stays high. The latter looks ok from the outside.

Any advice ? Should I buy a new motor ? Is it even doable to replace one of those sensors ?

pagaille   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 24
Joined: Apr 16 2020 7:55am

Re: TDSZ2 : Error 3 "Torque Fault" ?

Post by pagaille » Jul 30 2020 4:02pm

Update. Found the hall sensors that are actually mounted just beside the screw power terminals behind a black silicon paste.

Here are some pictures. I tried to resolder the joints without success.
51910AC4-6E10-4103-A8B1-A543D2DCEA46-8292-000001F05666C4F9.jpg
51910AC4-6E10-4103-A8B1-A543D2DCEA46-8292-000001F05666C4F9.jpg (166.03 KiB) Viewed 65 times
24553166-9943-42DC-AA83-C6CDB6A0009C-8292-000001F0BC921562.jpg
24553166-9943-42DC-AA83-C6CDB6A0009C-8292-000001F0BC921562.jpg (276.02 KiB) Viewed 65 times
That PCB is really small and looks glued to the plastic support. Chances are that any tentative to replace the defective hall sensor will break everything.

I'll try to find a replacement PCB or assembly, but I'm not very optimistic. Maybe someone with a fried motor but working sensors assy would sell it to me ?

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