Exactly which " Oil Cooled Motor" is used in MotoE World Cup?

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DogDipstick   10 kW

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Exactly which " Oil Cooled Motor" is used in MotoE World Cup?

Post by DogDipstick » Feb 23 2021 6:43am

Anybody know more? Where can I learn more? These things just blow me away for some reason. The Energica Ego. I have never seen one in person, not anything close really. I mean, can you buy them? How long til bikes like this are in the consumer market for a reasonable price?

Thankyou if you have any info. It has always intrigued me how they ca fit 160 BHP (120 kW) in a package so small. Here I am trying to shave a 10 kW bike down under 100 lbs and strugglein.. here they achieve:

Top speed 245 km/h
Power 107 kW
Torque 200 N⋅m
in a Power to Weight ration of 258–280 kg.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MotoE_World_Cup


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energica_Ego
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mxlemming   100 W

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Re: Exactly which " Oil Cooled Motor" is used in MotoE World Cup?

Post by mxlemming » Feb 26 2021 8:27am

It's a custom motor, if you google about, there are engineering reports about a company prototyping the caseworks etc. It is also huge.

You can get a LOT more power out of a motor if you pump oil through the entire thing and take the hot oil out and push it through a radiator. The oil can cool the stator, and if you seal and watertight the whole thing, it can cool the rotor as well. Just like a car engine has oil flowing around the cranks and pistons.

Oil rather than water because it's non conductive and non corrosive.

Then, pay more money for more batteries (12kWhour pack... 107kW is only ~9C discharge rate).
Then pay more money for bigger magnets and thinner laminations
And more money for more, higher spec MOSFETs/IGBTs
Spend ages debugging, optimising software etc

Then for 258kg, which is about 200kg more than a typical looney ebike that can push 10kW, you get a lot more space and weight. 200kg of batteries and motors gets you a lot of power.

Basically, pay more money and only build a few of them carefully tuned = can do better than average Joe fiddling in his garage.

mxlemming   100 W

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Re: Exactly which " Oil Cooled Motor" is used in MotoE World Cup?

Post by mxlemming » Feb 26 2021 8:37am

I have a street triple motorbike in my garage. It weighs about 175kg, of which about half is engine and fuel tank. So take them out, it's about 85kg (ish).
258 for the Ego thing-85kG for frame etc gives about 175kg for motor and batteries, very roughly.

11.7kWh pack is about 70kg, extrapolating from my 450Wh pack of 39 x 30Q cells which weighs about 2kg.
So you're left with 105kg for motor and controller.

Consider a QS205 hubmotor weighs about 15kG and a Sabvoton to go with it weighs another 1kg or so. ~16kg of motor and controller. That can push 5-12kW (say 10kW for ease) depending how you're counting, who you ask... And it's not exactly high tech, optimised cutting edge stuff.

107/10=10.1x the power of loonyebike, so if you simply add 10x sabvoton and QS motor, you get another 160kG

So you only have to improve on Sabvoton/QS by ~40%, which once you take away the overhead of 10 axles, spoke mounts, 10casings...

So it's a shit ton of work, and very impressive, but it's also a problem you can easily see your way through if you have a spare million dollars to play with.

HughF   100 W

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Re: Exactly which " Oil Cooled Motor" is used in MotoE World Cup?

Post by HughF » Feb 26 2021 10:58am

Energica bikes are available to purchase here in the UK, and I believe we can now get the 20kWh version. Coupled with Ccs, this is the machine to beat, at least for us Europeans where ccs is the norm now. Zero need to move away from their 100v packs and get up into the ccs voltage range if they want to compete in the UK market.
Genesis iOiD Alfine8 Hard tail MTB, 36v TSDZ2, 13s battery, SW102 display
Raleigh reynolds road frame from the 80's, TSDZ2, SW102 display, 1x10 drivetrain, gravel tyres

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